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19 – 9! Fully deserved and I don’t begrudge it. Well done.
However, as a British racing fan who watches British Jumps racing everyday I think being slaughtered at a British festival renders a lot of British racing viewed throughout the season meaningless and flabby. How has this situation come about?
1). A favourable exchange rate, better prize money and the competitiveness/quality (rather than quantity) of Irish races are factors in a long term concerted effort by HRI to attract owners with the biggest pockets to invest in keeping more of the better home breds in Ireland and purchase the better French bred prospects. Now we are seeing not just one dominant yard but two with Jessica Harrington and several other skillful Irish trainers also chipping in.
2). Public pressure put upon the British handicapper by powerful forces in Irish racing may consciously or subconsciously be affecting marks given.
3). The excess of British AW tracks and racing and its relative prize money is dissuading owners from sending as many (quality) horses over hurdles and persuading several dual purpose trainers to concentrate more on the AW than Jumping during the winter.
4). Most Irish racing takes place on soft/heavy and many horses improve for the better surface at Cheltenham that has prevailed since the drainage was improved.
What do other people think? And what can be done? AW tracks are not going to be closed and Cheltenham will not be turned back into a bog. I feel the BHA need to immediately invest hugely in prize money for Jumps races at all levels and possibly look at reducing the number of class 5 races. Where do they get this money from? I can only suggest partly by diverting and redistributing it from the Flat, after all Cheltenham is the biggest festival of either code and the Grand National the biggest race. Even then it will take a few years for this to have an effect and save us from further 9-19 home defeats!
Does prize money matter to the likes of Ricci, O’Leary, Potts, Wylie? Probably not.
If there is one lesson for the Brits here it’s to relegate the festival and rearrange their training regimes and entry plans around other good meetings.
The Irish have perfected the art of preparing horses for the Cheltenham Festival. Whatever is done to try to counter their dominance, they’ll probably find a way to adjust and reassert.
There is another possible reason.
Three Irish yards all suddenly hit exceptional form all at the same time and couldn’t have timed it better.
Irish water/turf must have more minerals in mid March. :lol:Value Is Everything‘sun on their backs’ and all that Ginge!
…And all the other cliches, Ben.
Value Is EverythingAnother way of phrasing this question may be to say Alan Potts, Graham Wylie , Tony Bloom and Rich Ricci are all UK based, why do they have their horses who won this week trained in Ireland?
‘sun on their backs’ and all that Ginge!
…And all the other cliches, Ben.
“he just comes alive in the spring” how dumb do they think we are
I just did a quick count so I could be slightly wrong but there are 10 handicaps, so 40 places. GB got 27 places and Ireland got 13. Ireland got 7 wins from the 13 and GB got 3 from the 27. So was it just the luck on the week that meant Irelands got on the right side of the wins in the handicaps? The other thing that has to be considered is that an Irish trainer won’t send over a horse to run in a handicap if it has no chance or is out of form because why would you go to the hassle of travelling, whereas it is more likely that a British trainer will just run an out of form horse or one that has no chance, therefore its reasonable to suggest that the strike rate of Irish horses in handicaps should be significantly higher than the percentage of Irish runners
Between Ricci, JP & Gigginstown they are able to buy all the best horses that come on the market now. Have you seen how much some P2P horses are going for at the sales?
All about money now, and with JP joining up with Magniers they will end up miles in front of the UK in two or three years. Apart from a few good races in the UK this year i have much prefered following the Irish racing to be honest.
How many Uk horses will go to Punchestown this year, maybe ten at the most.
Does anyone know who people like Anthony Bromley buy for these days? I ask the question because we overheard a conversation on Tuesday of someone saying ‘does Anthony buy for you these days’ the answer being ‘no’ [don’t know who the people were].
Another point which I think is relevant is the amount of races in Britain compared to Ireland. Take an average week with two similar groups of 100-123 rated hurdlers, one group in Britain and the other in ireland. In Ireland there might be two races a week for these horses. In Britain there might be 8 races a week for those horses. If the Irish bunch ran across the two races in Ireland there would only be two winners whereas in Britain 8 of their group would be winners. Therefore in terms of handicap marks this is how British marks become inflated. Winners probably go up 5/6 pounds on average. Therefore 8 British horses will go up 5/6 whereas only 2 of the Irish will go up 5/6.
Another point which I think is relevant is the amount of races in Britain compared to Ireland.
That’s an excellent point, Wexford.
The fact that there are more winners in the UK, and therefore more horses getting their ratings raised, also means that other horses will be going up when they subsequently beat these winners or run them close. The obvious solution would be to have less racing on these (British) shores, but we all know that that ain’t gonna happen.
However the points I’ve made only serve to answer why the Irish are winning more handicaps.
They don’t explain why the Irish have consistently more of the Grade 1 winners. In grade 1 races the score this year is 8-5 to Ireland.
Last year the score was also 8-5 in the grade 1’s while in 2015 it was again 8-5.Yes the power of the big owners in Ireland explains a lot, but McManus had 3 winners this week with 2 of them trained in England, he had 10 places in total, 8 trained in Britain with only two with Irish trainers (both in the cross country).
Michael Buckley has horses in Britain and Ireland, so does Alan potts. Alan Potts had 14 horses run at the festival. 8 trained in Britain and 6 trained in Ireland. The 2 winners came from Jessica Harrington so surely if Potts buys another few top class animals he is more likely to send them to the stable that’s providing him with the success? Buckley’s winner came from Jessica Harrington too so again that puts her in a good position to receive more from him.
So we just give up Joe? My point is that Britain has the best festival, the biggest race and should do more to excel.
I wonder do UK based owners have their horses trained in Ireland (and in their wives names) for tax reasons?
Good observations TWM & Gladiateur.
I suppose Anthony Bromley buys for who pays him the most, Moehat, efforts must be made to entice the wealthiest owners (back) to British trainers. As things stand (British racing favouring quantity over quality) what must the Potts be thinking? They switch several horses from Ireland to the Tizzards and none are sighted while they enjoy great success with those still trained in Ireland!
3). The excess of British AW tracks and racing and its relative prize money is dissuading owners from sending as many (quality) horses over hurdles and persuading several dual purpose trainers to concentrate more on the AW than Jumping during the winter.
Interesting point. During the run up to the Champion Hurdle, I did rue the dearth of top 2m British hurdlers – and where are the modern day Royal Gait/ Alderbrook type of horse. Either running on the A/W or being prepared for the Dubai carnival…..??
As for the Festival; the bigger it has become, the greater the ‘damage’ to the rest of the season. Everything is about the ‘4 days in March’. Gd1 races used as ‘prep’ races….It’s a hard job to change that attitude.
It’s similar in motorsport to the Le Mans 24 Hour race; there is a World Championship, but all anybody cares about is the ONE race in June. It’s a huge strength, but also a weakness.
Domesday Book trained here now was handicapped on his Irish form,He could be classed as an Irish winner. So it could be the Irish horses are be due a few pounds rise.
I thought Thomas Crapper was well handicapped and ran his race but he was left for dead in the closing stages of his race.
You would be brave to have a big bet on a British horse in a handicap next year.If you go to back a certainty always buy a return ticket.
This Irish v British thing that pervades Cheltenham is tiresome and a tad nauseating
Racing has generally had a rather pleasing indifference to which country the horses and connections are from, welcoming good horses to compete in races from all parts: England to Ireland, France, Germany, USA etc, shuffle and deal in any order you like
Applaud and admire the winning horse. It doesn’t know who owns, trains and rides it; and I don’t care
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