- This topic has 13 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 12 years ago by
.
- Posts
I read on ATR that Cirrus Des Aigles could clash with Treve in the Prix Ganay on April 27th.
I was a bit surprised to read the following statement in the report:-
<b>"Despite being a veteran in Flat racing terms at the age of eight, the Corine Barande-Barbe-trained gelding showed he retains most if not all of his considerable talent when finishing second behind Japanese mare Gentildonna in the Dubai Sheema Classic at Meydan last month."</b>
I felt he was on the wane last season and I am not sure how much he actually achieved at Meydan in beating a 50/1 horse rated 15lbs lower than himself by half a length. It has been documented that Joseph had a Technicolour cock up on the favourite Magician in the race in question and there were a few other old cuddys down the field that day.
It was a bit sad to see our old pal and ex Derby favourite Mars pulled up in the race, somehow managing to finish 98th of 15 runners in the process (according to ATR results)
Does anyone think Cirrus is still near the top of his game and aiming for Cloud Nine this season?
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Cirrus Des Aigles was at his peak two seasons ago and his form on heavy going was of a very high level.
There was nothing in any of his performances last season that suggested he was anywhere near that form, not even his Champion Stakes run.
I think his best days are well behind him.
Cirrus was well looked after in his races last season and I could see a mile off that the main aim was champions day and they very nearly pulled it off. I would think a similar sort of scenario will take place again this time around with a slow approach before another bash at a big one and doing it that way he will have longevity and can run at a high level but probably not as good as in previous years.
Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026
Cirrus was an above average Group 1 winner at his best, one of my favourites. Evidence of last year (particularly Champion Stakes close 2nd) suggests he wasn’t quite so good last year. Even that form would see him win plenty of Group 1 races, but could well have deteriorated further at the age of eight. However, we won’t know just how good Cirrus is this time around until racing on a soft surface. Although has some top class performances in his past on sound and artificial surfaces – seems more consistent with "soft" in the description these days.
Value Is EverythingPart of the reason I am asking for opinions is that I saw him put in as 7/1 favourite for The King George Queen Elizabeth Diamond Stakes at Ascot, a race where he started 6/4 Favourite last season. I am sure that 7/1 last year would have caused a stampede to the layers up and down the country. The ground was pretty fast for last seasons race and if he is a bit further forward this year and gets cut in the ground, 7/1 would look big IF he has retained a good percentage of his talent.
Thanks for the replies.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
He was 2nd to a top class mare who has won back-to-back Japan Cups and was giving her 5 pounds. Yes Ambivalent (3rd) was an outsider but she was a Group 1 winner last year and ran well in first time hood.
Cirrus had to overcome an awful draw – 15 of 15 – in the Sheema and ground much faster than he likes (lots of track records on the night).
He could well run in the AP QEII Cup (Gr.1) over 2000 metres at Sha Tin on 27th April. Worth considerably more than the Ganay..
I don’t think he is better than before but certainly (after a year in which he was nursed back following injury) he is still top class.
He could well run in the AP QEII Cup (Gr.1) over 2000 metres at Sha Tin on 27th April…..
as if on cue, this released earlier today:
Steve: Can you give me a reference to the running and riding of Magician.The silence following the race of the Ballydoyle camp on the run of Magician was deafening.I failed to find any reference at all to the run of Magician.Aidan said Joseph rode a great race on the Derby winner but nothing about Magician.
Steve: Can you give me a reference to the running and riding of Magician.The silence following the race of the Ballydoyle camp on the run of Magician was deafening.I failed to find any reference at all to the run of Magician.Aidan said Joseph rode a great race on the Derby winner but nothing about Magician.
You can watch the race on Youtube here:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_95G_pdFWI
It is a little difficult to see fully what happens with Magician due to inane "arty" camera angle changes at the crucial stages.
Magician was far enough back, and third last as the race started to unfold in earnest. It looks like Joseph considers going up the inside but thinks better of it with a wall of horses in front of him. As the camera actually reverts to a meaningful angle we can see that Joseph has switched out wide and from where he is he will now need a clear run. He gets blocked in a little by two horses and then has a minor scrimmage and looks like he’s probably going nowhere, yet when he finally gets out and has clear daylight he finishes really well onto the heels of those who fought out the finish. The strong opinion I got was a more positive ride and a trouble free run would have seen him go very close at least. You can make your own mind up Andy. As I said the camera work isn’t the best I’ve ever seen.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Steve: Can you give me a reference to the running and riding of Magician.The silence following the race of the Ballydoyle camp on the run of Magician was deafening.I failed to find any reference at all to the run of Magician.Aidan said Joseph rode a great race on the Derby winner but nothing about Magician.
