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The kg looks a cracker and a number of horses are in with a chance. Telescope looked great in the hardwicke but this is a big step up from that and he shouldn’t be favourite in my eyes. Tahgrooda look great in the oaks but is taking on the guys and the older horses now. However her weight allowance gives her every chance. Magician ran a cracker at royal ascot and now he is back at what looks his best trip he looks the one to beat for me. Let’s hope it’s run at a good lick and the front three battling it out at the end. Magicians win in the breeders cup last year was one of my fav races of last season and I hope we can see that withering run come out on top in a classic king George. I just wish more trainers would do what gosden has done as the kg used to be the mid season highlight for me. Horses like Nijinsky,monkey,generous and one of my all time favs teenoso. Great memories.
Abolutely right Edina and Ginge. What a race that will be now.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
Feel sorry for anyone who’s backed the odds-on non-runner, but it’s hardly a surprise. When the
owner
already has a filly with by far the best chance of winning the Irish Oaks – Tarfasha is currently a top price of only 5/2 – why take her on? Taghrooda can not go for both races, they’re too close together. Why not go for an even better race with what could be an exceptional filly in Taghrooda? As Joni says, surely the decision to go for the King George should be applauded? It’s good for "British Racing".
Not sure why the Taghrooda switch is cluttering up this thread. It seems pretty likely that Gosden had little or no input in the final decision. I would have thought he would have wanted to take a more gradual approach possibly ending her career with a tilt at the Arc.
This story is not about Taghrooda running in the King George. Personally, I think she will win. It is the last minute decision by connections with no prior communication. I would like to hear from someone who backed her for the Irish Oaks who thinks it is great for the Ascot race that she isn’t bolting up in Ireland.
The other question I would like to know would be one for the trainer. Assuming Gosden hadn’t known about the switch presumably he had the filly peaked to run at the weekend. How easy is it to keep her at this level or get her to peak again for a more difficult target? Successful or not, I fear her season might effectively end in the King George.
Interesting points Stilvi. I am never a fan of what I call "afterthoughts" for precisely the reason you mentioned. If a horse is trained for a particular race everything is designed and programmed to make sure that the horse can peak on that day. However these two races are just a week apart and so my guess is it won’t be so difficult to keep her on the boil for just that extra week.
I agree with you about JG wanting to take it more easy with her and build towards the Arc and you are absolutely right that this much tougher race may take so much out of her that she will have nothing left. JG has been saying all year that he likes to keep fillies with fillies for as long as he can so it must have been an interesting conversation with the Sheikh. To counter that I would point out that she is extremely lightly raced having only run 3 times in her life and there should be plenty of petrol left in the tank with a long gap between Epsom and Ascot. As Angus Gold said, she will be retired at the end of this season so it is a bold and brave shout to go for this race rather than the easier option.
I agree that it should have been made public earlier to save those brave souls who went piling in on an odds-on horse before final declarations but owners have the right to change their minds surely. We all know the dangers of ante-post betting – some you win some lose. Remember Jim Bolger and New Approach? I bet that stung a few fingers when Jim decided to run him in the Derby having said for weeks he wouldn’t.
Overall I would repeat it is a big and bold decision and can only be good for the race. And I agree with Stilvi – I think she’ll win.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
Overall I would repeat it is a big and bold decision and can only be good for the race. And I agree with Stilvi – I think she’ll win.
Sorry to be the Village Party Poop but ‘Taghrooda’ wont win the King George simply because fillies just dont win it.The day
Oh so sharp
got beat still hurts to this day and she was the 2nd best fillie I’ve seen.
Pebbles
being the best.Yes ‘Danedream’ won it a couple of years ago but that really could have gone either way.Like I say sorry for those who have backed Gosdens filly but the race will be Won by none other than
Eagle Top
now that Johnny G has supplemented him……I’m on
Trading Leather
at 25’s so at least am assured of a place!Who says E/w betting Ante-Post doesn’t pay?
