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I advised Grandera at 5/2 on the ante post betting tips page a couple of weeks back and still feel the same, in great form, has the ground he wants and will have a good jockey on board regardless of what Frankie chooses. Sakhee certainly on his best form would easily win this but now has something to prove, and with the knees the ground won’t be ideal. As for the others, the majority probably won’t be good enough but Zindabad looks good value, on favoured fast ground and Mark Johnston has reported him in great shape at home, which will please Ihal.
I wasn’t in time to voice my opinion when this topic started, and in the 3 months (slight exagerration) it has took me to read it, I have decided to type my thing, it seems it is a forum obligation to give an opinion so here is mine, sorry if it is a bit simple for the suspicious types. Connections of Istabraq sent him to Cheltenham in hope he could do it, while not expecting it. While the horse was still in training, they had to let it go for the record fourth champion hurdle, after all the success, one more victory was always a possibility. I can’t agree with any of the money issues, and Istabraq means too much to too many people for the horse to be used for any financial gain, the memory of John Durkan, the Irish public, all the folklore, I just feel the horse was sent over in hope of a win which would have been one of the biggest sucess stories ever in racing, it wasn’t meant to be. Despite this, the horse remains one of the most popular of all time, and will be remebered for the many good times rather than one race.
Well done to all involved, whats next, the best O’Brien and Godolphin have to offer? Maybe not, but congratulations anyway! :buddy:
One last thing from me on this topic. Obvoiously if a horse desperately needs the run or if there is some considerable doubt over the fitness of a horse etc it would be nice to be told. However, in the Bandari/Fight Your corner circumstance, not telling the punters who he feels will run the better, especially as there really didn’t seem to be much between them is not something to really complain about, surely even You can see that Ihal?
First of all I’m not going to downgrade myself to insults Ihal but sorry if I fail to reach the heights of sulking managed by You over Johnston’s comments, backed one of his horses in the Derby by any chance? Maybe being more of a racing fan than a gambling fan as such I don’t see Your reasons for demanding why all trainers don’t meet Aidan O’Briens level of punter helpfulness :laugh: . If You have a bet on a football match one week, will You demand the manager’s of both teams give You a full report of how the players have been training in the lead up to the match?
I’ve already said I think the trainers are a disgrace, just didn’t have the energy to write it quite as well as Kathy, but these men should be made examples of. Maybe I look at horse racing through rose tinted glasses but although we all knew there are some dodgy characters in the sport, it was still dissapointing to watch, especially with high profile trainers such as Osborne and Murphy.
Any people who watched that without any knowledge of racing will think everything about the sport is corrupt, the three trainers are a disgrace, I hope the jockey club take some serious action.
Either we are all mug punters replying here Ihaventalight or You are talking out of Your ar*e when saying Mark Johnston is a disgrace when not telling the public how his horses will run. Although racing needs the public, You are living in a fantasy world if You think trainers are going to tell us everything about a horses chance in a race. And to use Aiden O’Brien as an example of how it should be done is a joke. The man is a fantastic trainer but saying the ground is the key and the horses have a great chance is not helpful, its just stating the obvious. I suppose the way of seeing who ballydoyle fancied more for the race was jockey bookings, and even then that wouldn’t have been any use for punters as hawk wing lost. So sorry son, but I think You’re wrong here.
(Edited by Tommy Tipster at 9:06 pm on June 11, 2002)<br>
(Edited by Tommy Tipster at 9:07 pm on June 11, 2002)
I understand racing needs us but I can’t agree with Your view that O’Brien was so much more helpful than Johnston in the lead up to the derby. O’Brien told us the ground was the key, anyone with half a racing brain could have said that, whilst there obvoiusly wasn’t too much between the Johnston horses. Anyway, how much could the trainers really tell us, the horses are going well at home, but they can only compare their homework to stablemates. Anyway, don’t sulk if You’re a mug punter, I got both the oaks and derby winner, form was enough for me, as hawk wing as proved, work at home does not always translate to tthe track.
At the end of the day, trainers are doing a job for themselves and the owners, and if You feel they have no respect for the betting public, why should they? They don’t work to make the betting public rich, so if Johnston was unhelpful, I don’t think he has anything to be ashamed of. And O’Brien told us nothing we didn’t know before anyway.
I think I would have to agree with escorial here, though we all know Hawk Wing is an extremely talented horse, at this stage in his career, he has lost more races than he has won. I don’t think it is a formality that he would beat Sakhee in the eclipse and although there were mitigating circumstances for both defeats this season, there is only so many times You can say he’s a guaranteed winner next time out.
Why the yawn Zoz, I would prefer to see a top class horse like the ones mentioned win races comfortably rarther than tighter finishes in classics but won by very average horses, ballydoyle have set the standard, it is up to everyone else to reach their level.
If Hawk Wing and Rock of Gibraltar met again over a mile, I think Hawk Wing would come out on top, though not by much. Back to the derby, with all the rain, can’t see Hawk Wing beating High Chapparal over a mile and half, I believe he needed firm ground to have any real hope of staying. Took the price available on Murtagh’s mount, can see it starting fave now.
