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Well Ginge despite the fact I think you put way too much time into what you do with tables etc you did manage to get to me.
A horse I love to hate "Straw Bear" runs today and due to where I live I got an opportunity to bet him at an excellent price…..I thought no and then I thought GINGE!!! and lumped on……If he wins I have you to thank if he get’s beat would you happen to know any hit men in England
Just joking mate have a good day……PS do you think A Brother is good value at 9/4 in the last at Haydock?
Loves the ground, is fit and well, but a bit green still and is slightly one paced……I would love to know what you think is a value price. Sure you know by now Haydock is off, shame.If my thread got to you Fist
I am sure it can get to anyone.Read what you said about Straw Bear for the Champion, and agree with you.
Can not see him finishing in front of Harchibald there. Can not see Harchibald going through with his effort either, might be an each way or place only bet nearer the time.Ginge
Value Is EverythingJust a thought.
I am going to be participating in a racing quiz on tuesday night at Newbury Racecourse, representing the West Berkshire Racing Club. In the seat once polished by Alan Potts. There will be all sorts of racing personalities there including racing journalists.
Don’t worry, I will not be attacking you, spouting off or anything. This is social evening that racing people enjoy. I guarantee I will not mention the table of odds and chances. Unless any of the racing media want to approach me and give their views, why the table is never spoken about in the media. Whether it is on or off the record. Just like to know.
To use Kevin Keegans words "I’ll love it if we beat you, love it"
Come to think of it, it is more likely to be me that is attacked
As I said earlier, I like you all really.Value Is Everything Our team got thrashed by the Racing Post, played our joker on the wrong round. Congratulations to the Racing Post team of Graham Dench, Craig Thaike, Lee Motershead and one other who’s name escapes me.Unsurprisingly, none of the journalists there approached me about the table. Will have to accept nobody is willing / allowed to respond to my question. Am also surprised at how many punters apparently have no interest in showing a profit.
Thank you to all the people who took part in the West Berkshire Racing Club quiz last night.
Value Is EverythingTable Of Odds And Chances
Evens=50% …. 21/20=48.8% …. 11/10=47.6% …. 6/5=45.5% ….5/4=44.4% …. 11/8=42.1% …. 6/4=40% …. 13/8=38.1% …. 7/4=36.4% …. 9/5=35.7% …. 15/8=34.8% …. 2/1=33.3% …. 85/40=32% …. 9/4=30.8% …. 5/2=28.6% …. 11/4=26.7% …. 3/1=25% …. 100/30=23.1% …. 7/2=22.2% …. 4/1=20% …. 9/2=18.2% …. 5/1=16.7% …. 11/2=15.4% …. 6/1=14.3% …. 13/2=13.3% …. 7/1=12.5% …. 15/2=11.7% …. 8/1=11.1% …. 17/2=10 5% …. 9/1=10% …. 10/1=9.1% …. 11/1=8.3% …. 12/1=7.7% …. 13/1=7.1% …. 14/1=6.7% …. 15/1=6.2% …. 16/1=5.9% …. 18/1=5.3% …. 20/1=4.8% …. 22/1=4.3% …. 25/1=3.8% …. 28/1=3.4% …. 33/1=3% …. 40/1=2.4% …. 50/1=2% …. 66/1=1.5% …. 80/1=1.2% …. 100/1=1% …. 132/1=3/4%(0.75%) …. 150/1=2/3%(0.67%) …. 200/1=1/2%(0.5%) …. 300/1=1/3%(0.33%) …. 400/1=1/4%(0.25%) …. 500/1=1/5%(0.2%) …. 800/1=1/8%(0.125%) …. 1000/1=1/10%(0.1%) …. 2000/1=1/20%(0.05%)Value Is EverythingGingertipster said:
I find it very disappointing that no members of the racing media have come on here to defend themselves.
I came on here and said that The Sportsman carried several articles explaining the basic maths of betting.
I don’t have the same sort of outlet now but did mention how to calculate percentages from odds in my column about odds-compiling on Betfair.
Last time I looked, Timeform Perspective still had an odds/percentages table and written explanation in its standing matter that I had been responsible for. Please don’t tar all the "racing media" with the same brush.
That said, Tanya has a point that many viewers/readers/listeners are likely to be baffled by the precise details, if not the concept, and those that are not do not need to have the same point rammed home time and time again.
The media is engaged in a balancing act between providing people with what they – the media – think is good for them and what the people want.
You can’t concentrate on the former entirely at the expense of the latter.
Someone stated earlier on that Racing Update carries the table now and again also.
So it seems some parts of the media are providing this info if people can be bothered to find it and use it
I agree Prufrock, not all the media are guilty, Timeform do still have it in their Perspective. Did not get the Sportsman very often so do not know about that.
It is the forefront of the media, the Racing Post, Channel 4 Racing, BBC, ATR and RUK who should answer. How many punters get to read the Perspective?
When John McCrirrick portrays himself as the punters saviour, SP’s, or saying trainers should tell punters about this or that etc. Yet never tells punters about something that should effect every bet he makes. That is hypocritical in my opinion.