You can watch the race on Youtube here:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_95G_pdFWI
It is a little difficult to see fully what happens with Magician due to inane "arty" camera angle changes at the crucial stages.
Magician was far enough back, and third last as the race started to unfold in earnest. It looks like Joseph considers going up the inside but thinks better of it with a wall of horses in front of him. As the camera actually reverts to a meaningful angle we can see that Joseph has switched out wide and from where he is he will now need a clear run. He gets blocked in a little by two horses and then has a minor scrimmage and looks like he’s probably going nowhere, yet when he finally gets out and has clear daylight he finishes really well onto the heels of those who fought out the finish. The strong opinion I got was a more positive ride and a trouble free run would have seen him go very close at least. You can make your own mind up Andy. As I said the camera work isn’t the best I’ve ever seen.
I backed Magician on the day and for me if he’d have got a clear run he’d have won. The jockey on Empoli (A de Vries??) the eventual 4th really annoyed me, imo he blocks Magician in on purpose with the knowledge his horse wasn’t going to win!
having watched the race repeatedly I concluded that O’Brien never decided where he should be (in the field) in order to win.He made at least three inside – outside moves without gaining any advantage from the moves.If you remember in the BC Moore made ONE MOVE on Magician from last to first in order to win
Steve: Can you give me a reference to the running and riding of Magician.The silence following the race of the Ballydoyle camp on the run of Magician was deafening.I failed to find any reference at all to the run of Magician.Aidan said Joseph rode a great race on the Derby winner but nothing about Magician.
You can watch the race on Youtube here:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_95G_pdFWI
It is a little difficult to see fully what happens with Magician due to inane "arty" camera angle changes at the crucial stages.
Magician was far enough back, and third last as the race started to unfold in earnest. It looks like Joseph considers going up the inside but thinks better of it with a wall of horses in front of him. As the camera actually reverts to a meaningful angle we can see that Joseph has switched out wide and from where he is he will now need a clear run. He gets blocked in a little by two horses and then has a minor scrimmage and looks like he’s probably going nowhere, yet when he finally gets out and has clear daylight he finishes really well onto the heels of those who fought out the finish. The strong opinion I got was a more positive ride and a trouble free run would have seen him go very close at least. You can make your own mind up Andy. As I said the camera work isn’t the best I’ve ever seen.
I backed Magician on the day and for me if he’d have got a clear run he’d have won. The jockey on Empoli (A de Vries??) the eventual 4th really annoyed me, imo he blocks Magician in on purpose with the knowledge his horse wasn’t going to win!
That’s good race riding Danny. Any jockey has a duty to do the best for his horse/connections within the rules.
Magician came from further back than anything else in front of him. But that was always going to be the case after the Breeders Cup Turf.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWo8R1IRHAY
When a horse produces what connections believe is his best ever performance by being dropped out the back at a similar trip – then the jockey is likely to be instructed to use those tactics in future races.
Had the pace been good early or increased sufficiently early enough to be advantageous to those out the back (like in the Breeders Cup) – then Magician would probably have won. But through no fault of Joseph it didn’t. Also, when pace is good enough those with lesser ability fall back earlier; more room for the best horses to find a way through.
Magician will be a force in middle-distance races this term, may be with a pacemaker.
Value Is EverythingWAS THE HORSE GOOD ENOUGH TO WIN BUT DID NOT?OR WAS THE HORSE GOOD ENOUGH TO WIN WITH A DIFFERENT JOCKEY? OR WAS THE HORSE JUST NOT GOOD ENOUGH?
I KNOW HE WAS GOOD ENOUGH TO WIN THE BC WITH A DIFFERENT JOCKEY.AS FOR THE CONVOLUTED EXPLANATION AS TO WHY HE DID NOT WIN I AM TIRED OF THOSE STORIES.AS SOON AS THE JOCKEYS LEAVE THE GATE THEY ARE ON THEIR OWN.THEY MAKE ALL THE DECISIONS.THAT IS WHEN THE GOOD ARE SEPARATED FROM THE NOT SO GOOD JOCKEYS.WATCH MOORE WIN THE RACE.GUTS, COURAGE, AND DETERMINATION,THAT IS HOW IT IS DONE.ONE EITHER HAS IT OR HE DON’T.stays at home and goes for the Ganay:
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.