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Anyone who backs BC horses before the stable deserves to lose their money
What a load of rubbish.
Barney buys his horses. Feeds his horses,trains his horses. Pays vets, stable staff, farriers, and entry fees. That every time a horse is entered,whether he runs or not.If he wins he gives a portion to jockeys insurance and other "charities,and he pays his jockey.. Now he is supposed to advise the public when to back his horse so he won’t get a price himself.What exactly did you think was a load of rubbish? Not keeping Cavelino Rampante in the loop? Come on Cavelino,how much do you contribute to his operation?
Barney buys his horses. Feeds his horses,trains his horses. Pays vets, stable staff, farriers, and entry fees. That every time a horse is entered,whether he runs or not.If he wins he gives a portion to jockeys insurance and other "charities,and he pays his jockey.. Now he is supposed to advise the public when to back his horse so he won’t get a price himself.What exactly did you think was a load of rubbish? Not keeping Cavelino Rampante in the loop? Come on Cavelino,how much do you contribute to his operation?
Jeez Andy, put like that you’d nearly swear he was being forced to do it the poor divil. As for charity, that’s got feck all to do with how he places and runs his horses.
FACT is, if every owner/trainer operated like Barney does we wouldn’t have a sport, period.
As much as I admire the man for his charity and independent spirit the greater good of racing comes a very poor second where Barney’s concerned.
Happy enough in the TRF loop
.Any Curley runner makes it a no bet race for me. That is not right
Well that approach isn’t exactly going to a big issue is it?
There are approximately 9,000 races each year in the UK.
In the past 12 months Barney Curley has had 22 runners, of which 2 were winners and 2 were placed.
So are you really saying choosing not to bet in just 22 races out of 9,000 is such a big deal?
I don’t see anything too sinister with a trainer having a 9.09% strike rate showing a LSP of -£9.00.
This thread has only been raised because it is Barney Curley – if it were any other trainer, no comment would be made.
It is also interesting to note that no comment has been made about Imbongi at Newmarket yesterday who drifted from 5/2 in the morning out to 8/1 yet still went on to win – where are the calls for a BHA investigation there?
Oh come on, Paul!
Two very different sets of circumstances, and well you know it.There were some very weighty factors at play which drove the Imbongi drift. …………. the change in going; the fact that Barry Dennis "bismarck-ed" it on ATR’s Get On; and Nick Luck making it his Lay Of The Day on RUK’s Mark Your Card.
A kind of tsunami built up against it in the public psyche — reflected in the market (mistakenly as it turned out)..Conversely however, when a Curley horse goes into drift you can take it as a certainty that it will NOT win.
Cavelino I have been involved with racing for 60 years and have known a lot of racing people The greater good of racing comes a poor second to all of them. I might also suggest that you sound like you are forced to bet as much as Barney is forced to train. We are all in it for the fun as the man said to the bookie"it has been a business doing pleasure with you"
Hoof, I can’t see that Nick Luck making the horse is lay of the day having any influence at all on its price.
Colin
There were some very weighty factors at play which drove the Imbongi drift. …………. the change in going; the fact that Barry Dennis "bismarck-ed" it on ATR’s Get On; and Nick Luck making it his Lay Of The Day on RUK’s Mark Your Card.
A kind of tsunami built up against it in the public psyche — reflected in the market (mistakenly as it turned out)..Are you seriously suggesting the views of Barry Dennis and Nick Luck are weighty factors?
If so why don’t all the formers bismarks drift alarmingly – generally their price hardly ever shifts?
As for Nick Luck having such an influence, I am still wiping away the tears of laughter on that one, – if that day ever happens I will hang up my binoculars immediately.
If so why don’t all the formers bismarks drift alarmingly – generally their price hardly ever shifts?
So incorrect.
Most of the bismarks do drift. An interesting exercise is to keep your Betfair page open while Barry D mentions his bismark and watch the price of the particular horse suddenly jump at least 20% outwards. This will be at the "first" edition of Morning Line. When the repeat goes out an hour later on Ch4+1 expect it to drift further again.I’m surprised that you make a statement like above. This "Barry Dennis factor" is widely known to that section of the betting community that indulges in regular momentum trading. It’s a standing dish and feature of Saturdays.On Saturday morning last, Imbongi stood at 3.55 on the Lay side when Barry D phoned his bismark. Within approx two minutes it had gone to 4.0. I’m embarassed to say that I backed back my Lay at 4.1.twenty minutes after as I thought it had ceiling-ed.
Two hours later, Nick Luck also went negative on the horse thereby accelerating the drift. Later was to come the concerns about the changes in going.Paul, I’m not suggesting for one moment that you would be influenced or take notice of Nick Luck’s or Barry Dennis’s tips/bismarks etc, but many others out there do. Like it or not, but a horse labelled as a bismark by Barry D does more often than not drift outwards. Barry Dennis does have an influence on a nervy volatile market just as a Pricewise selection can contract the price of a horse.
