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I wouldn’t have a problem with them trialling it. It was dangerous around Lingfield on the old surface but that got lightning quick after a while and bears no resemblance to the current polytrack. Kempton is such a big wide track that it’s hard to see how it wouldn’t be safe there. I actually used to enjoy seeing hurdle racing on the AW.
Quite right.
In summary, AW jumping when it was stopped still comprised low-grade horses running on surfaces not to be jumped out of and over lethal plastic hurdles.
We’d still mostly have low-grade horses running in the discipline were it reintroduced tomorrow. But much more equine-friendly surfaces, coupled with either the by now well-established fixed brushes or else a set of Easifix hurdles, would make for a far safer proposition all round.
I’m certainly in the "pro" camp for a limited reintroduction, especially if it can guarantee no repeat of some of the AW meetings of last January and February with absolutely tiny fields.
gc
Adoptive father of two. The patron saint of lower-grade fare. A gently critical friend of point-to-pointing. Kindness is a political act.
Maybe the Australian style hurdles which sort of resemble the ones used on Greyhound Tracks could be looked into as an altenative.
The traditional knock down style for natural reasons being as they cannot be banged into the ground could not be used.
At least trials should be carried out so it can be found out if AW hurdling could work or not.
This is patently not true as more than 90% of punters are Sun-reading betting shop types who will bet on anything including dog racing, virtual racing and even worse, irish bumper races.
!
Surely most punters have worked out that you should back Mullins blind this year?
I’ve never seen AW jump racing but I can’t say I would be particularly interested in watching it.
British racing is great because of its idiosyncracies. New tracks like the one in Wales (Ffos las is it? name escapes me), which looks fantastic are what we should be discussing and looking forward to. Putting racing on the AW just for the sake of betting turnover doesn’t do it for me..
Ffos Las looks mint – June 18th can’t come quickly enough!
gc
Adoptive father of two. The patron saint of lower-grade fare. A gently critical friend of point-to-pointing. Kindness is a political act.
Maybe the Australian style hurdles which sort of resemble the ones used on Greyhound Tracks could be looked into as an altenative.
That’s a terrible idea! The poor design of these hurdles has almost brought about the death of jump racing in Australia.
I can see from the responses that once the ‘dyed in the wool’ attitudes are washed out that this is a more than 50/50 consideration and a lot of responses reflect that.
There’s an awful lot of shocking NH racing for horses rated under or about 100 that nobody seems to want to say should be scrapped so if low grade NH racing should be continued, put it on a surface that can handle it – once it’s been tested of course.
Or ban all NH racing on turf firmer than good, regardless of grade.
Complete and utter tosh. Anything lower than 100 is low grade? Of course its a lower grade but what on earth do you call the runts that run in Class 6 "races" on the sand.
I’d much rather have less racing than see NH run over an AW surface. Its a stupid idea put forward by gambling addicts and greedy pen pushers.There is zero requirement to run NH over an AW surface.
I’m now not disagreeing with you but repeating the questions:
1) as you’re so against class 6 sand racing do you think NH races for horses rated about 100 or less should be stopped?
and
2) should NH racing be cancelled on ground firmer than good for safety reasons?
These questions may seem easier with blinkers removed.
I’ve never walked on Polytrack so I don’t know. Wouldn’t the horses be travelling quicker thus making falls on it nasty? I think racing would be better off developing the frost covers with levy money.
Patience, the cold spell will end.
Presumably horses wouldn’t be travelling any quicker than on the fast ground that used to be part of summer jumping.
As has been said on more than one occasion, modern synthetic surfaces are so good that the problems in its previous existence are unlikely to re-emerge.
I see no reason why it shouldn’t be at least trialled again.
But isn’t there a move to water away fast summer ground for safety reasons? Wouldn’t the horses be more likely to ¨bounce¨ off a rubber and wax surface thus extending and exaggerating their falls?
I’m now not disagreeing with you but repeating the questions:
1) as you’re so against class 6 sand racing do you think NH races for horses rated about 100 or less should be stopped?
and
2) should NH racing be cancelled on ground firmer than good for safety reasons?
These questions may seem easier with blinkers removed.
In answer sir….
1. I’m not against class 6 sand racing. I just don’t like it, as i think it encourages the racing, and breeding of far too many race horses. There is now way it is about the sport, AW is almost all about betting. Horses rated below 100 at NH can quite quickly rise up the rankings, and a seller at Sedgefield can quite often find a few gems that a change in trainer etc could exploit/improve.
AW in general would appear to be the point of no return, its either AW or the glue factory. I see no reason to support it.
