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Not a bad way to win a G1: doesn’t matter if on purpose or not. Just give the horse on your outside a proper bump, make sure that he’ll lose at least two places and just stay on your horse and make sure you’re first past the post. Nothing can happen to you. Well done Frankie and thanks for the flying dismount! The race was fun to watch.
Not a bad way to win a G1: doesn’t matter if on purpose or not. Just give the horse on your outside a proper bump, make sure that he’ll lose at least two places and just stay on your horse and make sure you’re first past the post. Nothing can happen to you. Well done Frankie and thanks for the flying dismount! The race was fun to watch.
Not sure what your point is Ruby.
First you say it does not matter whether it was on purpose or not – and then everything else suggests you think it does matter.
Most people believe Golden Horn would’ve won anyway.
Value Is EverythingWhat they should do is give the rivals a good bump just as the stalls open, never gets mentioned afterwards other than the odd comment of unlucky had an early bump.
Blackbeard to conquer the World
Yep, that’s how Bayern got away with it winning the Breeders Cup last year and we know how strict them American muthers are!!
Get rid of the opposition early.There is always going to be a bit of rough and tumble in horse racing, that’s the nature of the beast and the game.
We all know what the rules are going in, well perhaps with the exception of the ATR Irish pundits.
Watching the race again a few times since, both horses start to get asked for maximum effort and briefly I thought that Free Eagle might prevail. However, thinking back to the Eclipse it was only late on that Golden Horn really got going and we can recall that Free Eagle was running on fumes at the end of his Royal Ascot win. Even though he probably wasn’t 100% that day, you just wonder how well he would have seen it out in the latter stages today.
John Gosden said Golden Horn swerved from a shadow and it then looked as if Free Eagle sort of went up Golden Horn’s hind quarters as he drifted in slightly at the same time. It was unlucky, because his momentum was checked but looking at it a few times since Free Eagle never really picks up again the way some people seem to be saying. He made little inroads really on the 1-2 for a while and perhaps closed very fractionally right at the death.
Swerving has probably cost Golden Horn some momentum at a key stage but I think he does well to keep finding at the front and doing enough to repel them. I feel Golden Horn would probably have won anyway but I can understand why people might feel the opposite.
I thought it was pretty poor crack for Gosden to say he felt Found was always the danger, I believe Free Eagle is worthy of more respect than that.
It’s a shame it panned out the way it is but Golden Horn remains a horse who has come from relative obscurity going into the winter, into the horse of the year barring the blip in the Juddmonte, where the idea of running a pacemaker backfired in spectacular fashion.
In the aftermath Gosden seemed keen to point out that he doesn’t want Jack Hobbs to end up tackling Golden Horn in the Arc unless the ground is soft. In that event Jack Hobbs could well be rerouted to the Champion Stakes. Looking at the Champion Stakes betting I see horses who won’t run if it is soft and I see horses who are unlikely to be suited by the same ground. Golden Horn will surely not run in the Arc and The Champion, so that leaves us assuming that Jack Hobbs will probably be favourite in a soft ground Champion Stakes. Cirrus Des Aigles makes zero appeal after an appalling effort today and looking at the race you would make it between Jack Hobbs, Found and Free Eagle in those circumstances, assuming Free Eagle takes his chance on the soft.
I prefer the chances of the lightly raced Jack Hobbs and the possibility he could gallop them into the ground in really testing conditions. I think 8/1 is well worth risking that you won’t get a run. Let’s face it, I had 16/1 on Storm The Stars and the way he ran, it might as well have been a non-runner anyway.
Champion Stakes Jack Hobbs 8/1 (Hopefully no stewards enquiry, other than why he was ever 8/1
)Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
This contest provided a similarly unsatisfactory conclusion as the St Leger, but it was more of an open-and-shut case. There was no way Golden Horn would – or should – lose the race. It would have been interesting if Free Eagle had finished second, but it’s ridiculous to suggest an amended result when they all raise further questions:
1) Why should Golden Horn be placed behind Found when she obtained the best possible position?
