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In yesterday’s Derby there was one maiden runner out of seventeen total runners. Today in the Prix du Jockey Club there are 3 maidens out of a total of fifteen runners. I’m of the view that the Classics, in particular, should be restricted to “winners only”. A Classic should remain a “Classic”, free of horses that devalue the race in the same light that geldings are prohibited mostly to protect the breeding industry.
The powers at be could consider adding a couple more qualifying or trial races at G2/G3 level in the spring and possibly at tracks that currently don’t have any group races. Undoubtedly, this will enhance such tracks visibility, add incremental revenue, and provide more opportunities to smaller operations to participate in the process thereby enhancing the credibility and reputation of the Classics overall…
If there is room for them within the safety factor and neither horse nor rider is deemed a hazard to the rest if the field, why not?
Presumably excess declarations are balloted out based on OR?
There are Maidens and Maidens.
My unraced 3yo, name of Doesntactuallyexist, lost ten lengths at the start of the Wood Ditton, he flew home and was beaten a neck, so we took up our entry in the 2,000 Guineas where he again finished strongly to be beaten a nose!
We now can’t take up our expensive entry in The Derby because he’s still a Maiden??!!
He’s by Derby winning middle-distance influence out of a middle-distance influence mare who won the Oaks!!!
Where’s this Turkoman who brought this rule in?
The man’s a dastardly cad and a bounder!
You take my point, sir?
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"An outstanding non-fictional example!
And Sun Princess was a decent Oaks winner – saw her win the St Leger at Doncaster.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"I think Snurge was a maiden when he won the St Leger.
I cannot recall if there have been any since. Maybe something trained by O’Brien might have been?
First of all Ian, are you absolutely sure that I’m a “sir”?…LOL! Seriously, I take your point very well. You gave a fictional example, ok. So here’s my own: 15 runners in the Derby or the Oaks and all are maidens, class race? Extreme example, yes. Highly improbable, yes. But random events do occur in this world…
Well the Turkoman I remember – and saw! – dead heated in the November Handicap on a particularly gloomy day at Doncaster and I’m pretty sure he was a male horse!
Apologies if I’m wrong, madam!
Thanks for taking my post in good humour and in the spirit it was intended.
I think you just can’t legislate for it and CAS gave the perfect example why.
A maiden won the Oaks by TWELVE lengths and it wasn’t even bad ground.
Sun Princess was better than Snowfall IMO and under your rules she couldn’t have run.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Sorry Turkoman, but I’m not a fan of this suggestion. Field sizes are often small enough already without banning horses from running for unnecessary reasons.
There are loads of maidens who have performed with credit in the Classics, and some very good examples have already been given in this thread.
“I think Snurge was a maiden when he won the St Leger.”
Factually correct of course but he was a maiden only by courtesy of some French stewards.
The horse won the Critérium de Saint-Cloud by 3 lengths in 1989 only to be controversially and mysteriously disqualified.
Two Irish Guineas winners won their classics on racecourse debut.
Ballymore collected the 2,000 in 1972 and Lady Capulet obliged in the 1,000 in 1977. The latter was a half-sister to Drone, described as a ‘successful breeding stallion’.
Not to be prurient or anything but perhaps Drone could elaborate on this.
Rather than “maidens” – there are maidens with good ratings – if anything it may be better to have a rating cut off point for horses that are exposed as poor. To stop the social runner who weakens badly and creates problems in running for others. Am not talking about the 100/1 shots or even some of the 999/1 shots, but the sort that are only 999/1 because 9999/1 is not available. Could have a caveat that any horse with a “p” or “P” in Timeform is allowed to run whatever the rating. Seem to remember Terimon starting 500/1 and finishing 2nd to Nashwan, but he had a “p” and suspect he’d have had a good enough rating to get in anyway.
Value Is Everything“Could have a caveat that any horse with a “p” or “P” in Timeform” is allowed to run.
Worst idea ever. Timeform and their big P’s and little p’s haha.
If not wanting Timeform’s involvement, could just have a caveat of if below a certain rating the horse must have shown a best ever Official Rating last time out. ie Is currently on the upgrade.
Value Is EverythingNot an issue worth wasting time on. When was the last time a social runner crated problems dropping back?
Doubt the BHA would be too happy at returning entry fees to horses not “qualifying” either.
If I owned a decent horse in a classic the more bad horses in the race as opposed to good horses the better.Good points Yeats – you’ve persuaded me – not worth bothering with.
Anyway so far, the jockeys riding “social runners” have been sensible enough to sit out the back and not get too involved in the race itself..Value Is EverythingNot to be prurient or anything but perhaps Drone could elaborate on this
“An imposing grey, Drone was lengthy and strong with a well laid back shoulder, powerful hindquarters and a strong hind leg. He could be faulted for slightly short pasterns and shelly feet. He had a difficult disposition as a stallion but usually passed on good bone and substance, but also passed on less than ideal feet”
A fair assessment
by Sir Gaylord (USA) ex Cap and Bells (USA), by Tom Fool (USA)
Make of that what you will
with thanks to:
http://www.americanclassicpedigrees.com/drone.html
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