Sorry to be the Village Party Poop but ‘Taghrooda’ wont win the King George simply because fillies just dont win it.
There was a relative spate of fillies winning between 1966 and 1983: Aunt Edith, Park Top, Dahlia (twice), Pawneese and Time Charter; the latter being the last until Danedream in 2012
John Gosden announces his excitement at a trio of 3yo’s running in this weekends King George in todays RP,its good for the race he says.Yes John,nothing like stating the obvious,particularly when you train all 3.
Romsdal
long term Ante-Post fav for the St leger looks like lining up now a horse big bad John said straight after the Derby was a St Leger horse…….Oh dear! Looks like another one of Johnnys U-turns,the sort of U-turn you do on the A1 on a Friday night.
Talking of such maneuvers he’s already done one with Taghrooda
but worse than that for all those who stayed loyal to the filly losing on the Irish Oaks and backing her for this have only been dealt another blow by her trainer supplementing
Eagle Top
for the race,a horse who really could rock the Apple cart.Not only will the Apples be bruised but a fair few Ante-Post punters too.No wonder selfish John is gloating this guy tips the Apple cart with no compunction for others.
John Gosden announces his excitement at a trio of 3yo’s running in this weekends King George in todays RP,its good for the race he says.Yes John,nothing like stating the obvious,particularly when you train all 3.
Romsdal
long term Ante-Post fav for the St leger looks like lining up now a horse big bad John said straight after the Derby was a St Leger horse…….Oh dear! Looks like another one of Johnnys U-turns,the sort of U-turn you do on the A1 on a Friday night.
Talking of such maneuvers he’s already done one with Taghrooda
but worse than that for all those who stayed loyal to the filly losing on the Irish Oaks and backing her for this have only been dealt another blow by her trainer supplementing
Eagle Top
for the race,a horse who really could rock the Apple cart.Not only will the Apples be bruised but a fair few Ante-Post punters too.No wonder selfish John is gloating this guy tips the Apple cart with no compunction for others.
Wow – seriously warped thought process once again Gord. Is John the first trainer to run more than one horse in a race? Is Romsdal ONLY allowed to run in the St Leger? Would you rather he didn’t supplement Eagle Top when he has said all along he would (imagine the stink you’d have caused if he hadn’t!)
Not sure about "apples" – I think "lemon" is the more suitable fruit where you are concerned.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
I’m very concerned about the way you defend the undefendable Joni,your trouble is you incredibly cant see the devious anti-Ante-Post undertones that comes from John Gosdens mouth.If Gosden was Gaddafi you’d be George Galloway.
Picture this scenario……Taghrooda
wins the Oaks like a colt and Big John tells Sheikh Hamden the Irish Oaks is a natural target,the next day
Romsdal
a lightly raced 3yo colt himself shows why Bookmakers have made him the 5/1fav for the St Leger after Gosden tells Princess Haya he’s run a race typical of a Leger horse and that would be the obvious target quote! At Royal Ascot another hugely improved chestnut colt called
Eagle Top
runs away with the King Edward in a time comparable to the best King George winners over C/D,that horse alone is good enough to avenge ‘Nathaniels’ defeat for back-back victories,he tells Lady Bamford the obvious target is back to Berkshire for the big Group 1.Now as an owner of the above 3 horses I would question what the **** Greedy draws is upto as only one horse can win and it wont be the filly now! Dont compare Gosdens greed with Coolmores as their 3 runners in a race are all jointly owned and its obvious to this judge that its a case of ensuring each Jockey recieves a healthy wage.
