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Having had a better look at the race I would concur with DJ that Twist Magic has shown improved form – maybe not as much as 11lb, but certainly more than 3.
Hoo La Baloo has also improved, which isn’t that surprising considering he’s only 6 and has won 2 of his last 3 races.
In the likelihood of TM running even better on better ground he does look a force for the future.Hoo La Baloo from the PN yard again. So much for the horse not going on the ground
Nice to read what he said after the race about how the horse worked brilliantly in soft ground they other day……….so much for his concerns
Young horse like this winning at this stage makes you wonder how good he might be.
Didn’t seem to be a lot of money for him and yet he has won fairly easily.against a very good, if not totally top class, horse
Admittedly Kings horses are running below par but I would still rate this performance very highly and can’t imagine the placings being reversed in the future, as surely Twist Magic will be the one to improve more.
You could dig holes in Denman last week as he wasn’t running against the best of animals but this fellow has taken the apart the best two miler in the country.
I would regard him as the yrads Banker of the meeting and 6/4 seems a very fair price.
Bit early to be jumping on for me as I have already commited enough AP but I will be havig a right go just before and if he runs in the Game Spirit in Feb.
Don’t know where PN finds these horses, it takes more than money to dig them out. Whoever is advising him must be some judge.
Lot of action to come in this division before we’re any the wiser and I would ignore the ‘form’ between VPU and Twist Magic today. What the race showed is that TM is a genuine contender. His relationship to VPU, in terms of ability, has still to be clearly identified however. At least IMO.
You could be right but I was very very impressed the way he stuck his head out after the last. The second the hit that rising ground you could see he was up for it. It was like he griitted his teeth and said let me show you how it’s done. He quickly put that extra length between himself and the second that puts results beyond doubt.
I think he’s a right horse this one and I am very tempted to take the 2/1 that is now of offer.
The queen mother is usually the easiest race to sum up at Chetenham and If his main danger is Voy Por Ustedes, then IMO he only needs to get to Cheltenham safe and sound to win.
Lot of action to come in this division before we’re any the wiser and I would ignore the ‘form’ between VPU and Twist Magic today. What the race showed is that TM is a genuine contender. His relationship to VPU, in terms of ability, has still to be clearly identified however. At least IMO.
Why? He beat VPU on ground that would more suit the latter.
how does Sam Thomas’s sty;e of riding differ from Ruby Walsh? It’s just that the two chinks in both Twist Magic’s and Kauto Star’s armour has been their jumping, and I feel that they’ve both jumped so much better with Sam riding them….[only an amateurish observation; don’t shoot me!!!!].
Paul Nicholls said at the start of the season that Twist Magic could win the two mile Champion Chase at Cheltenham, so it probably came as no surprise to him that his improving horse won the Tingle Creek.
I backed Voy Por Ustedes and can find no obvious reason why he should turn the tables on Twist Magic at Cheltenham. Truth be told, I thought Twist Magic toyed with the Alan King trained horse.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
how does Sam Thomas’s sty;e of riding differ from Ruby Walsh? It’s just that the two chinks in both Twist Magic’s and Kauto Star’s armour has been their jumping, and I feel that they’ve both jumped so much better with Sam riding them….[only an amateurish observation; don’t shoot me!!!!].
Ruby has a great clock in his head and is a much better judge of pace in my opinion. It’s that clock that is the difference bewteen great Jockeys and good jockeys. I was slightly critical of Thomas on Kauto last time out but kept my thoughts to myslef. He won the race and that is what counts.
In fact I said he wouldn’t get a job with Jonjo mucking out or words to that effect. Well looks like I’m the idiot as the guy has ridden 2 excellent races in topm races on Denman and now this fellow and can’t be faulted.
It’s easy to say, anyone could have won the race on Denman, but that usually comes from people who have never ridden a horse in their lives. He settled him beautifully and had him half asleep for most of the race, plus he had him spot on at every fence. He did an excellent job.
He is no Ruby Walsh but a better pilot than I gave him credit for.
Having said that I am confident Ruby will ride Kauto in the gold cup. I would be a slightly worried man if Thomas had to ride him.
Kauto, to be seen at his very best, needs to be in the right place at the right time and Ruby is brilliant at that.
