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Starting a thread to continue a discussion which has been raised in the Horse racing section.
Ian wrote:
Bulwark wrote:
How is that racist? I don’t want to get into a political rant but things like this REALLY wind me up.
Because you are stereotyping someone because of the colour of their skin, .
Really? What if Rishi had said offair that he had had a Vindaloo on Xmas day? Yet you without thought or without knowledge have classed it as a rasist comment. You are making far too much out of nothing.
If an Asian asked me if I’d had turkey while all they had Vindaloo would I think that was racist? Of course not, its immaturity and the fact that racism is now an obsession that makes such an issue out of what is nothing more than harmless banter and fun.
Rishi didn’t exactly look offended he clearly has the maturity to take a joke the way it was obviously meant.
As for your work where is it Stalags are us? There are worse things said at my work every day but the staff all get on and the management are friendly and non dictatorial no one would bat an eyelid at such a comment. Is that a worse way to be?
Gary Wiltshire and Rishi Persad know each other well enough to share a joke, where’s the crime in that? Give me strength. There’s always one that has to shout the race card.
Im not making anything out it, the fact is that it was a racist comment, if Rishi Persad wishes to take it as a joke then fair enough, and if the BBC recieves no complaints then even better. But that doesn’t change the fact that the comment is the sort of comment that can land you in a lot of bother, it’s you who has flown off the handle because you think I am playing the race card, whcih is not the case.
I am not of asian, middle eastern or similar origin, but I have learnt over time, and luckily through other people’s mistakes rather than my own, that it is better just to never go into the realms of making such (potentially) offensive remarks. I have actually had to work with people who have properly played the race card like you wouldnt believe, and I have no time for such people.
At the same time I have had to work with people in england who still think that everyone in ireland is a terrorist, running about in bogs and there is still a potato famine (I [expletive] you not), over time their sense of humour gets a little irritating, and where I am big enough and ugly enough to make sure that they never say the same thing twice, its when you encounter new people its the same thing over again, and in all honesty, it gets a little tedious.
I have also worked with people who will the mick out of me for being Irish and I will take the mick out of them for being Mancunian crack den co-habiting shoe bomber-a-likes, but only when there arent people about who are likely to take offence, and thus it is harmless banter (ie not on national TV).
But every now and then I meet people with whom it is out of place and they just dont know when to shut their mouth. Because the intent of such humour is for people, with no wit, to try to belittle someone and make them out to be a dickhead (with what is essentially fighting talk). Then when that person turns around and knocks someone out for offending them, and the person who started it all is made to look a dickhead, and they dont like that, so all of a sudden they become the victim in it all. I have seen it happen so many times, that I know fine well that, if you dont have the wit to actually say something funny without making a personally offensive remark then you just shouldnt bother saying anything.
Basically what you are saying, as I am reading it Ian, is that people should be able to say whatever they want to people, and no-one has the right to ever get offended. I disagree with that, because I try to treat everyone with the same respect that I would wish to be treated with myself, but each to their own.
Bulwark no offence mate but I can’t be bothered to get further into this because it really makes my blood boil.
“I hate blacks”
“I hate p**i’s”They are racist comments
“Did you have Vindaloo for dinner” …………………. behave.
Apologies for above phrases just trying to make a point and apologies to Bulwark for not carrying on the discussion further.
*Edited as anything is likely to get you into trouble these days.
The idiots jump onto anything they can to try to look PC.
Within this world, some people dont like some other people. Its a fact!!
But some dumb tw@t will pick up something and try to get some publicity out of it.
Most people on this forum dont like me. They dont know who I am or what I am about. But they judge.
Its a form of racism.
I play golf with a lot of paddy’s who love an Irish joke abou the paddy who is not quite all there.
The beauty is they can laugh about themselves.
Shame we all cant!!
It depends on the context IMO.
However, remarks such as the vindaloo remark, even when made as an obvious joke where there is no malintent can still serve to strengthen prejudices. Like the jokes about the Irish being thick.
Difficult area but people on national TV would be well advised to steer clear of ANY such remarks, however innocuous they may seem.
And the Scots being tightfisted! see i can laugh at myself!
We should all be able to laugh at ourselves, aswell as criticise
ourselves, before judging others!Horse Racing needs this like a hole in the head.
Only two years ago, Joe Rowntree used the phrase "nigger in a woodpile" live on RUK. To my knowledge he has yet to reappear on that channel (I’m not sure he still writes either). Rishi was working at the channel at the time. Even the merest whiff of racism is enough to cause a scandal. The Big Brother affair of two years ago finished the careers of two minor celebrities. Ron Atkinson struggles to get work, even as an after dinner speaker.
Ironically, Wiltshire (cleaned out by the horses), replaced Angus "Statto" Loughran (cleaned out by the horses), on todays show for a massive terrestrial channel planning to curtail its commitment to the sport for reasons yet to be fully exposed to public scrutiny.