Gord i agree on EAGLE TOP i am on him at 8/1 to win this week.Could you see Eagle Top doing well in arc too.Also rumours KINGMAN may not run at Goodwood next week may go France instead i am still gutted over KINGMAN in 2000 guineas
Gord i agree on EAGLE TOP i am on him at 8/1 to win this week.Could you see Eagle Top doing well in arc too.Also rumours KINGMAN may not run at Goodwood next week may go France instead i am still gutted over KINGMAN in 2000 guineas
No question
Eagle top
is a serious horse Darren,he’s a bit small for my liking but he’s got a ‘Grundy’ feel about him.The Arcs a logical step forward again should he win on Saturday.
As forKingman
not running in the Sussex stakes…..
Need I say more Darren,need I? They are now saying Eagle Top will not run if the ground is "very fast"
"And Goldilocks found that Mummy Bear’s racecourse had going that was
just right
"
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Goldilocks gets ridiculous at times. You don’t get this with other trainers, not to the extent of Gosden anyway.
Kingman might not run in the Sussex – why the hell not, everyone wants to see him take on Toronado. My guess is it is code for saying "put the taps on" at Goodwood.
Eagle Top might not run if the ground is very fast – why the hell not, they were breaking track records at Royal Ascot and he won impressively there.
Please John, give it a rest, run Eagle Top, run Kingman and stop turning everything into a soap opera, there is no need for it.
There’s a well known saying in horseracing,it irks those who think the sport is straight but its called ‘Running for the Book’.Those who understand how this fantastic game is played understand that the system allows it.In days of old and funnily enough not that old Brown envelopes were handed around like betting slips,nowadays the exchanges going on are just that,done on such but for a horse to actually run for the Book means all Bookmakers need to benefit.Of course Non-triers are well policed these days and anyone caught doing so are punished harshly but its still a Grey area actually proving a horse was a blatant Non-trier.The easier option of lining the Bookies pockets is to ensure a horse is well documented in the Ante-Post lists,a few bulletins of encouraging reports and targets ensures the Ante-Post Punter keeps backing these horses.Of course ultimately the horse has to be withdrawn before the final decs stage and thats where a Trainer has to come out with a little pearler of an excuse to withdraw their horse.Some trainers are Masters at this art of deception but ultimately it works.Being the King of Ante-Post betting,I know who likes to keep on the Bookmakers side.
Imagine forking out £75000 to supplement a horse for a race before you check the weather forecast! Imagine waking up every morning to wall to wall sunshine knowing its going to stay like this for the foreseeable future and knowing your horse doesn’t like to run on ground this weather creates but fork out £75000 just for the helluv it.Worse though is doing just that,letting punters jump on then withdrawing the horse.I know you cant believe it either………Only a fool would do that! Where have they said he won’t run? I have only read Buick saying he wouldn’t want it TOO fast but not that he won’t run.
I must be missing something because where everyone sees this horrible villain who is hell bent on destroying racing and ante post betting I see a fantastic ambassador for our sport. A charming and friendly man with as much grace and dignity when he loses as when he wins. Reading his interview in the Racing Post this Sunday gave a glimpse as to his passion for racing and for the health of the industry. I THOUGHT he was popular among racing folk but, judging by this thread, I am in a minority. I can hardly believe it.
As for running three horses in the King George – well how many Group 1 races over 12f are there for gods sake?! If he thinks he has three horses that have a chance why not run them?! We would never have seen Denman v Kauto Star if all trainers behaved the way you want them to Gord! We also know that it was Sheikh Hamdan’s decision to switch Taghrooda and this surely has to be a decision we APPLAUD rather than criticise. It wasn’t like the market for the Irish Oaks had been open for very long anyway. I doubt people lost too much and if they did they should not be betting truck loads of money on an odds-on horse prior to final decs anyway!
Anyway I am clearly fighting a losing battle here so enjoy your Johnny Bashing folks and I’ll just enjoy watching him win Group 1 after Group 1 after Group 1……………
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
Where have they said he won’t run? I have only read Buick saying he wouldn’t want it TOO fast but not that he won’t run.