2) Why should Free Eagle be placed ahead of Found when she did nothing wrong?It’s a rare scenario and, sadly, one of those incidents you just have to accept and move on because any amendments to the rule book would result in more arguments…and an end to the ‘first past the post’ rule in most betting shops!
The only debate worth having is whether or not Golden Horn was a fortuitous winner. From a sporting perspective, I’m of the opinion that Free Eagle would have won. You could see that he lost momentum (stride shortened and slowed briefly) before lengthening again near the finish. A lot has been made of Golden Horn’s stamina, but it has often been the opinion of connections that Free Eagle will be at his very best over twelve furlongs.
On the subject of interpreting the rules , I think it’s a ridiculous notion that we should have ‘universal rules’ in horse racing. Each country has a respective style, and rules should be introduced to serve the best interests of the sport in each country. For example, American racing is competed exclusively on flat, oval tracks, and the emphasis is very much on fractions. As a result, there is a very different approach to riding a race.
Trying to consolidate the rules of racing and translating those rules to, for example, the UK, where we have a variety of idiosyncratic tracks would be futile. Any jockey will tell you that each country presents new challenges due to respective styles and course configurations, so how can we have a universal rule book when such differences exists?
Variety is the spice of life, and I have no desire for horse racing to become an ‘Orwellian’ state! :-D
This guy is a machine. All he does is work out and pick winners. Talk about fit. You should see him without his shirt off, serious side of beef.
Free Eagle was going to beat Golden Horn in my opinion and it should have been upheld.
While I can accept the usual bumping in a race, I felt that this kind of interference was quite severe. Plus it cost Free Eagle 2nd place. It occurred pretty late in the race and therefore the chance for the bumped horse to recover is quite slim.
That is my point and I’m not mentioning Gosdens post-race comment that they only had Found to beat.But it was a bit of a freak incident with the horse swerving the shadow.
A bit like a horse over the jumps stumbling over the last and obstructing another horse costing that one a place, no difference imo.Blackbeard to conquer the World
Free Eagle was going to beat Golden Horn in my opinion and it should have been upheld.
I have watched the race a load of times now.
I actually originally felt that Golden Horn was taking the race by the scruff of the neck when he started his run up the rail. I felt he was going to finish strongly and win with a bit in hand.
It appears to me that Golden Horn started hanging fire a bit in the lead up to him swerving across. Whether something was bothering him that ultimately made him swerve is a possibility I think. Anyway as he swerves across he loses momentum and Free Eagle clatters into his rear end losing him momentum. At the precise moment the interference occurs, Found is finishing off well enough to draw almost level with Golden Horn at that point and she gets past Free Eagle. From that point Golden Horn seem to have got his act back together and he gets past Found on the run in with Frankie actually able to drop his hands close home. Meanwhile Free Eagle doesn’t make any real inroads into the other two horses.
The rules mean that it has to be certain that Free Eagle would have finished ahead and while you might think he would have I doubt many people would stake their life on it. Just one of those things. Many people felt Free Eagle was lucky that The Grey Gatsby didn’t get going till too late at Royal Ascot. This time he was unlucky. That’s the swings and roundabouts of racing.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
The fact that there is so many opinions on the race shows what a tough job the stewards have. As Kevin Blake said on atr it doesn’t seem right that golden horns antics meant free eagle lost any chance of winning and had free eagle finished second the stewards may well have awarded him the race. What can be done to rectify situations is anybody’s guess but it did seem a hollow victory for golden horn. Everybody also overlooked a cracking run by found and golden horn was not pulling away from her which suggests to me that over 12f it could be a close call between the two.Found each way for the arc could well be a cracking bet.
The fact that there is so many opinions on the race shows what a tough job the stewards have. As Kevin Blake said on atr it doesn’t seem right that golden horns antics meant free eagle lost any chance of winning and had free eagle finished second the stewards may well have awarded him the race. What can be done to rectify situations is anybody’s guess but it did seem a hollow victory for golden horn. Everybody also overlooked a cracking run by found and golden horn was not pulling away from her which suggests to me that over 12f it could be a close call between the two.Found each way for the arc could well be a cracking bet.
