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Undoubtedly they will but I would argue something like the Cheltenham Festival or, indeed, national hunt racing in general is defendable.
In the case of the National I would personally struggle, in all conscience, to defend it.
On what basis?
If I thought the National was undefendable (which I don’t) I would imagine I would find it hard to think the rest of National Hunt racing perfectly acceptable without resorting to hypocrisy.
Moderate chasers slogging around Hexham or Towcester over 3 or 4 miles on heavy ground and being administered with a whip to do it?
Horses with little or no ability for jumping being allowed to race?
SteveCaution – A Dounreay bus!! I spent a year and a half of my prime sitting on a Dounreay-bound bus. We need to talk!
If the race is made redundant, animal rights campaigners will target something else within racing, probably the Cheltenham Festival, instead.
Undoubtedly they will but I would argue something like the Cheltenham Festival or, indeed, national hunt racing in general is defendable.
In the case of the National I would personally struggle, in all conscience, to defend it.
Here’s another plausible scenario if they got rid of the National. How about horse racing entirely (flat and jumps) because that’ll happen if they got rid of the national.
Mind you it’ll please the Prof
I think most people think of it as a lottery which coincidently was the name of the first winner.
Undoubtedly they will but I would argue something like the Cheltenham Festival or, indeed, national hunt racing in general is defendable.
In the case of the National I would personally struggle, in all conscience, to defend it.
On what basis?
If I thought the National was undefendable (which I don’t) I would imagine I would find it hard to think the rest of National Hunt racing perfectly acceptable without resorting to hypocrisy.
Moderate chasers slogging around Hexham or Towcester over 3 or 4 miles on heavy ground and being administered with a whip to do it?
Horses with little or no ability for jumping being allowed to race?
Clearly I hold a contrary view to you – as for the reasons why the National is different, they have already been well rehearsed to the point of nausea elsewhere within the forum and I have no intention of revisiting the the tiresome arguments again here.
Clearly I hold a contrary view to you – as for the reasons why the National is different, they have already been well rehearsed to the point of nausea elsewhere within the forum and I have no intention of revisiting the the tiresome arguments again here.
Well you did bring it up yourself, on a thread about the appeal of the National.
What about jumpers being asked and made to race on firm ground and breaking down because of that?
Racing would be wise to abolish it. Most people I know like it for the tradition sake, it’s like Christmas rolling around. My affection for it was largely about that as well.
But, and you have to bring these matters to the bar of your own moral judgement, I find it repellent these days.Racing is a minority interest and as recent debates have shown, it doesn’t do itself any favours in the field of attracting new blood, with too much of what it offers as cryptic as Chinese algebra crossed with Find the Lady and a dash of forked tongue.
However, once the National is gone, the sport’s minority interest will be a strength: the general public and the media will not have a yearly reminder of just how atavistic jump racing is. Things will settle down. Animal rights campaigners will moan but no-one will take any notice as long as the RSPC is reasonably happy. Racing can then toddle along its road to oblivion without meeting an early death.
It would probably only take a couple of thumping Labour majorities for socialism to finally get around to destroying the Sport of Kings (the BBC, which is the media wing of the Labour Party, has demonstrated just what it feels about the game). Particularly if they feel the tax take is no longer worth it.What about jumpers being asked and made to race on firm ground and breaking down because of that?
National Hunt racing should not be allowed to take place on firm ground – a stance I have consistently held since the introduction of summer jumping.
Here’s another plausible scenario if they got rid of the National. How about horse racing entirely (flat and jumps) because that’ll happen if they got rid of the national.
Mind you it’ll please the Prof
I don’t buy into this theory. The Countryside Alliance told us that if foxhunting was banned National Hunt racing would die and it hasn’t. If anything it is as popular as its ever been.
There is an unwillingness among certain sections of the racing community to accept being told what to do by so called outsiders. In response they use scare tactics such as the oft used "this will be the beginning of the end for jump racing" line.
