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Im not sure what all that is supposed to demonstrate grimes. Argentina is not seen as a left wing economy. Its had its economic problems but remains a capitalist state, not a socialist one
The fact that certain workers are compartively worse off than before (debatable) is not a signal that the system has failed. If necessary that can be addressed within the capialist system. Its the alternatives that failed. They are finished
Im not sure what all that is supposed to demonstrate grimes. Argentina is not seen as a left wing economy. Its had its economic problems but remains a capitalist state, not a socialist one
The fact that certain workers are compartively worse off than before (debatable) is not a signal that the system has failed. If necessary that can be addressed within the capialist system. Its the alternatives that failed. They are finished
Clivexx.If the workers are worse off then it is a capitalist system if better off a socialist system.Simple as that.I know of no capitalist system whose aim is to advnce the lot of the workers.
i know of no socialist system where the "workers" have been better off than in western european, australasian or american societies. Not just in economic terms but even more so in terms of personal freedom or human rights
Interesting article:
Interesting you should bring that up. I thought you might be more circumspect.
The workers of Ireland,Greece,Portugal,Spain,Italy and many other countries are reaping the rewards of their labors now thanks to the kindness of capitalism which government refuses in those countries to hold a plebacite on the outcome of the failed capitalist system.Whereas the workers of Sweden,Norway Iceland seemed to be doing OK.Even Iceland seems to be better off from rejecting the debt imposed by private enterprise banks on the people*.But I am sure you can point out the benefits accrued to Russian workers from the new capitalist system.Incidentally the benefits that the workers in the US gained from democracy were dragged from the bulldog teeth of the capitalists through long suffering slave wages and organised labor.Not a benefit of the "system". If you follow "American "politics right now they are clawing back the benefits gained in the last fifty years by the labor movement.But for the taxpayers in the USA the whole system would have collapsed.As for the workers in capitalist south America there is no need to speak about it.Incidentally I bet more workers in Cuba own their homes than in Ireland today.
But I will be silenced by the weight of your arguements.*http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Iceland-Shows-Default-Doesn-dg-2638407258.html
What do you think of this, then? It makes an awful lot of sense to me. Part of the outrage of runaway corporatism socialising losses and privatising profits.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree … lders-debt
A MUST READ!
Even Iceland seems to be better off from rejecting the debt imposed by private enterprise banks on the people
Thats simply not true
nc
identally I bet more workers in Cuba own their homes than in Ireland today.
Really? Andy. No one from Cuba is going to find out are they? an irishman can visit Cuba but no Cuban can GO ANYWHERE
if you ever need to know which system works and which doesnt consider that and the berlin wall
end of
I believe there are Cuban doctors working in many parts of the 3rd world.Does that count? They offered to provide medical help during the Kathrina hurricane in New Orleans but were rejected by the proud US.Quite a few US students study medicean in Cuba also I believe.Correct me if I am wrong.Any country subject to the restrictions of travel imposed on Cuba by the US would be expected to go down hill.Right now over ten million people in the US unemployed by the capitalist system.Hand outs, welfare, dole, most employed at minimum wage.Not a pretty sight as we drive out for dinner on a Friday night.Good thing service industries are still thriving.Dry cleaners, oil changers,restaurants etc etc etc.still there for us.
I think you will also find there are doctors from other countries working in the third world too
Frankly if you think that the cuban economic model has worked and the US failed you are off your head. The average US citizen has a standard of living that cubans cannot even imagine.As i say again, cuba has to wall people in but the us has to wall people out. What is difficult to understand about that?
The trouble with our ‘capitalist’ system however is that it has been shown not to be capitalist.
In a capitalist system the banks would not have been propped up with millions of taxpayers money. Instead their investors (and yes, savers) would have carried the can a la Lloyds names. However the rich and powerful of this country learned from the Lloyds debacle that they must not lose out again. So it appears the economy is now apparently being run for the benefit of keeping bust banks afloat.
Hence we now have is a system where losses are socialised and profits are privatised, enabling multinationals to get ever more large and powerful and their executives to reward each other accordingly.
While Cuba does have a great Health System.
It does not have a great standard of living. Obviously the USA blockade for many decades did nothing but harm the Cuban people but the Cuban people are a different breed to us. Their more laid back easy going kind of folk. Sure you had the anti-castro cuban’s in the 60s that wanted Fidel removed from power but did so from their new Ivory tower in the U.S.A.
A Capitalist system is a proper economic model. We can’t complain when things go wrong as that is the model we have decided to govern our lives.
I would be a strong fiscal conservative and low taxes side of the argument. I believe strongly in a small goverment control of the economy and for vast amounts of the country to be privatised.
Socialism has more its benefit’s in terms of mindset of the Human race but its too open to deep corruption. Far too much money is being wasted on lazy people who refuse to get a job.
I must also say i am would take fiscal conservative idea right to the heart of the Defence.
Its just plain nonsense the money that is spent on Weapons. Its just foolish. The Military Industrial complex has been sown all across the USA and is infecting the country since the early 50’s and future president Eisenhower warned of the Military’s growing power. JFK tried to take it on and was killed for it by the shadow agents in the CIA who had no sort of moral compass.
The trouble with our ‘capitalist’ system however is that it has been shown not to be capitalist.
In a capitalist system the banks would not have been propped up with millions of taxpayers money. Instead their investors (and yes, savers) would have carried the can a la Lloyds names. However the rich and powerful of this country learned from the Lloyds debacle that they must not lose out again. So it appears the economy is now apparently being run for the benefit of keeping bust banks afloat.
Hence we now have is a system where losses are socialised and profits are privatised, enabling multinationals to get ever more large and powerful and their executives to reward each other accordingly.
Don’t confuse Clivexx with elementary facts, Dolphin, there’s a good chap.
and dont confuse Grimes with any sort of sense of reality at all. Hes too busy looking for tractor production figures and drawing up lists of who should be sent to labour camps
I suppose he hasnt yet shown signs of the anti semitic bigoted islamist loving left thinking,so ill forgive him that
Fact is grey that the US let lehmans go and it was a mistake. its bloody awful that crap banks can be bailed out and crap businesses have to go to the wall, but its just where we are. They are in the overly fortunate position of being too important and crucial to fail. The domino effect cannot be contemplated and there isnt a serious economist who has ever argued otherwise
Many believe that bailing out lehmans would have saved a lot of trouble down the line. Browns guarantee to banks (and it was superb crisis management) prevented a lot of heartache
its not perfect but as we all know, far far better than the alternatives
I simply do not buy this different breed stuff about Cubans (or anyone else)
are there not plenty of successful hard working americans of cuban extraction showing great enterprise?
They are strongly and sometimes violently oppressed. They cannot travel and dissent of almost any kind is hammered with long prison sentences. you cannot judge the real character of anyone under such brutal circumstances
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