I’m sure the words "outdated attitudes" may appear somewhere in the documentation, yet I’ve seen and heard far more racism and bigotry at the BBC’s beloved football than I’ve ever heard at the races. Wiltshire hasn’t helped racing’s cause today.
I’m sure the ex bookie would faint if you described him as a racist, but that wasn’t the cleverest thing he could have said. I’ve watched him banter with Gary Newbon, Derek Thompson and Big Mac recently and this was something a bit different. I’d send him on a Race Awareness course before he reappears.
Well i heard Gary Wiltshire and it did not seem racist in the slightest.
Mainly as Rishi is from the West Indies so why Vindaloo got mentioned is beyond me unless they were talking about what to do with any left over Turkey that Rishi has in his house.
Anyway if Rishi thought he was being racist then all he had to do is turn around and call him a Fat Tw@t.
Most people with a bit of common sense can understand the difference between someone having a joke and being offensive about them.
Once on a train to York the train called into Bradford and some people who got on at Halifax and like myself where going to the races had been on the sauce (Not me by the way) and this was about 10.30 they then said "Here we are lads Blackford" Natrually this was a reference to the strong Asian community which they have in Bradford.
Racism will never go away im afraid and is here to stay, Blimey if we had no racism then Bernard Manning would have had no career at all.
I did not see the piece in question, but racism in the modern day can be more than just the spoken word. At the end of the day (to my mind at least), it is just as much about how the person will react to (or percieve) a racist comment as it is the racist comment itself. Undoubtably, many a person throughout the course of history, whether it be Irish, Black, or people from other ethnic origins, have been offended when there was no need to be offended; hence this relates to what people are commenting on what possibly happend today. I think this misunderstanding only heightens tensions between people, and the sooner we stop calling someone racist at every given opportunity the better.
However, in light of the fact that it seems more and more people are believing in racist phillosophies, and voting for the British National Party, the reasonable minded amongst us should realise that initiating any sort of comment that might be construed as racist is automatically for one reason or another implicated as being racist (note the word implicated). The other day someone mentioned the word "Darky" to me. I felt compelled to correct this person and let them now this is not the way to address a black person. They (90+ years old) immediately apologised and said that they always thought this was the proper way to address a black person so I accepted their apology and told them to try not to do so again.
Britain, under Labour rule, is unfortunatelty now a melting pot, with everybody looking to blame somebody; we all have to tighten our belts and our lips in these difficult times IMO.
Ok I said I wouldn’t comment further but I’ve woken up in a better mood. Twist Magic annoyed me yesterday. Losers I can accept but not when they can’t be bothered – my fault perhaps, no one made me back him. Anyway ……………
People aren’t voting BNP because they believe in racist policies they are voting for BNP because :
They want immigration stopped
They don’t want be in the EU (which is innevitable with the main three parties)
They are sick to the back teeth of being told not to celebrate Xmas and other British traditions (etc)
They are fed up of organisations that are anti white i.e. Black Police Association – Describe it however you like it is pro black and if you are pro one group you are innevitably anti another.
They are fed up of lies and corruption
They are fed up of a pathetic justice system
They are fed up of political correctness.
Just because people vote BNP it doesn’t automatically make them racist. That is something people need to understand. Maybe 10 15 years ago but not now, everything evolves from political parties to those that vote for them.
Just for the record – no I’m not a BNP member nor have I ever voted for them – that doesn’t mean I won’t in the future does that make me racist?
Most people on this forum dont like me. They dont know who I am or what I am about. But they judge.
Its a form of racism... firstly that’s not true about people not liking you and disliking someone because of what they write on an excellently moderated forum beggars belief IMO. And yes it is a form of racism, or you could say persecution which is maybe more an accurate description.
What we have with PC and the modern definition of racism is a bit of a laugh really. Calling someone a name like Shilpa Poppadom or asking someone if they had a curry for dinner is not racist, in my view. This is all a smoke screen for not allowing fair and open debate on immigration and the likes.
Real racism works something like this, just an example .. I won’t employ anyone to be a writer who is Asian. I won’t employ an Asian to do this job because it take imagination to be a writer and an Asian can’t have a good an imagination as a white because he is not as evolved as a human being. Asians and other non-whites can only copy and not create. I reckon that’s a bit more insidious and nasty than name calling, don’t you?
As for voting for the BNP, people can vote what they want that’s what the last war was about. The problem in this country is the same as everywhere else in Europe and the US, establishment politics, you don’t really get a say in the most important things. If we end up with far-right MPs, like Austria, Holland and France, then the responsibility for that lays with our own politicians and those who are throwing our hard earned democracy away to the EU.
