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- Total Posts 17716
MM<br>For your enlightenment, the whip rules you requested can be found here.<br>You may notice, despite your assertion that:"for instance Kieran Fallon is forever using his whip above shoulder height and he also uses the whip down the shoulder frequently which is also against the rules" <br>it isn’t illegal to use the whip above shoulder height, just the fore-arm, and it isn’t illegal to use the whip down the shoulder.<br>I’ll grant you that KF occasionally uses the whip forearm down the shoulder, but no more than a tap to correct an errant move by the horse, rather than the full-blooded butchery you would have us believe. The stewards would seem to agree with him, as I can recall no instance of his being ‘pulled’ for doing so.<br>You then compound your over the top critique by cricising him for getting certain horses unbalanced, (which all jockeys do, at times) and use as youur examples A/ a noted headcase such as George Washington whom he did remarkbly well to keep straight, and B/ Yeats, coming round possibly the most notorious bend in racing, the one into the Ascot straight with its sharp bend and adverse camber, where probably one third of all runners become somewhat unbalanced in tight finishes become, even in NH races.
<br>Posted incomplete; continued below.
(Edited by reet hard at 12:57 pm on May 8, 2007)<br>
(Edited by reet hard at 12:59 pm on May 8, 2007)
Quote: from betlarge on 12:44 pm on May 8, 2007[br]
"The sycophantic slags all say I knew him first and I knew him well"
<br>The Smiths?  Or Morrissey on his own?  Vaguely remember it.
Mike
Very good Mike "Paint a vulgar picture" The Smiths, from their last album together "Strangeways here we come"
MM, I ain’t no Fallon sickofant!
Far from it, I was criticising the man for intimidating others.
Colin
Very good Mike "Paint a vulgar picture" The Smiths, from their last album together "Strangeways here we come"
<br>Just googled "Strangeways" – it was 17 years ago.<br>I’m definitely getting old.
Mike
- Total Posts 17716
KF is a top class jockey, who knows exactly how and when to use the whip, and will often be seen to use extreme skill and patience in balancing a horse before asking for maximum effort, often to the extent that he won’t question the horse until the very last strides. Were he to hit them before this point, the horse would likely become more unbalanced and, as his record clearly shows, that certainly is not the case. Maybe punters just love him because they’ll know he’ll get the best from a horse, and there are none better at the moment.<br>Do you really believe that A O’Brien, one of the quietest and most unassuming of racings elite, would really eulogise KF’s talents to such an extent, or that Coolmore, with often the best string in Europe at their disposal, would stand by him through his recent adversaties, if they thought that all he was good for was beating up horses,:o :o  (Or, as some of your equally thoughtless brethren would believe, his ability to stop them).:biggrin:
Quote: from seabird on 1:09 pm on May 8, 2007[br]MM, I ain’t no Fallon sickofant!
Far from it, I was criticising the man for intimidating others.
Sorry Bird, my apologies.<br>Colin <br>
Quote: from reet hard on 12:54 pm on May 8, 2007[br]MM<br>For your enlightenment, the whip rules you requested can be found here.<br>You may notice, despite your assertion that:"for instance Kieran Fallon is forever using his whip above shoulder height and he also uses the whip down the shoulder frequently which is also against the rules" <br>it isn’t illegal to use the whip above shoulder height, just the fore-arm, and it isn’t illegal to use the whip down the shoulder.<br>I’ll grant you that KF occasionally uses the whip forearm down the shoulder, but no more than a tap to correct an errant move by the horse, rather than the full-blooded butchery you would have us believe. The stewards would seem to agree with him, as I can recall no instance of his being ‘pulled’ for doing so.<br>You then compound your over the top critique by cricising him for getting certain horses unbalanced, (which all jockeys do, at times) and use as youur examples A/ a noted headcase such as George Washington whom he did remarkbly well to keep straight, and B/ Yeats, coming round possibly the most notorious bend in racing, the one into the Ascot straight with its sharp bend and adverse camber, where probably one third of all runners become somewhat unbalanced in tight finishes become, even in NH races.
<br>Posted incomplete; continued below.
