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There wasn’t as much disruption to the pattern / racecourses as some seem to believe.
…And it wasn’t as one-sided as others believe.QEII was always a Group 1 at Ascot.
Champion Stakes was always a Group 1 but at Newmarket. However, the Group 1 Fillies Mile went in the other direction. It used to be on the same card as the QEII but (and other two year old Group races) moved from Ascot to Newmarket.
Champion Sprint was always at Ascot, the Group 2 Diadem remained Group 2 when transferred to Champions Day. Only once the standard achieved became of Group 1 standard was it changed to a Group 1.
Champion Fillies And Mares was also originally at Ascot as the Group 3 Princess Royal when Ouija Board was perhaps its best known winner in 2005. It was moved to Newmarket in 2008 becoming a Group 2 and renamed the Pride Stakes. Coming back to Ascot still as a Group 2 in 2011. First winner was Oaks heroine Dancing Rain but could only manage 3rd the following year behind Saphire and Shirrocco Star. The race became Group 1 in 2013.
Long Distance Cup came from Newmarket, Jockey Club Cup had several illustrious winners including 5 times in a row the wonderful Further Flight and three times winner (one of my all time favourites) Persian Punch. Group 1 winners Millenary and Celeric also victorious in the then Group 3. Once transferred to Ascot the Group 3 Long Distance Cup winners were all Group 1 winners; 2011 Fame And Glory, 2012 Rite Of Passage and 2013 Royal Diamond. In 2014 it had earned its elevation to Group 2 (and truthfully more), but remains Group 2 today… Probably not because the standard is below Group 1 but because France objects to it becoming Group 1, worried it’ll deplete the Royal Oak field. If I remember rightly the Group 1 french race for stayers has sometimes been held on the same day / weekend.
Value Is EverythingLong Distance Cup ought to be Group 1 and is in all but name – it has Group 1 conditions, namely no penalties for winning a Group 1.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"To finish the season with a bang and have a worthy “Champions Day”, it obviously needed top class Sprint, Mile and middle distance races. Could argue the top class fillies and mares could enhance the Champion Stakes itself; but probably only the 2018 winner Magical would’ve had much chance in the Champion itself. Fillie And Mares providing a good end of season target for the female middle-distance stayers (12f rather than 10f f&m); at a time without alternative engagements other than the Arc.
Ascot already had the QEII and Diadem. Newmarket with the Champion Stakes and Jockey Club Cup the only other alternative for a Champions Day without wholesale changes, but Newmarket already had a busy schedule at that time of year including three top two year old races, Cheiveley Park, Middle Park and Dewhurst. Much better sense to have the “Champions Day” at Ascot and “Future Champions” (double) Weekend/s at Newmarket. Fillies Mile, Royal Lodge and Cornwallis (is there one I’ve forgotten?) all two year old Group races moving from Ascot to Newmarket.
Value Is EverythingWell it’s been a poor flat season over here, so yea we sent a load of old crap stateside and some beat a bunch of no hopers. Yibir what a joke won a joke of a race at York, then belmont and then onto del-mar.
Tarnawa and Audarya sorry but while watching i thought frank spencer was riding.
The majority of Godolphins horses are handicappers winning poor group races. I’m sure you’ll all disagree just like all British M P’S i don’t care.
Oh and good to see more cheap stable staff comming across the channel.
The Champion Stakes was moved from Newmarket to Ascot because the latter venue was deemed better for Champions Day. Ascot gets larger crowds and is easier to get to from London with direct trains from Waterloo stopping near the course. It is also better for the London centric media.
I like the Rowley Mile a lot. I think it is a great sight and it can be quite atmospheric on a misty autumn day. However, if you were designing a Group 1 racecourse from scratch, you would not put it in a small town with a tiny railway station which is little more than a halt. Even on the likes of 2,000 Guineas day, the Rowley Mile does not get the crowds.
It is a pity because I quite enjoyed the old Champions Day at Newmarket but commercial considerations were always going to win out. I would prefer it if the Champion Stakes was still run at Newmarket – it was one of my favourite races of the year with some great memories. But realistically, moving the race to Ascot made sense.
Any mods fancy deleting the north/south nonsense or moving it to a different thread if possible?
Another thread derailed by the usual suspects
I still can’t believe there is still a debate about champions day
It’s been a huge success at exactly the right venue
I went to champions stakes day at Newmarket too. I like it there too but for all the reasons cork states, but it’s not the right venue (except perhaps strong chance of good ground)
It simply did not have any sense of occasion.
Del Mar: The Breeders’ Cup rocks. Looked brilliant, and btw I’d like an all-Group 1 card at Chester, I’d travel North for it, Newmarket is the biggest case of “The Emperor’s New Clothes” in UK Flat racing – dire viewing track.
Champions Day at Ascot: Best day’s racing I ever went to the other week. Ascot is the best Flat racecourse in Britain. End of.
Clivexx might be a slightly more extreme libertarian version of Alan B’Stard, and the last man on the planet you’d accuse of being “Woke,” but he’s talking a lot of sense on this one.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"I completely agree Clive + Ian in that moving away from Newmarket has worked well.
As for The Breeders Cup it is something that I’ve not really warmed to at all
FF,
Sorry but a thread called “Does anyone care about the breeders cup?” was almost certain to bring up a comparison with our own end of season Champions Day and its good and bad points.Are you suggesting we should not be allowed to compare the Breeders Cup with Champions Day?
If the answer to that question is yes we should be allowed then: If someone does write about what he/she feels is wrong with Champions Day should we not then be allowed to challenge what they say? Because that is what happened here.In explaining an opinion one TRFer is almost bound to introduce something that other TRFers wish to write about and then the reply has another issue someone else wants to comment on… Just like this thread has.
Are you asking that each thread is restricted to such a small subject matter as to stop the thread developing? TRFers may decide then to restrict their answers of the OP’s question to a simple yes or no.
Yes, if someone brings up a completely different subject – where there is no posting line that links it – then that is wrong. But I don’t think anyone is deliberately changing the subject here.
TRFers are happy to see threads developing in a way they want them to, but unhappy if developing in a way they do not want. I too get frustrated when part of a thread goes off on a slight tangent that I have no interest in, but is that not the nature of debate?
Sorry if I’ve contributed to a part of this thread not meeting your standards, FF; but Can you not just ignore those posts you’re not interested in, like many of us do?
Value Is EverythingThanks Ian
But a little wide of the mark on the politics in fact but not going there!
You’re welcome – and sincere apologies!
Well, as sincere as I ever get – perpetual work in progress, there.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"
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