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Zenjah
Yes Aidan trained them specially for the Guineas if he thought they were capable of winning the Guineas. However I believe that he thinks he has a triple crown horse in his yard this year.Out of his four entries only one is capable of winning the Guineas, the others are in for finding out purposes.In the Dewhurst Steinbeck was 4’s and Beethoven 33’s so Aidan was left with trying to explain how good Beethoven really was.He ran really well in the BC but did not get into the frame so there you have it. Obviously Aidan thought that Steinbeck would win the Dewhurst but he failed the test,so no Guineas for Steinbeck.Aidan has not had a sprinter since Mozart so maybe Steinbeck will fill that vacancy.Fencing master and Beethoven could be mile horses but need the sharpening up of the guineas to bring them on,like his entries last year.I have no idea why the other horse is entered.Moore rode Beethoven and Workforce so he has some idea how good Workforce really is.This of course is all pure speculation, since I only know what I read in the papers and conclude from that.Hey Andy some fair points there – we just view it from different angles!
They may well have a triple crown winner – but that is out of date it seems now – so the term should be deleted from racing talk!
Last years Dewhurst had strange similarities to the one of ’08 in that it was a bunched finish and the more fancied runners blew out!
I viewed the run from ‘Steinbeck’ completely differently to you – I thought that he was the one to take out.
Murtagh rode a funny race in that he seemed to look for a lead then never got one – he then seemed happy to speed dual with ‘Chabal’.
Considering it was only his second run and after a very long lay off – it was a top notch effort!
The race comments seem to back this up:
"led, ridden 2f out, kept on well under pressure until headed no extra final 100 yards"(In my eyes I wouldn’t see him as just a sprinter)
Re: ‘Beethoven’ Aiden said on ATR that he felt that he should have or would have won the Breeders’ Cup race but for being bulked at the start.
I don’t really see it myself – but see the ‘Rip Van’ thread as Aidan has some funny views! – I understand that he has vested interests as he bred the colt.I’ve found an article by Tony Morris here are some of the extracts (it’s quite long but a very interesting read – let me know if you would like to see more – you or anyone for that matter?
BY TONY MORRIS11.02AM 22 OCT 2009
OVER the last 40 years the Dewhurst Stakes has delivered many outstanding performances, its roll of honour featuring as many famous names.
Last year we had a different sort of Dewhurst, when Intense Focus, the most exposed horse in the field, with only a maiden win on his cv, prevailed in a tight finish, and we were left scratching our heads over just what the form meant. Many went away believing that some of those behind him were better prospects for 2009.
Twelve months on a sense of déjà vu is inescapable. Beethoven, the most experienced of the 15 runners, but with only one win in nine attempts to show for it, claimed the spoils in a four-way photo-finish which involved his two better-fancied stable-companions, and again we had to conclude that the Dewhurst had not crowned a champion.
With eight runs behind him, the colt went into the Group 1 Prix Jean-Luc Lagardere as the most experienced runner in the field, but there was no Ode to Joy at the end of this Beethoven’s ninth, as he beat only one home and seemed to be quite outclassed by the winner, Siyouni.
On Saturday, opposed by several colts who had already beaten him, as well as by two more highly regarded stablemates in Steinbeck and Fencing Master, it was hardly surprising that Beethoven – even with Ryan Moore in the saddle – had few friends in the market and was allowed to go off at 33-1.
Could anyone imagine that the addition of a visor to his equipment would enable him to win what was usually Britain’s most competitive race for juveniles?
It seems reasonable to conclude now that the visor did make a difference. He was never far from the firing line, did not pick up immediately when asked, but responded well to Moore’s exertions, and although he edged slightly right in the final furlong, he kept going resolutely in a finish contested by four game colts.
Experience and the opportunity to go 7f on ground riding on the fast side of good were surely also contributory factors in Beethoven’s success. HeH
He is going to get 1m, and if it is decided to extend his season with a shot at theBreeders’ Cup Juvenile Turf, his chance there will have to be respected.
Meanwhile, connections of several of those who finished behind him at Newmarket will have no qualms about taking him on again in 2010. There were better horses than Intense Focus – notably Rip Van Winkle and Delegator – in last year’s Dewhurst, and it will come as no surprise if some of Beethoven’s victims improve past him next season.
Re: ‘Fencing Master’ – I think that he’ll run like the ‘Duke’ & ‘Eagle Mountain’ did also ‘Rip (staying on)…could be wrong but see him using this for a trial to a race over further.
Aidan knows this all – hence the question about a substitute.It will also help in running ST Nic at headquarters if he wants to run something else in the Derby trials in Ireland rather than sending them over to France early for races like he did last year.
I note that he has no entry in the Noailles this weekend at Longchamps – last year ‘Golden Sword’ ran there…Aidan has not had a sprinter since Mozart so maybe Steinbeck will fill that vacancy.
I think AOB sees Alfred Nobel as his sprinter – he is entered in the 7f Listed Loughbrown stakes at the Curragh this Sunday. Steinbeck he sees as a mile horse.
