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I have to say I’m very disappointed with this Saturdays up coming King George. There’s nothing particularly exciting about it. This is where the best of the three year olds should take on the older horses for the first time over a mile and a half but this year not one. No Sir Percy, no Dylan Thomas, no Alexandrova. Four very good older horses but unless the three year olds turn up to take them on the King George as a race and as an event is going to start suffering.
I appreciate it’s a long season but the three year olds tackling the older horses is what racing is all about. Usually I can’t wait for the King George but this year it’s a race that could easily resemble a Coronation Cup.
I don’t want to see our trainers / owners (I include the Irish) ruin British racing by shunning our top races in favour of races abroad.
(Edited by The Market Man at 4:39 am on July 24, 2006)<br>
(Edited by The Market Man at 4:40 am on July 24, 2006)
Trainers realise the King George comes at a bad time now for the three year olds. There is plenty of races for them to take on the older generation in the future….Juddmonte, Irish Champion, Arc, Breeders Cup.
I think its a positive move as it is likely the top three year olds will still be in peak form towards the end of the year and not bottomed by a hard race in mid summer.
This King George looks pretty good to me and certainly of a higher standard than the Coronation Cup. Arc winner, Dubai World Cup winner, Japanese superstar. Looking forward to it.
Even Ouija Board won’t run now. At least we have Soapy Danger representing the three year olds but he’s hardly the best of them.
Still disappointing to me the Juddmonte, Irish Champion etc shouldn’t really be able to compete with the King George seems to me connections are possibly more worried about the Arc. What happened to going for both – Mill Reef, Dancing Brave, Lammtarra? Winning both makes a great three year old.
The prospect of three good older horses doesn’t have me bouncing up and down I’m afraid. The three year olds challenging the older brigade is what makes flat racing for me.
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(Edited by The Market Man at 4:25 pm on July 24, 2006)
Some ratings firms suggest that Soapy Danger is only 3 or 4 lb behind the best 3-y-o middle distance colts. IMO that’s an overreaction and a rather too literal interpretation of the Princess of Wales form.
Still disappointing to me the Juddmonte, Irish Champion etc shouldn’t really be able to compete with the King George seems to me connections are possibly more worried about the Arc.
Times change, while the King George is still obviously an important race it is no longer the be all and end all. I find the end of season races from the Irish Champion on to the Breeders Cup meeting the highlight of the whole flat season.
You and me differ then Aidan. I can’t stand the Breeders Cup and any form of racing on dirt, I just don’t want to know.
Guess I’m a traditionalist?
After Cheltenham the Breeders Cup/Arc meeting are my favourite meetings…..what do they all have in common? The very best competing against each other. King George bottoms too many horses….in recent years alone Galileo and Alamshar never were the same horses again afterwards.
But I guess each to their own.
(Edited by Aidan at 6:29 pm on July 24, 2006)
Quote: from Aidan on 6:28 pm on July 24, 2006[br]After Cheltenham the Breeders Cup/Arc meeting are my favourite meetings…..what do they all have in common? The very best competing against each other. King George bottoms too many horses….in recent years alone Galileo and Alamshar never were the same horses again afterwards.
But I guess each to their own.
(Edited by Aidan at 6:29 pm on July 24, 2006)<br>
<br>I’d argue that Galileo and Alamshar just weren’t quite good enough. The King George doesn’t bottom the greats ie Mill Reef, Dancing Brave. Had Nijinsky not been sick he’d’ve won the Arc following the King George too. Didn’t bottom Lammtarra either.
I’ve nothing against the Arc that’s a great race but the Breeders Cup isn’t my type of thing. That said I’m not one for American racing anyway.
Racing was much different back then, season starts earlier here and the main targets are at the end of the year. Anyway Mill Reef and Dancing Brave were exceptional….not every animal is like that. There are plenty genuine greats that did not shine after wards.
Since 1988, the King George has been won by Mtoto, Nashwan, Belmez, Generous, St Jovite, Opera House, King’s Theatre, Lammtarra, Pentire, Swain (twice), Daylami, Montjeu, Galileo, Golan, Alamshar, Doyen and Azamour.
Of these, only three – Lammtarra, Swain and Daylami – were able to subsequently win a Group 1 in the same year.
In total, that’s 34 Group 1s and only 4 wins (Daylami won two).
Quote: from Gareth Flynn on 7:13 pm on July 24, 2006[br]Since 1988, the King George has been won by Mtoto, Nashwan, Belmez, Generous, St Jovite, Opera House, King’s Theatre, Lammtarra, Pentire, Swain (twice), Daylami, Montjeu, Galileo, Golan, Alamshar, Doyen and Azamour.
Of these, only three – Lammtarra, Swain and Daylami – were able to subsequently win a Group 1 in the same year.
In total, that’s 34 Group 1s and only 4 wins (Daylami won two).<br>
<br>True but how many of them were genuine top class horses ie the best horse of the year. The likes of Nashwan for example were retired following one defeat. Generous – how many subsequant group ones did he run in? The Arc (1?), Pentire, Opera House, King’s Theatre, Belmez, Alamshar, Doyen, Golan, Azamour all good horses but no real greats, Montjeu though brilliant was also inconsisant and needed things to go his way.
I don’t think it’s fair to blame subsequent efforts solely on the King George.
I do agree with anyone that believes the flat season goes on for too long though and IMO does start too early.
Montjeu inconsistant? Up to and including the King George Montjeu ran 12 times. Of these 12 he won 10, was second on one occasion and 4th in the Japan Cup….Oh how I wish I could find such an inconsistant horse!!!
Gareth has put up stats that show in recent years the King George has bottomed many a horse….yet your ignoring this putting it down to them simply not being great?
Market Man – I see where you’re coming from, and on an individual basis you can see reasons for why some of the horses couldn’t follow up, but the sheer weight of numbers surprises me for a sample of horses rated, on average, just under 131 on RPRs for their King George wins.
Even in the last three years Alamshar, Doyen and Azamour all went to the Irish Champion Stakes next time out as short priced favourites (5/4,4/5 and 6/4 respectively) and none of them could even place.
Aidan the sarcastic reply I feel is unwaranted. I was working from memory regarding Montjeu, Ok maybe I was a bit unfair on the horse. Montjeu though won the King George on very fast ground at Ascot which may have affected him somewhat as he was a horse that was happier with give in the ground.
Gareth I too take your point completely, I’m just saddened by the lack of a real three year old threat this year.
Quote: from EC on 9:35 pm on July 24, 2006[br]I’m just saddened by the lack of a real three year old threat this year.
if they go a slow early pace..SOAPY DANGER will be a very real threat
Yeah maybe. Just would’ve been better to have Sir Percy, Dylan Thomas and Alexandrova taking on the older brigade. Wow, now that would’ve been something to look forward to.
If the trend towards aiming top horses at the autumn prizes continues at the expense of mid summer, then I think thats bad for Racings overall profile in this country (and ireland too)
Frankly the public barely knows about the Breeders cup whereas the top 3 year olds going for the eclipse then the KGV kept the momentum of the season ticking along very nicely. For me, the KGV was the highlight of the season
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