If so why don’t all the formers bismarks drift alarmingly – generally their price hardly ever shifts?
So incorrect.
Most of the bismarks do drift. An interesting exercise is to keep your Betfair page open while Barry D mentions his bismark and watch the price of the particular horse suddenly jump at least 20% outwards. This will be at the "first" edition of Morning Line. When the repeat goes out an hour later on Ch4+1 expect it to drift further again.I’m surprised that you make a statement like above. This "Barry Dennis factor" is widely known to that section of the betting community that indulges in regular momentum trading. It’s a standing dish and feature of Saturdays.On Saturday morning last, Imbongi stood at 3.55 on the Lay side when Barry D phoned his bismark. Within approx two minutes it had gone to 4.0. I’m embarassed to say that I backed back my Lay at 4.1.twenty minutes after as I thought it had ceiling-ed.
Two hours later, Nick Luck also went negative on the horse thereby accelerating the drift. Later was to come the concerns about the changes in going.Paul, I’m not suggesting for one moment that you would be influenced or take notice of Nick Luck’s or Barry Dennis’s tips/bismarks etc, but many others out there do. Like it or not, but a horse labelled as a bismark by Barry D does more often than not drift outwards. Barry Dennis does have an influence on a nervy volatile market just as a Pricewise selection can contract the price of a horse.
You obviuously pay attention to such things more than I do.
My views on tipsters and those who follow them are well recorded elsewhere.
I suppose the one glimmer of light in your story is the lemmings who layed the Dennis bismark yesterday will have well and truly burned their fingers.
However I still cannot accept that Nick Luck dissing a horse is going to have any impact on the price.
I suppose the one glimmer of light in your story is the lemmings who layed the Dennis bismark yesterday will have well and truly burned their fingers.
Only those who Layed it just before the 3:25pm off at the apex 11.5 price it reached would be nursing barbecued fingers..
All the other Layers who got aboard during Imbongi’s upward price spiral and who subsequently backed back at higher were in profit.Colin and Paul: …….
I don’t know why you two lads are focussing so intently on the Nick Luck angle. I regret if the impression was given that a Nick Luck "Lay Of The Day" would drive a horse’s price into the stratosphere. I don’t think I ever suggested that, did I? I referred (I think) to the consequence of Barry Dennis bismark-ing a particular horse on the Morning Line. I did comment that when the same horse was also red-flagged by Nick Luck two hours later, fuel was added to the fire so-to-speak. I’ll stick to that view.The Imbongi price extension was in-my-opinion a result of the combination of converging opinions from influential sources — all of them negative in tone — that jittered a market already concerned about the effect that the change in going might have.
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2.8 out to 16.0 in the space of 15 minutes.
Needless to say, he was beaten.
Hello BHA?
Mate what’s that got to do with Barney Curley or the BHA?
I’ve seen this a hundred time when bookies open a horse up at the track not knowing if the are going to back it off the boards or not. Just a case of them being terrified of our Barney who has been known to have a tickle at the ring now and then.
Sometimes the bookies are well aware the things a mule but will open it up short to take a few quid off mug punters who believe they are on to something.
Name of the game mate.
Barney wouldn’t give a rats azz if the BHA pulled him up on that useless thing. If they said it wasn’t trying I can hear him now. "To be effin sure if you think he’s that good would you like to buy it?"
Good ride by your fav jockey on the winner though
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To be fair I haven’t seen a drift like that on a favourite before, but the majority are at it so you just can’t let it get you down and keep your head up high and strive to make the most you can out of this game.
I saw the Barry Dennis Bismark feature on Morning Line but still amazed by the drifting price of Imbongi.
As I left the Newmarket paddock I got a text from a friend saying "Imbongi now out to 10 on Betfair, presumably it has died in the paddock!"
I had to reassure him that all was well, that Imbongi has a history of sweating and not to worry about the drift.
I also tend to agree that the drift in the Curley horse reflected his chance in the race and surely he wouldn’t have opened as short unless the bookmakers were being cautious given it’s ownership.
Cavelino I have been involved with racing for 60 years and have known a lot of racing people The greater good of racing comes a poor second to all of them. I might also suggest that you sound like you are forced to bet as much as Barney is forced to train. We are all in it for the fun as the man said to the bookie"it has been a business doing pleasure with you"
I’ll take you at your word on the greater good Andy but even taking that into account there’d be no racing as we know it if we had to wait until 5 minutes before post time to check if every runner was off or not.
Where would we be if every stable operated the lockdown policy that Barney does? Where would we be if the formbook for every runner meant zero 100% of the time?
As I say I have no problem with the man, I read his book 3 times and loved it but this hard done by routine he goes on with I take with a large pinch of salt.
When it comes to my day to day betting I take zero account of who the jockey and trainer is. I bet so frequently that all this skullduggery (if there was any) evens itself out over time so personally I’m not bothered, although I can see how people would be. I don’t even know what horse Zarkava is referring to at the top of this thread.
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