Also NH needs changes in ground conditions in order to make to races more competitive. Some horses love heavy ground, and some love Good to Firm. Something that cannot be replicated on AW. The idea of ground being STANDARD for NH fills me with horror.2. Good to Firm ground is not unsafe for NH. It is the responsibility of the clerk of the course to decide if ground it too firm to race on. I’m lucky enough to be a part owner of a horse that loves good to firm ground. Also if you stopped Good to Firm ground you’d probably never see another race at Musselburgh.
Each to their own Mr Berry, but please stop trying to pollute NH.
I am nearly sure that there is all weather hurdle racing at Neuss in Germany.
Well, at the moment, Neuss is closed for a rebuild, but they hope to resume racing at the end of the year. In previous seasons, Neuss has held winter racing, however each meeting consisted of 7-8 flat races on an all weather surface, and 1 hurdles race on the grass surface. I’m not sure if the rebuild will see an all weather hurdles track introduced, but I’ve not heard anything about one.
Darren – AngloGerman
________________________________________‘The Hungarian’s going hell for leather’ – Jim McGrath
I’m now not disagreeing with you but repeating the questions:
1) as you’re so against class 6 sand racing do you think NH races for horses rated about 100 or less should be stopped?
and
2) should NH racing be cancelled on ground firmer than good for safety reasons?
These questions may seem easier with blinkers removed.
In answer sir….
1. I’m not against class 6 sand racing. I just don’t like it, as i think it encourages the racing, and breeding of far too many race horses. There is now way it is about the sport, AW is almost all about betting. Horses rated below 100 at NH can quite quickly rise up the rankings, and a seller at Sedgefield can quite often find a few gems that a change in trainer etc could exploit/improve.
AW in general would appear to be the point of no return, its either AW or the glue factory. I see no reason to support it.
Also NH needs changes in ground conditions in order to make to races more competitive. Some horses love heavy ground, and some love Good to Firm. Something that cannot be replicated on AW. The idea of ground being STANDARD for NH fills me with horror.2. Good to Firm ground is not unsafe for NH. It is the responsibility of the clerk of the course to decide if ground it too firm to race on. I’m lucky enough to be a part owner of a horse that loves good to firm ground. Also if you stopped Good to Firm ground you’d probably never see another race at Musselburgh.
Each to their own Mr Berry, but please stop trying to pollute NH.
So Good To Firm at Musselburgh is OK all the time but Standard at Lingfield isn’t ? I would also suggest that standard at Lingfield is completely different to Standard at Southwell and also suggest that there are better class races run at Lingfield on the AW than say the likes of Plumpton, Folkestone, Taunton etc over jumps, though I stand to be corrected on that point. Standard is just another going factor to be considered and on the whole if you know your horse likes it you can be assured when you enter the beast it will get what ground it wants. I’m sure there are plenty of horses running in PTP’s that aren’t good enough to compete "under rules" yet still have the opportunity to continue to compete at PTP’s. If you have a problem with the AW why not treat it as the flat equivalent of PTP and use it to highlight horses with ability that might be able to run in "proper" races on turf. AW is generally low grade stuff but is probably as competitive as racing gets which for me adds to the spectacle , whilst not the same as seeing top class horses jump at speed it has its place IMO. I shall continue to patronise the AW one way, I just wish others wouldn’t patronise it the other .
This seems to have degenerated into an all-weather flat vs national hunt debate, which is completely pointless.
It’s like comparing football and rugby – completely different sports. I am a confirmed NH addict, and have little interest in the flat, except for pattern races, and therefore next to no interest in the all-weather. However, different strokes for different folks, as they say, and there’s no point trying to denigrate one because you prefer the other.
Back to the issue of all-weather jumping there are a few points to consider, almost all of which have already been made on this thread.
Horse welfare – the primary concern. Now that the surface and obstacles have been improved, there shouldn’t be anything to stop us trialling this again.
Quality – it is likely that the quality will be low. This won’t necessarily make it bad sport though. The quality is low at many point-to-points, and I still love them.
Need/demand – Just because we’ve had a cold snap, doesn’t mean we need a knee-jerk reaction. NH racing will resume soon enough. However, I am so bored without it that I looked at the card for Great Leighs for ten minutes earlier.
Somebody shoot me now.
However, I am so bored without it that I looked at the card for Great Leighs for ten minutes earlier.
Somebody shoot me now.
Nothing wrong with window shopping as long as you don’t touch the goods
I must admit after going to Southwell on Tuesday and Kempton yesterday I just could not face going to Great Leighs today.
At least it has given me the chance to do things like sorting out the car insurance and the like.
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