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I notice on the news today that Tendai Biti has been released on bail of the paltry amount of One Thousand Billion Dollars or as we might say – one hundred guineas
On the one hand this must be the largest figure ever set as a bail charge in history and on the other hand, in real terms, one of the lowest figures ever charged for bail
If this doesn’t demonstrate what a colossal disaster the hitler-tached despot has caused, there’s plenty of other examples that do
If it wasn’t such a sad subject, I could start a book on prices for when Mugabe will go, for each month over the next year – I can’t see him still there in a year, he’ll be sunning it up in Qatar or Argentina or the like
I’m sure they could find him a place in Islington or somewhere. You never know, in time, he might get hero status like the terrorist Mandela.
Dave,
People seem to conveniently forget that Mandela in 1961 was the leader of the ANC’s armed wing.
Regards- Matron
I was thinking about Mugabe tonight after watching the news and I was wondering, is he a typical black African leader?
http://www.amazon.co.uk/State-Africa-Hi … 186&sr=8-1
Frankly, he may not be typical, but hes not atypical.
The book detailed above is a fascinating and balanced read on the whole subject. The author clearly does not have an axe to grind but the inescapable conclusion is that the vast majority of african leaders over the past 50 years have not been fit to govern. Their incompetence and plain stupidity would be funny if it wasnt so tragic.
This has been amply illustrated by the pathetic and laughable response to Mugabes dismal regime by his neighbours over the past few years. My favourite episode was Angola’s leader holding meeting with mugabe for "economic advice"
Mugabe has managed to wreck a functioning state. A bollard would have been a more competent leader. But whether that is worse than some of the incredible attrocities and horrific leaders (thinking Zaire as one example) that this continent has seen…im not sure
As for Saint Nelason, he is fawned over because he didnt completely screw things up and didnt keep dead babies in his fridge. Any as Ricky Gervais suggested… hes proof that "prison works"
If you consider Mandela a terrorist, then you must consider the Aparteid state of South Africa to have been a legitimate regime. Even the ruling Whites eventually conceded that it wasn’t, and that it was indeed an abberation.
Mandela is fawned over, because despite being banged-up for 26 years, he resorted to Peace & Reconciliation upon his reloease, rather than vengeance. Only a clown would bracket him with the likes of Mugabe.
I did like Gervais’ line about prison working though.
Mandela is fawned over, because despite being banged-up for 26 years, he resorted to Peace & Reconciliation upon his reloease
Without taking anything away from him, wasnt that the obvious option anyway? What was to be gained from revenge?
I dont dispute hes a fine enough leader, but this virtual sainthood fostered upon him because he took the practical option has always been over the top in my opinion
As for his presumed innocence in relation to terrorism, I well remeber him unquivocally praising and supporting the IRA a few years back
Looking at the continent as a whole, clivex, the most obvious option for him to take upon gaining power would appear to be; repression of any dissent, the slow strangulation of democracy, creeping despotism leading to all-out dictatorship, before lining his pockets with the theived assets of the State.
Mandela not only chose not to take this path, he ensured that the fledgling democracy of South Africa was able to flourish, by being the focal-point for a national mood of reconciliation and forgiveness.
It is for these reasons that he is feted as a great Statesman. Without his leadership, I’m reasonably certain that SA would have descended into complete and utter chaos.
As for your statement about his support for the IRA, I fail to see the relevance of it, and either way, it most certainly doesn’t make Mandela himself a terrorist.
gaining power would appear to be; repression of any dissent, the slow strangulation of democracy, creeping despotism leading to all-out dictatorship
He didnt need to do anything with democracy did he?
Looking at the continent as a whole, clivex
Why? why should it only be judged against the standards of Congo or Rwanda?
His biggest achivement was erarning the respect of the white population. I would agree that that was vital and perhaps unexpected
Certainly when you look at the current dreadful leadership there…
He didnt need to do anything with democracy did he?
I find the suggestion that South Africa was in any way democratic during the Apartheid years somewhat puzzling, clivex, though for the purposes of this exchange, let’s just agree that it was.
My point is that it could all have gone horribly wrong, and only a man of Mandela’s integrity was capable of making post-Apartheid South Africa work.
Despite all of it’s obvious flaws, thanks largely to Mandela, South Africa is a functioning and stable state, in a part of the world that is generally ruled by despots, thugs and wankers.
No mean achievement, in my book.
One of my mates lived in south africa, after having to flea (what was then) Rhodesia very quickly. His father was an officer (judge jury and exocutioner) in the Rhodesian Mounted Police which were absolutely hated by the "Blicks". My friend, in question is possibly the most racist person I have ever met, and even he says Mandela is a great man. That said a lot to me about the change of attitude he had brought about in south africa.
I cant help but feel that what he achieved in later life more than made up for what he had done in his youth.
I have to agree about Gervais’s line aswell, that was brilliant.
find the suggestion that South Africa was in any way democratic during the Apartheid years somewhat puzzling, clivex, though for the purposes of this exchange, let’s just agree that it was.
Where did i say that?
I clearly meant that didnt need to meddle with democracy because he was guaranteed a huge mandate.
Either way I suspect that he wouldnt have "meddled" anyway
Im not going there…
But i struggle to understand what "freedoms" AQ are fighting for
Freedom to slaughter all non believers, homosexuals, communists like grasshopper and jews i suppose
Freedom to beat their women]
and so on
AQ. I like it. Very catchy. Very New Labour.
Whilst freedom fighting may be in the eye of the beholder, I think its fair to say that AQ (its so much easier than wrestling with all those vowels!) might struggle to fulfill the criteria for their ‘freedom fighting’ grant from the Department of Employment.
Obviously, which groups qualify as freedom fighters depends on which side of the argument you are. Perhaps groups who have widespread support in a particular community for a particular cause in a specific place against a specific government have a better chance of ending up in the ‘goodies’ column. Particularly if they win, of course.
The difference between a freedom fighter and a terrorist depends on who wins.
Grass the aparthied state in South Africa wasnt so much different to the situation in the US during and before the 1960’s. Martin Luther King and Co didnt turn to terrorism to justify their aims but saw a transition to equality through rational debate and democracy.
What really makes me laugh about this whole sorry mess, is that south africa have passed laws that take property and jobs away from people based on their skin colour. Last week they had to re-classify Chinese people as black, so they didnt get treat the same as the whites .. it will ultimately lead to the economic down fall of the country. Its taken Zimbabwe 30 years to be wrecked, South Africa may take a little while longer.
Another point that should be made I feel, is that Mugabe hasnt suddenly turned into a baddie. He has always been a brutal dictator from the day he was given power at the Lancaster House agreement. I was watching Tutu on the telly yesterday saying ‘it was a shame that Mugabe had gone bad’. He wasnt saying that in the early eighties when he was carrying out a genocidal war against his own people was he? No, he was saying what a great bloke he was.
I see Winnie Mandela has disappeared from view, I wonder what happened to her?
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