I must be missing something because where everyone sees this horrible villain who is hell bent on destroying racing and ante post betting I see a fantastic ambassador for our sport. A charming and friendly man with as much grace and dignity when he loses as when he wins. Reading his interview in the Racing Post this Sunday gave a glimpse as to his passion for racing and for the health of the industry. I THOUGHT he was popular among racing folk but, judging by this thread, I am in a minority. I can hardly believe it.
As for running three horses in the King George – well how many Group 1 races over 12f are there for gods sake?! If he thinks he has three horses that have a chance why not run them?! We would never have seen Denman v Kauto Star if all trainers behaved the way you want them to Gord! We also know that it was Sheikh Hamdan’s decision to switch Taghrooda and this surely has to be a decision we APPLAUD rather than criticise. It wasn’t like the market for the Irish Oaks had been open for very long anyway. I doubt people lost too much and if they did they should not be betting truck loads of money on an odds-on horse prior to final decs anyway!
Anyway I am clearly fighting a losing battle here so enjoy your Johnny Bashing folks and I’ll just enjoy watching him win Group 1 after Group 1 after Group 1……………
I was sure I read something to the effect that they wouldn’t risk Eagle Top if the ground was firm. I can’t find it now looking around but I did check it at the time before I posted here. Perhaps somebody’s quote was retracted or amended.
The point still stands that it seems ridiculous to have just boosted the hopes and confidence behind a horse when just having paid a lot of money to supplement him for a major race, only to turn right round and put a dampener on his chances by saying the ground might not suit the horse. I think it smacks of either trying to influence the course into pouring the water on, or a case of getting your excuses in early in case the horse doesn’t justify the money spent putting him into the field.
I agree that Gosden is a great trainer, he’s probably been one of the best from a punting point of view for me over the years. You could argue that, with the well bred fire power he gets, he should have perhaps put more classics in the bag and he must be wondering how Kingman failed to end his 2000 G drought this season.
I just get fed up with the constant negativity from the man. Coming into this years Oaks I felt I had picked a good horse with a good chance of pulling off the ante-post bet. Most of the ante-post fancies evaporated during the spring but John Gosden kept muttering on about the going and how it was a very open race with six potential winners at least.
You can’t tell me John Gosden didn’t know what he had sitting in a box at his yard. The horse drifted out to 5/1 on the day and came home like an odds-on shot for the most simple of wins you could hope to see in a Classic. Why not step up to mark and communicate with information that actually is of use to punters for once? Share the love and tell people that this is your best chance in many a year, instead of offering the usual, predictable spiel that, no matter how entertaining or eloquent it may be, is the equivalent of listening to paint dry, if you are exercising your ears to actually learn something that could help you pick a winner.
It’s a sport you can enjoy without a bet and I know you can’t expect trainers to be tipsters but it seems sad that the best we can hope for is downplaying the horse’s chance at each and every opportunity and endless talk of going being unsuitable.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
I just get fed up with the constant negativity from the man. Coming into this years Oaks I felt I had picked a good horse with a good chance of pulling off the ante-post bet. Most of the ante-post fancies evaporated during the spring but John Gosden kept muttering on about the going and how it was a very open race with six potential winners at least.
You can’t tell me John Gosden didn’t know what he had sitting in a box at his yard. The horse drifted out to 5/1 on the day and came home like an odds-on shot for the most simple of wins you could hope to see in a Classic. Why not step up to mark and communicate with information that actually is of use to punters for once? Share the love and tell people that this is your best chance in many a year, instead of offering the usual, predictable spiel that, no matter how entertaining or eloquent it may be, is the equivalent of listening to paint dry, if you are exercising your ears to actually learn something that could help you pick a winner.
It’s a sport you can enjoy without a bet and I know you can’t expect trainers to be tipsters but it seems sad that the best we can hope for is downplaying the horse’s chance at each and every opportunity and endless talk of going being unsuitable.
Very accurate post Steve,I cant believe for one minute Gosden will run 3 on Saturday,we’ll see!
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