I was slightly critical of Thomas on Kauto last time out but kept my thoughts to myslef.
That’d be a first then
No it’s the second time..last time was when I was out for a drink last week and there was a Beatle’s record playing………I told the young lady I was with that I was at school when the record came out……she looked at me and asked….were you the Headmaster?
I couldn’t speak after that.Although both were given as officially soft, the Time based ground was given as Soft in 2006 and Heavy in 2007
The race time this year is 2.57 seconds slower that last year
Although i could be wrong and only time will tell either way, these added to the position of Hoo La Baloo has me thinking that yesterdays race is not what it first seems
It troubles me, if you know what i mean and I would probably give VPE another chance because of this
Although both were given as officially soft, the Time based ground was given as Soft in 2006 and Heavy in 2007
The race time this year is 2.57 seconds slower that last year
Although i could be wrong and only time will tell either way, these added to the position of Hoo La Baloo has me thinking that yesterdays race is not what it first seems
It troubles me, if you know what i mean and I would probably give VPE another chance because of this
No disrespect but I think that’s a terrible comparison.
Kauto Star put up an Arkle type performance last year. He had VPE in serious trouble by the pond fence and could have beaten him much further.
I would think it perfectly possible that VPE put up a faster time this year than he did last year in the race, Didn’t Kauto beat him much further? yet this young horse has still bettered him. Plus my eyes tell me he is simply a classier animal.
Anyway IMO times should only be used from the 2nd last to the winning post and within 24 hours to compare if no change in going……it gives you amore accurate lime on how fast a horse can finish……..the rest just isn’t worth taking into consideration…..unless something special has knocked 5 to 10 seconds of a course record……..races are run way too differently to be be using times to judge perforamances……a slow pace can knock a lot of seconds of the time of a race
Anyway IMO times should only be used from the 2nd last to the winning post and within 24 hours to compare if no change in going……it gives you amore accurate lime on how fast a horse can finish……..the rest just isn’t worth taking into consideration…..unless something special has knocked 5 to 10 seconds of a course record……..races are run way too differently to be be using times to judge perforamances……a slow pace can knock a lot of seconds of the time of a race
Isn’t this method flawed? Doesn’t how fast the field has gone before the second last affect how quickly they’ll be able to run from the second last to the winning line?
No disrespect but I think that’s a terrible comparison.
Kauto Star put up an Arkle type performance last year. He had VPE in serious trouble by the pond fence and could have beaten him much further.
I would think it perfectly possible that VPE put up a faster time this year than he did last year in the race, Didn’t Kauto beat him much further? yet this young horse has still bettered him. Plus my eyes tell me he is simply a classier animal.
Anyway IMO times should only be used from the 2nd last to the winning post and within 24 hours to compare if no change in going……it gives you amore accurate lime on how fast a horse can finish……..the rest just isn’t worth taking into consideration…..unless something special has knocked 5 to 10 seconds of a course record……..races are run way too differently to be be using times to judge perforamances……a slow pace can knock a lot of seconds of the time of a race
No probs DJ and I can see where your coming from David, it’s the difference in ground that i’m trying to point out
I’m just not convinced we saw VPE run to anywhere near his best, nor am i convinced we saw Monets run anywhere near his best, nor am i convinced a 22 run Chaser can improve almost a stone
I like winner, he’s an exciting prospect, but the above worries me a tad, thats all
Of course it does to a certain degree but not to the extent it does in a full race. It’s at the business end of the race and once horses get serious there is not a huge difference in the times they turn out…..occasionally one pops up that stands out and I used follow them till beaten. Wouldn’t have the time or patience to do it these days though……..I have a look at the Cheltenham Festival hurdle races and that’s about it
I would think it perfectly possible that VPE put up a faster time this year than he did last year in the race
Not so, unless you wish to question the official times of the respective winners.
You can extrapolate the losers’ times from the margins beaten and the winners’ times, as margins beaten are simply conversions of time lapses in the modern era.
Voy Por Ustedes’ 2007 time was approximately 1.4 seconds slower than his 2006 time.
I was impressed by Twist Magic but think Charlie has a valid point that it should not be assumed that Voy Por Ustedes has run to his very best.
I couldn’t speak after that.
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