Agree and it was a line trotted out by a few racing media types, Oakley in particular I recall
It was an insult to anyone’s intelligence and typical of these stupid arrogant people
I also cannot have the whatabouteries that also get thrown around. Firm ground and other issues are just that. Other issues
"There is an unwillingness among certain sections of the racing community to accept being told what to do by so called outsiders"
There might be a bit of that but I’m not sure that is the crux really. Most people find change difficult and organisations usually find that difficulty multiplied to create a real inertia towards even the most progressive of change.
I’ve just seen that goal-line technology in football, for example, may be introduced for the 2014 World Cup. A long time since it’s been crystal clear that it was a much-needed and easily implemented solution to a controversial and devisive issue.
The National is a difficult conundrum for jumps racing. Its biggest/most important shop window while at the same time the greatest threat to the goodwill it enjoys.
There’s no chance of steeplechasing or racing as a whole disappearing even if the Grand National were abolished, which it never will be.
It’s too popular a race among the general public for that, whether or not there are occasional fatalities.
With friends like some of the so-called racing fans on here, it certainly doesn’t need enemies.
The Grand National is a tradition, it’s the one day of the year when everyone seems to have a bet or two, a little flutter. It’s a race where dreams come true or are shattered, almost every year there is a fairytale ending waiting to happen names like Golden Miller, Devon Loch, Foinavon, Red Rum and my own personal favourite Aldaniti and Bob Champion.
However, it is now a race that I find hard to watch and usually end up listening to on William Hill Radio. The sheer length of the race and the amount of fallers is much more than any other NH race run and I accept the fact that you can’t go calling for the Grand National to be banned when there are so many other areas of NH racing and flat racing also to a lesser extent that need attending too.
I would like to see the return of the line between Flat Racing which ends early November and the NH Season which used to draw to a close around April/May but now continues into the Summer meaning horses running long distances on unsuitable ground and in high temperatures.
With so many high profile, and in the case of Synchronised, avoidable (should never have been allowed to run after getting loose
) horse fatalaties, the appeal of the Grand National has wained for many, but we have to be allowed to make choices, mine is to listen on the radio and watch the race when I know that no horse has been injured (needless to say I have watched only a few in the past years).Who would deny Neptune Collonges his moment of glory last year even though it was tinged with terrible sadness of the loss of two horses, I couldn’t celebrate his win as I would have wished because of those events.Summing up I consider that the Grand National should remain but that owners and trainers, on entering a horse, should think long and hard about the abilities that their horse might possess that could make him/her vulnerable in such an extraordinary event.
Things turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out...I also cannot have the whatabouteries that also get thrown around. Firm ground and other issues are just that. Other issues
It’s very relevant when Paul trots out lines that he finds the National undefendable but the rest of national hunt in general perfectly acceptable, something you agree with.
I am quite comfortable with the Grand National, I see it now as more or less another long distance chase with one or two different fences and the long run in.
Can’t say I’m convinced by the reasoning for changing the start and the distance but there you go.
I’m not comfortable though with jumpers running on firm ground (where’s that clown Grant when you need him?)
It might help clivexx if you state what issues you have with the National (I don’t have any) as compared to the rest of National Hunt racing, if you can?
It would probably only take a couple of thumping Labour majorities for socialism to finally get around to destroying the Sport of Kings
The words ‘Labour’ and ‘Socialism’ mentioned in the same sentence. How wonderfully quaint.
Mike
if the Grand National were abolished, which it never will be.
It’s too popular a race among the general public for that, whether or not there are occasional fatalities.
You are probably correct but I wonder what the climate would be like if the race were to experience a continuous run of several years with multiple fatalities?
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
) horse fatalaties, the appeal of the Grand National has wained for many, but we have to be allowed to make choices, mine is to listen on the radio and watch the race when I know that no horse has been injured (needless to say I have watched only a few in the past years).Who would deny Neptune Collonges his moment of glory last year even though it was tinged with terrible sadness of the loss of two horses, I couldn’t celebrate his win as I would have wished because of those events.
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