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Segal on Trainers and Prize-money

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  • #27178
    Avatar photoCav
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    • Total Posts 4833

    Good stuff from Tom in his Weekender column this week.

    "Of all the people who moan about prize-money, trainers really are the ones who should keep their mouths shut. They charge owners huge sums, send their kids to private schools and then don’t even bother to enter their horses in valuable races."

    Spot on in my opinion.

    #498111
    Avatar photopatriot1
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    • Total Posts 962

    Fully agree. Plenty of racecourses are putting on excellent prize money and being rewarded with pathetic fields. Owners and trainers need to support those courses which are investing in prize money.

    #498113
    Peruvian Chief
    Member
    • Total Posts 1931

    Hear hear.

    #498123
    tony321
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    • Total Posts 368

    It was well put, the only ones with a gripe are the owners but when you see 3 or 4 runner races for 5 figure prize money why aren’t they telling their trainers to get them entered ?

    #498303
    Avatar photoSeven Towers
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    • Total Posts 608

    According to the RP 14 of 21 Jumps races had to be reopened today and even then only 8 of them have more than 8 runners with a couple on the "dead 8" so we know what is going to happen to them.
    It beggars belief that in all of the horse population currently in training there aren’t more that could have been entered today to bolster up the field sizes.

    #498314
    eddie case
    Member
    • Total Posts 1214

    Too much racing, this is what happens when you’re dependent on bookmakers for an income. No reason why it will change.

    #498318
    wit
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2171

    on "dead 8", the HK PMU allows place-only betting and it operates as follows:

    1st, 2nd or 3rd in a race
    but 1st or 2nd in a race of 4 to 6 declared starters (ie regardless of actual starters, since actual non-starters are voided and stakes on them reversed out).

    better way to address place betting than GB bookie rules ?

    #498328
    eddie case
    Member
    • Total Posts 1214

    In Britain if more than 7 runners and an odds on or short price fav, the 2nd and 3rd favs (at least) will be substantially under the true win odds with bookmakers, to apparently compensate them for the place part of each way bets.

    However they don’t allow meaningful each way bets on those sort of races anyway, so have the double whammy in ripping punters off in them.

    #498352
    Avatar photoGingertipster
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    • Total Posts 33202

    Too much racing, this is what happens when you’re dependent on bookmakers for an income. No reason why it will change.

    Too much racing, yes. Am sure Bookmakers like as much competitive racing as possible, but suspect one competitive race brings in more money than two uncompetitive races. So doubt they’d be happy with the situation either Eddie.

    Agree with Tom, fed up with trainers moaning.

    Value Is Everything
    #498358
    tony321
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    • Total Posts 368

    Terrible racing for a Saturday today, no races to get your teeth in and 3 or 4 runner novice chases.

    #498375
    Avatar photoGingertipster
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    • Total Posts 33202

    Terrible racing for a Saturday today, no races to get your teeth in and 3 or 4 runner novice chases.

    If you don’t like the racing today Tony, you aren’t going to like much. Two really good open handicaps (what’s wrong with them as betting propositions?), second fav for the Champion Hurdle, a Champion Hurdler in the last, first race an excellent quality Juvenile hurdle, good staying novice hurdle and Donny had some good races too including a fantastic performance from another Juvenile hurdler.

    If unable to find much of interest today may be you should give up racing.

    Value Is Everything
    #498416
    tony321
    Participant
    • Total Posts 368

    Good for watching and some enjoyable racing but very little to get the teeth into betting wise, even Pricewise could only come up with 2 bets. I just thought for whatever reason todays racing wasn’t as good as it could be.

    And then the big race at Donny was ruined by the sun again.

    #498419
    Oasisdreamer
    Participant
    • Total Posts 305

    I enjoy a few big field handicaps come the weekend so today was pretty underwhelming.

    Saturday is the day when most owners can attend the racecourse and prize money is at its best so I’m at a bit of a loss to explain the general small fields today.

    What’s happened to all the horses that ran at the Paddy Power meeting? Often they follow up at this meeting today.

    #498540
    eddie case
    Member
    • Total Posts 1214

    Too much racing, this is what happens when you’re dependent on bookmakers for an income. No reason why it will change.

    Too much racing, yes. Am sure Bookmakers like as much competitive racing as possible, but suspect one competitive race brings in more money than two uncompetitive races. So doubt they’d be happy with the situation either Eddie.

    I’m sure that is true Gingertipster but why is there too much racing then and no sign of a decrease in meetings next year or in the foreseeable future?

    It is because of racing’s relationship with bookmakers and the need to produce races for punters to bet on and racing to receive levy.

    The BHA are frightened that if they reduce meetings they will receive less levy, it is a never ending circle that will never be resolved while racing is dependent on bookmakers for an income.

    Bring on the PMU, the future is too depressing following the same path racing is currently going down.

    #498568
    Avatar photograysonscolumn
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    • Total Posts 6966

    It beggars belief that in all of the horse population currently in training there aren’t more that could have been entered today to bolster up the field sizes.

    THIS. Especially with the recently seemingly dominant "heavy" absent from the going description of two of the three turf fixtures.

    Meanwhile, 67 turned out in seven races on the Fibresand, and a genuinely good surface at Larkhill Point-to-Point course enticed 59 starters to its six-race Hursley Hambledon fixture.

    Always winners and losers when the ground tends to extremes in most places but not somewhere else. Still think the patronage of Cheltenham and Donny from the training ranks on Saturday left something to be desired even so.

    gc

    Adoptive father of two. The patron saint of lower-grade fare. A gently critical friend of point-to-pointing. Kindness is a political act.

    #498586
    tony321
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    • Total Posts 368

    Saturdays meetings this week will be interesting to see how many turn up, can’t see more than 4 or 5 for the Graduation chase at Ascot, 5 declared for the Long Walk which is pathetic, the 2 handicap chases look like being single figures at best and the only race for a decent size field will be the Ladbroke.

    The weather looks to be ok this week so it won’t be a case of trainers having to run as that is the only choice this week and no doubt small fields again next weekend.

    #498589
    Avatar photobetlarge
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2805

    Does anyone know how many NH horses are in training as we speak?

    And how does that compare to previous years?

    Mike

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