When the interference occurred, Found was more or less level with Golden Horn. By the finish Golden Horn had the race safe in command and Frankie was able to drop his hands in the final strides. I would be surprised if she got as close to him over a mile and a half.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
There wasn’t a lot the stewards could do in this instance, it just has to go down as an unfortunate incident. I do feel though that Free Eagle lost more than just momentum.
The brakes had to be put on and it looked like Pat Smullen had a half second thought to canter him home to emphasise the interference.
I honestly thought Free Eagle was winning that race but we will never know and I hope we see him again soon.I don’t think found got to within a length of golden horn having watched it again and there was only just over a length at the line. Found came from a long way back and I really think she is a player in the 10/12f end of season races. Like to see her go to the breeders cup. I don’t know if she is being kept in training but I believe legatissamo won’t be so hopefully that means we will see found next season. Love to see gh and free eagle go head to head again as I just have that wee feeling free eagle may just beat him.
I don’t think found got to within a length of golden horn having watched it again and there was only just over a length at the line. Found came from a long way back and I really think she is a player in the 10/12f end of season races. Like to see her go to the breeders cup. I don’t know if she is being kept in training but I believe legatissamo won’t be so hopefully that means we will see found next season. Love to see gh and free eagle go head to head again as I just have that wee feeling free eagle may just beat him.
Looked to me that she did. Here are three photos.
First is just after the interference, the second further up the run in and the third right at the line as Frankie drops his hands with the race won:-
There is a little bit of camera angle to factor in but a bit of Euclid and Pythagoras would seem to suggest Golden Horn drew away and it is actually tangible to the eye in the last few strides.
The pictures are photos of stills from a You Tube video so apologies for the lack of slide rule quality imagery here at Caution Labs PLC.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
The Timeform view on the interference was as follows:-
Derby and Eclipse winner Golden Horn restored his reputation with success in the Irish Champion Stakes. The interference he caused with Free Eagle didn’t alter the result, or not the winner at any rate as he was similarly impeded by the impact and yet was striding away from filly (and fellow three-year-old) Found at the line.
Also on the Timeform webpage is their rating that has Irish Leger winner Order Of St George on 129p with the p symbol nudging him ahead of Gleneagles on their ratings. I reckon you would have got big odds on that outcome after this years St James Palace stakes.
Timeform believe Order Of St George would have hosed the Leger and I believe that this was the race the O’Brien horse should have contested all along, as a St Leger worth putting on your CV, instead of the Irish version full of old slow horses.
In the same article, Timeform have Emotionless rated 123p one ahead of Air Force Blue on 122p. I prefer the form of Air Force Blue, I think it is deeper and more certainly established. Ibn Malik is hard to weigh up for me as runner up in the Champagne. Charlie Hills seemed to take comfort from his colt having finished a lot further ahead of Richard Hannon’s Palawan but the Hannon team have had several who have disappointed this year in terms of going forward. Palawan has had a lot of outings this year and this may well have been him telling the trainer that he has had more than enough, certainly in this grade of race anyway.
Air Force Blue has been 2/1 for the Dewhurst a few times this week and that seems big to me if he lines up. Perhaps part of the seemingly generous odds is the fact that O’Brien has 13 entered in the race. If he wants to win the Dewhurst, he should note that he only has one horse entered who is capable of winning it.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
It can only be guesswork as to what might have happened if there had been no interference in the Irish champion and it’s all about opinions as Jamie lynch said on atr today. Emotionless,s rating reminds me of time tests inflated figure. Air Force blue is improving rapidly and will be even better next year and to me is 4 or 5 pounds ahead at the moment. Order of St George was mighty impressive and the manner of the win leaves ballydoyle with a tricky poser as he seems better than a top stayer. I hope they go for the stayers race at ascot and then look at the top 12f races next season although given his standing now they may be tempted to go for the arc or even the breeders cup. An amazing weekend for the obriens and ballydoyle with so many group one winners. I wonder if one trainer has done what he did over the weekend.
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