(Edited by reet hard at 12:57 pm on May 8, 2007)
<br>(Edited by reet hard at 12:59 pm on May 8, 2007)<br>
I suggest reet you go back and study it a little more, there is only 3 places a horse can be hit, on the quarters either forehand or backhand, and on the shoulder but only in the backhand position with both hands on the reins.<br>Your right reet, its not illegal to use the whip above shoulder height only when your forearm is above shoulder height. But Fallon is still guilty of using his forearm above shoulder height. Basically your forearm has to be in line with your shoulder even an inch above your breaking the rules, check out old Fallon rides reet ,and see how far above his shoulder his forearm does be.
MM,
I suggest you also watch the way in which he uses his legs, the way he kids horses along rather than batters them, his ability to time his runs and also his ability to win all kinds of races on all kinds of horses. Add that to what Reet said about coolmore’s unflinching support and the fact that he has ridden for Cecil and Stoute (probably just needs godolphin to complete the elite set) and it doesn;t take a lot to work out that Fallon is a little better than an agricultural butcher let off just because of who he is..
The thread is about whip rules in general and an instance involving Fortune anyway and not some verbal assault on Fallon.
Quote: from Aragorn on 2:12 pm on May 8, 2007[br]MM
The thread is about whip rules in general and an instance involving Fortune anyway and not some verbal assault on Fallon.
Funny Aragorn, any number of threads on the forum seem to deviate away from the original topic. A thread I started recently "mias boy" ended up slating Richard Hughes who had nothing to do with the the original thread.
I suppose I am lucky Kieran Fallon isn’t of the Islamic Faith or you would be burning effigies of me and declaring a Fatwa, for daring to criticise your Diety.
Speakin of usin the whip, or not using it rather, did anyone see the 2.40 at Chepstow today, Gosdens horses came in 1st and 2nd, venerable 1st as 2/1 fave, and shavansky 2nd at 20/1, shavansky was cruisin in 2nd for the final furlong yet the jockey didnt use the whip once and seemed to have no intention of wanting to win, is this a case of he knew what was wanted of him?
MM,
Are you the guy who started the thread about secretly wishing horses fall? Please refrain from generalising on the forum, you shouldn’t be so arrogant thinking you know people’s opinions….
JohnJ.
Quote: from johnjdonoghue on 12:22 pm on May 9, 2007[br]MM,
Are you the guy who started the thread about secretly wishing horses fall? Please refrain from generalising on the forum, you shouldn’t be so arrogant thinking you know people’s opinions….
JohnJ.
Im a pretty nice guy really JJ if you get to know me.<br>I have adopted 5 Romania orphans, rescued 20 homeless cats, 10 homeless dogs. Drive the bus for the local Old age pensioners, also work as the Parish Sacrosanct, contribute to 20 different charities, rescue useless horses from Dog/Cat Food tins, (granted have to feed my cats and dogs) and I spend whatever spare time I have left enjoying this forum.
Seems though the only opinions allowed are the ones that you and your like agree with. Everyone else should just go away then JJ ???
It would be a pretty boring forum if it was uniformed to your taste JJ.
…also work as the Parish Sacrosanct
crikey ~ I thought nothing was sacrosanct these days! Perhaps you mean sacristan?
No, it would continue to be a forum where reasoned intelligent debate takes place.
I’ve argued with John a lot and while we disagree regularly (Particularly about Kauto) it never becomes petulant, which your last post is mate…
Quote: from Aragorn on 1:22 pm on May 9, 2007[br]No, it would continue to be a forum where reasoned intelligent debate takes place.
I’ve argued with John a lot and while we disagree regularly (Particularly about Kauto) it never becomes petulant, which your last post is mate…
What took you so long Aragorn ??<br>JJ seems to spend his time scrolling the forum looking for threads that dont fit his criteria.<br>Or is it you long time members of TRF have your own clique. And get some sort of kick trying to humiliate other posters because his/hers opinions just dont fit with your often blinkered views. " I mean to say, I say what I mean".
Rory dont actually practice religion so forgive my error.
Quote: from madman marz on 1:33 pm on May 9, 2007[br]
Or is it you long time members of TRF have your own clique. And get some sort of kick trying to humiliate other posters because his/hers opinions just dont fit with your often blinkered views. " I mean to say, I say what I mean".<br>.
Madman, I’ve been here around the same length of time as yourself, and as yet I’ve received little to no put downs for opinions that I post here.
Perhaps it’s because I don’t categorise people that can, and will, answer back, and because I don’t pretend to know more about horse racing than people who have followed it religiously since before I was born! I think perhaps you should take heed and reign it in sometimes.
(Edited by Friggo at 1:41 pm on May 9, 2007)
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