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I think there is a snobbery and elitism at a certain level in society
I agree with you there but I think it works at all levels – not only from (for the want of a better expression) the "top" looking down but also from the "bottom" looking up.
I don’t like phrasing it that way because it implies acceptance of something like a class system – but hopefully you will see where I am coming from.
All snobbery boils down to is a lack of respect or tolerance of others and that can be found in all strata of society.
What is the difference between resenting somebody because they, for example, line in a sink estate and resenting somebody because they, for example, had a private education?
There is no difference.
I know people who would define themselves "working class" who are wonderful people and who would do anything for anyone – people for whom anybody would have the utmost respect. I also know people in so called higher classes who are exactly the same.
Conversely I also, unfortunately, know people in the different social strata who are so obnoxious I wouldn’t even pi$$ on them if they were on fire.
In other words class – whatever that may be – is a complete and utter irrelevance.
End of rant.
The bottom-line argument is of course that Ascot are entitled to ask their customers to dress in a particular manner if they wish and I am equally entitled either to go to a different enclosure where the guidelines are acceptable to me or attend a racecourse whose dress standards are more amenable.
and that sums it up absolutely perfectly
Yeah, that sums it up… but is that the message that racing’s primary showcases should be sending to eager new customers?
That racing is elitist and geared to the wealthy and priviliged?
I know what "smart" looks like and can’t imagine what Royal Ascot would be like if people were allowed to wear any old thing.
http://www.kentuckyderby.com/content/derby-attire Oh my lord, they’re wearing sleeveless dresses! And their knees aren’t covered! What harlots!
Thanks Miss W – that lad in the bottom picture on the right – ORANGE BADGE material I’m afraid.
That racing is elitist and geared to the wealthy and priviliged?
I think you will find nearly all major sporting events are more easily accessible to the wealthy and "privileged" – whatever "privileged" may be.
It’s a fact of life. I would suggest it is a hell of a lot easier for the man on the Clapham omnibus to get into Ascot than it would be for him to get into the FA Cup Final (unless he happens to be a season ticket holder of one of the teams in the final)
Aren’t the best seats at Wembley way out of the financial reach of the average working guy?
Priviliged in this sense would be having access to things out of reach of the Clapham omnibus person you refer to. I include education and good tailoring in that definition.
Like FA Cup Final tickets Paul, exactly. Just because racing isn’t alone in alienating its bread and butter clientelle doesn’t make it right.
I know there is a supply/demand thing with prices and I think people accept that (look at concert ticket prices for example) but I’m not sure that people are particularly happy to be told that they must wear a tie, can’t take their jacket off until instructed to do so, etc, in this day and age when attending what should be enjoyable and relaxed social occasions.
And the poll seems to be indicating that the majority agree.
I know what "smart" looks like and can’t imagine what Royal Ascot would be like if people were allowed to wear any old thing.
http://www.kentuckyderby.com/content/derby-attire Oh my lord, they’re wearing sleeveless dresses! And their knees aren’t covered! What harlots!
I’d have them all publicly flogged!
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
Priviliged in this sense would be having access to things out of reach of the Clapham omnibus person you refer to. I include education and good tailoring in that definition.
Like FA Cup Final tickets Paul, exactly. Just because racing isn’t alone in alienating its bread and butter clientelle doesn’t make it right.
I know there is a supply/demand thing with prices and I think people accept that (look at concert ticket prices for example) but I’m not sure that people are particularly happy to be told that they must wear a tie, can’t take their jacket off until instructed to do so, etc, in this day and age when attending what should be enjoyable and relaxed social occasions.
And the poll seems to be indicating that the majority agree.
Yes "in this day and age" where we have finally learnt to do things properly hey?
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
Yeah, that sums it up… but is that the message that racing’s primary showcases should be sending to eager new customers?
That racing is elitist and geared to the wealthy and priviliged?
There are no eager new customers. How much does it cost to have a racehorse in training? Most of them are owned by the wealthy and privileged so it seems to me they are catering to their current market rather than an imaginary one.
No Jonibake –
in this day and age … "when attending what should be enjoyable and relaxed social occasions."
I suspect the first lawsuit from a heatstroke/coronary victim will result in a swift policy review.
No Jonibake –
in this day and age … "when attending what should be enjoyable and relaxed social occasions."
But Corm does wearing a shirt and jacket really prevent them from being "enjoyable and relaxed social occasions?"
I’d hate to see you at a wedding!
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
I know but if the courses do not consider give any consideration to the owner demographic, then they could end up with no horses running at their venue. That would probably make the day out less enjoyable for everyone.
This thing people have with jeans baffles me. A pair of trousers is a pair of trousers (style-wise) so what they are discriminatory against is the material and colour (denim and blue). Completely illogical.
Exactly the same trouser
Black polyester – fine
grey cotton – fine
blue denim – go homeIt is a form of snobbery IMO and I’m afraid, for all that Ascot has many fantastic plus points, you do get the feeling that some of those who run it would just much rather keep it to themselves and that the rest of us riff-raff would just bu**er off out of it.
Blue denim is historically working attire, akin to overalls, which has been high-jacked as a form of fashion statement in some quarters. I would no more wear blue denim in public than I would a pair of working overalls – so I can relate to why some racecourses would want to ban it from certain enclosures.
I also have no problem with strict dress codes at courses which have multiple enclosures, indeed I wish more would do so.
There is a case for not having a strict dress code in single enclosure courses but where there is a choice of enclosures then people can pay their money and take their choice.
You come across as being insecure and shallow.I was watching on television yesterday and saw someone wearing a pair of ridiculous green trousers in the parade ring-bright green trousers.
Ascot is being castigated for its dress code but at "normal" meetings the jacket and tie rule only applies to the Premier Enclosure – if customers do not want to wear a jacket and / or tie then they can go in the Grandstand Enclosure which still offers viewing of the parade ring and the racing and at less cost than the Premier Enclosure, what’s the problem?
I wonder how much of the criticism being directed at Ascot is because it is Ascot and it is the good old politics of envy coming to the fore – a form of reverse snobbery?
I don’t see too much venom and vitriol being directed towards Thirsk, for example, who have had a compulsory tie rule in their Premier enclosure for years which is enforced without exception.
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