It was no more controversial a remark than it is to say that all Scotsmen wear kilts and eat fried mars bars and haggis, morning, noon and night.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
Only two years ago, Joe Rowntree used the phrase “nigger in a woodpile” live on RUK. To my knowledge he has yet to reappear on that channel
Both Jimbo McGrath (Morning Line) and Paul Morrison (RUK) had to issue apologies for using that once common-place phrase on live TV. As someone wrote on a message board concerning the latter’s slip: “most over the age of 50 would consider it no more than a useful figure-of-speech”
Times change, for better or worse?
If Gary Wiltshire had wanted to be really clever (and rather more accurate) he would have asked Rishi Persad if he’d enjoyed his Callaloo and Pawpaw, the thought of which would make any son of Trini confined in a wintery Britain yearn for home.
Carnivaal!
Thanks for that, Droney. I didn’t know that about those two.
Wasn’t there a WWII film about Douglas Bader where his faithful dog was called Nigger and later versions had to be edited?
Thanks for that, Droney. I didn’t know that about those two.
Wasn’t there a WWII film about Douglas Bader where his faithful dog was called Nigger and later versions had to be edited?
That’s The Dambusters Max, tissss…..
I was watching the most annoying people of 2008 program on bbc3 last night and, although I’d not heard anything about it, apparently the Spanish basketball team ended up in a spot of bother, at the beijing olympics, after posing for a photo, whilst pulling their eyes back, like in the old "chinese, japanese, blah blah blah" rhyme. Now how many of us didnt do that as kids at some point. When your in the public eye though, theres no margin.
People aren’t voting BNP because they believe in racist policies they are voting for BNP because :
They want immigration stopped
They don’t want be in the EU (which is innevitable with the main three parties)
They are sick to the back teeth of being told not to celebrate Xmas and other British traditions (etc)
They are fed up of organisations that are anti white i.e. Black Police Association – Describe it however you like it is pro black and if you are pro one group you are innevitably anti another.
They are fed up of lies and corruption
They are fed up of a pathetic justice system
They are fed up of political correctness.
Just because people vote BNP it doesn’t automatically make them racist. That is something people need to understand. Maybe 10 15 years ago but not now, everything evolves from political parties to those that vote for them.
Just for the record – no I’m not a BNP member nor have I ever voted for them – that doesn’t mean I won’t in the future does that make me racist?
That’s a very gutsy thing to say Ian. I’ve not seen its like on this forum before. I’m sure there are people that agree with you too, but would be far too afraid to say so, and so it seems. It’s a good example of the climate quite frankly. I happen to think that ‘The Voice’ (black newspaper) is also racist, does nothing for relations and is insulting to the very people it’s aimed at.
Two pakistani friends of mine were saying just the other day that of all the parties, they agreed mostly with the BNP’s policies…apart from the obvious few.
I’ve never voted BNP and never will as my girlfriend of ‘dual heritage’ would be mortified.
Guy Gibson (Dam Busters) had a labrador called Nigger.
Something being considered racist seems to me to depend on who is saying it to who.
For example there are jokes about airlines
BOAC… stands for Better On A Camel
El Al… Every Landing Always LateUsing cars…..PONTIAC….Poor Old Nigger Thinks It’s A Cadillac.
Aa a white englishman telling you that, this could quite easily be construed as a deeply offensive racist comment from me and I would agree with you, yet my son in law used it in his stand up comedy routine, he is of half Indian, half Afro Carribean descent and used that in front of his home audience in Barbados, they laughed, to them it was acceptable.
He has said to me on occasion "This nigger needs a drink, Snowflake, are you ready for one".
Snowflake is a derogatory term for a white man, we laugh about it because we can and its said in a humourous way between family members with no ill intent.In other circumstances these words can be deeply offensive, so I think it comes down to how they are said and who says it to whom, either with intent or in ignorance. I didn’t see Gary Wiltshire and Richie Persad, I don’t know what the intention was.
I don’t buy that Dave. I was disgruntled with this government and thats why I joined the Conservatives. I didn’t hide behide a ballot box and vote for a party that is becoming more and more like the lib dems (in terms of changing their policy’s to be more "in" at any given time) everyday.
People CAN vote for the BNP, but they have to take responsibility for that as i’m sure most do, and not wheel out all the old arguments about politicians from the mainstream failing them. THAT IS A COP OUT, if your that concerned about the country then join a party, any party, but don’t pretend politicians are the one’s who change the world. People change things as well, and when everyone starts realising that individually everyone can make a difference instead of just scapegoating a few hundred people in the house of commons the world will be a better place in my opinion.
.. so you mean there is a political party in this country that is against immigration on principal? .. I think not. Not me, you or anyone else has a say. There is no choice proper choice at the ballot box, all of the big decisions are all ready made.
I don’t think your that old marble, but I think you are about to find out why people my age think the Tories are a joke. You probably don’t remember mass unemployment.
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