I have no doubts that AOB/Ballydoyle/Coolmore are cunning & devious when they want to be, but I think the Steinbeck story about not being fit for Newmarket is probably the truth, rather than a fear of running him there.
Zenjah, thanks for the Tony Morris story – i think it is spot on. And AOB knows it – Beethoven is not really top-class (of course, he will never say that in public), but a good next-level horse who took advantage of a good opportunity (just like Intense Focus), helped by the fact that a non-Ballydoyle retained jockey was riding him, and so did not subtly hold back for Steinbeck (impossible to prove, I know, but anyone being honest will admit that Ballydoyle jockeys have done this before).
Hi Zenjah,
I discussed my posting with a very knowledgeable TV race reader and he more or less agrees with you. So there you have it.Time will tell.Andy – fair enough!
Good point re: R Moore & Workforce – if he starts to talk it up like he did ‘Spanish Moon’ before his run in the Hong Kong vase – when he called him a cert – I’ll take note – someone give Ryan a mic!
On Arcano’s plans:
http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/richard-hills-newmarket-guineas-arcano-guineas-plan-to-be-decided-next-week/701099/latest/
http://www.sportinglife.com/racing/news/story_get.cgi?STORY_NAME=racing/10/04/08/RACING_Arcano.htmlSurely it is a fairly important details as to whether Hills said:
"Sheikh Hamdan is arriving on Monday, and he will then decide – with regards to a trial – whether he has a run or goes straight for the 2,000 Guineas"
or
"Sheikh Hamdan arrives in the country on Monday so we’ll make a decision after that as to whether he has a prep race or goes straight for the English or French Guineas"
Apparently only Sportinglife thinks that Arcano could go for the Poulains instead.
Is he going & where? – simple…you would have thought?!
There don’t appear too many that want a run beforehand – where are all the decent opponents going to come from for the trials?!
How telling will they be…
Having just viewed the Mark Johnston interview on ATR – I’d say that Hills is likely to be on ‘Awzaan’ – all vibes indicate that this will be the case…
He’s yet another who will be going there without a prep – going for a race course gallop at HQ instead.
They also mentioned that he hadn’t grown much…more filling out but had done superb over the winter – unbeaten ’till the big day…
It was also very interesting to note the comments made by Mr Johnston re: a horses body weight and how much that he takes note if it when preparing one for a first up run!
It is amazing how many wonderful horses are on the small side starting with Northern Dancer who was barely beyond pony stature. Then there was Forrest Flower who was a pony- 14-2!Then the trainer who will say to you "If he had been bigger YOU could not have afforded him".Loch Con won the National(Original Course)circa 1946 and he was also only a pony.That was probably before most of the readers were born.PS at least I think he did.Cahoo,(correct spelling please) is another great National horse who falls into the same category.Anyone remember Dundrum in the show ring?
More info from Johnston on ‘Awzaan’ :
Johnston, however, presents a compulsive argument for his son of Alhaarth.
‘The stamina doubts are because of the races we ran Awzaan in (over six furlongs) but his pedigree and style of running say he will stay. With Attraction, the doubts were more understandable. She blazed a trail and pulled like a train.’
Awzaan’s maturity, Johnston argues, will be a weapon against Aidan O’Brien’s St Nicholas Abbey. The son of Montjeu and impressive Group One Racing Post Trophy winner is 5-2 favourite for the Guineas despite his pedigree suggesting he may need further than a mile to excel. Johnston added: ‘If I was training St Nicholas Abbey, I would be thinking that he is going to be better in June rather than at the beginning of May and possibly over further, whereas we can be confident that we have the finished article.’Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/racing … z0kehdwIMt
Another re: the size issue!
"He’s got an awful lot going for him," said Johnston. "The only doubt in my mind is that I wish he was a hand taller. He hasn’t grown at all over the winter."
Re: the weight issue!
Johnston declared himself satisfied with the work and with the fact that Awzaan is just
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2010/ap … h-mohammedAll positive vibes…
Note: for the record I haven’t said that you need a horse the size of a house to have a good ‘un!
there’s been a bit of money for xtension today 25’s in to 16’s, i haven’t heard anything from clive cox’s stable, has anyone. I’m surprised he’s been backed in was beaten by canford early in the season, won a slowly run race at goodwood only beating mata kerajang a length or so, then 3rd in a blanket finish to beethoven and fencing master in the dewhurst.
Even though I’d love to see Arcano and Awzaan run against each other, I suppose it makes more sense from Hamdan’s perspective to send one to Newmarket and one to Longchamp. More upside (two G1s vs one G1) than downside (no G1s vs no G1s). In which case Siyouni, Makfi, etc have quite the threat on their hands (hooves?).
I Don’t believe for a second that Steinbeck is injured or missing the race purely due to injury. He may have a knock but 6 weeks ago their was rumours that
Steinbeck was Irish 2000
St Nick Guineas
Fencing Master French 2000With continued support for Cape Blanco he could also run in the 2000 now.
Jan Vermeer the Ballydoyle prep in Ireland for the Derby(ballysax/derrinstown etc)
Could be some truth to this as ‘Fencing Master’ is entered up for the Fontainebleau…
same path as ‘Westphalia’ last year???
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