I did say people like Richard Hoiles should be praised for trying to bring true value to the attension of viewers. But this is downgraded by the Thommo’s and Lesley Grahams of this world.
What has amazed me is that most of the racing media I have asked about the table have never heard of it. Though how many are just saying that is impossible to judge. And am surprised at the number of punters who are not interested in making an over all profit.
I would have loved to have known about it early on in my gambling. And suspect there are many punters around right now who would use it, if they only knew.I do concede there is probably a majority of punters who would not be interested, but a significant minority I believe would. The mathematics envolved is simple and surely at least 90% of viewers can follow.
I have said I do not want them to explain / show the table in every issue / programme. Just once or twice a year, is that too much to ask Prufrock?
Value Is EverythingGinger you clearly believe that this table gives you an edge in your gambling.
Gambling is a dog eat dog world its survival of the fittest, as you believe this gives you a big edge (and I will not get into an arguement about whether it does or does not), why on earth are you trying to campaign for the entire nation to know about it. By telling everybody your edge surely you are reducing your edge? Surely you should be delighted that 90% of punters do not know about it?You are entirely right Zoso (did I just say that?).
It is in my best interests, but I believe all punters deserve to be told about it. That outways my interests. But what they want to do about it is up to them.
Though what one person thinks is value will be different to the next so it should not effect me that much.
Value Is EverythingOne last thing,
It would be interesting to know what the Van Der Wheil fans think of the "table"?Value Is EverythingSomeone asked me (either on this thread or a related one) if I could put a race up i have worked out to 100%. So it would be easier for people to follow how it is done. This gives the percentage chance I believe each horse has of winning, price equivalent to that percentage, (mark up I would add on and what price I would give if I were an odds compiler).
1:40 Sandown
Kalca Mome 7.5% 13/1 (+ 1.5% mark up = 9% 10/1)
Oneway 2% 50/1 (+ 1.5% = 3.5% 28/1)
Magic Sky 13% 13/2 (+ 2% = 15% 11/2)
Natal 10.5% 17/2 (+ 2% = 12.5% 7/1)
Almaydan 22% 7/2 (+ 3% = 25% 3/1)
Publican 9.5% 10/1 (+ 2.5% = 12% 15/2)
Bleu Superbe 7.5% 13/1 (+ 1.5% = 9% 10/1)
Tanikos 21.5% 7/2 (+ 3% = 24.5% 3/1)
Vinimix De Bessy 6% 16/1 (+ 2% = 8% 12/1)I make Almaydan at 9/2 (18.2%) 4% better than my price to beat so have backed that.
Magic Sky at 8/1 (11.1%) is 2% better than my price to beat so have saved on it.
Bleu Superbe at 15.5/1 (6%) is 1.5% better so have saved on it.With an amateur on Almaydan and conditional on Magic Sky it is possible saturday punters will not shorten them up, but we shall see.
3:40 Sandown
Cerium 2.25% 40/1 (25/1), Butlers Cabin 6.75% 14/1 (10/1), Gungadu 16.5% 5/1 (9/2), Harris Bay 5.75% 16/1 (12/1), Kelami 8.25% 11/1 (17/2), Erics Charm 20% 4/1 (7/2), Irish Raptor 7% 14/1 (10/1), Caribou 7.25% 13/1 (10/1), Principe Azzuro 14.25% 6/1 (5/1), Tora Bora 1% 100/1 (40/1), My Immortal 6% 16/1 (12/1), Burntoakboy 5% 20/1 (14/1).Erics Charm is available at 5/1, 3.3% better than my working out, backed that.
Kelami is available at 20/1, 3.5% better, backed that.
Principe Azzuro at 7.4/1 is 2.3% better so have saved on it.Value Is EverythingGood luck, Ginger, I’m sure you don’t feel you need it, but at times like this Sod’s Law is bound to kick in.
Colin
Felt a bit sorry for Agnes Haddock on the ML. Someone should tell her she is missing out and not a value punter
Hi Ginge
I do wish you’d stop banging on about the table.All it is a time saving way of converting percentages into odds nothing more nothing less. It is also totally useless unless you have suffient skill to accurately assess the percentage chance of the participants in any race assessed without that the maths count for nothing because the starting point is wrong- as in the computer world rubbish in rubbish out. If you have this form reading skill basically similar to picking winners everything is fineDougal,
I was only doing what another member here asked me to do.
Is that so wrong of me?
I wish members would answer the questions I have asked.
Oh, and if you ain’t got any idea of value, you ain’t gonna make a profit. No matter how good you are at studying form. Simple as that.
Have said so many times, it ain’t a substitute for form study, it goes hand in hand.Ginge
Value Is Everything
Just joking mate have a good day……PS do you think A Brother is good value at 9/4 in the last at Haydock? 
I am sure it can get to anyone.
Our team got thrashed by the Racing Post, played our joker on the wrong round. Congratulations to the Racing Post team of Graham Dench, Craig Thaike, Lee Motershead and one other who’s name escapes me.
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