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I often wonder why I spend so much time and effort worrying about the current administration and future viability of the horseracing industry.
Life would be so much simpler if I just kept my head down and got on with my own job and the likes of Paul Roy, Nic Coward and even Paul Dixon would be much happier if I kept my oars in my own boat and left them to get on with running the show.
Unfortunately, I just can’t help myself and, as everyone knows, when I have an opinion, I am likely to express it, openly and regardless of whose ship I am rocking.
I am not, however, entirely alone in this. John Gosden likes to express his opinions, albeit in a rather quieter and more considered way than I do, and many of them have a striking resemblance to my own; William Haggas is equally concerned about the future of our industry and isn’t afraid to say so; and now the slumbering giant has been roused and Sir Michael Stoute has been moved to comment, in Owner & Breeder magazine, that he is ‘uneasy over what he feels is a lack of direction at the helm of the sport’.
He also feels that we are ‘overloaded with fixtures’, that ‘the whole of racing is dominated by betting’ and that ‘it is affecting the public’s enjoyment’, and he wonders ‘who is leading the industry?’
See, it isn’t only me. But it is interesting to note that those who are most vocal about the sport’s ills are generally trainers and, in particular, trainers who are actually doing pretty well despite current trends and are among the best equipped to survive any serious downturn.
It has been suggested to me, by several people, that, when Paul Roy ‘blasted certain "very senior trainers" for persistently knocking the sport’ that he was referring to me. Surely not?
He is also quoted as saying that ‘those people never have a good word to say about anything or anyone in the sport’ and I find it very difficult to think that such comments could be directed at me or any other trainer.
Interesting that it’s the guys well at the top, rather than at the bottom (or perhaps their worries and fears just aren’t quoted as much), that are worried about the future of the sport.
In Britain, 60% of flat races are handicaps.
I read a very similar statistic by a certain N Mordin just earlier today when I finally picked up this week’s Weekender. I’ll quote the stats exactly tomorrow, but 65% of races he reckoned were handicaps, way more than double the amount in France or Germany. So this leaves more than double the amount of opportunities people have of launching gambles.
I am however interested to find out the numbers of fixtures involved. If the UK holds double the amount of fixtures of either country, then it stands to reason than the handicap rate would be roughly double.
I’ve always been in favour of a Tote monopoly, at least off-course, just look at Hong Kong and France, for example.
With big pools, not being able to take a price shouldn’t be too much of a problem, and of course it will even itself out in the long run.
The example of America is misleading, however. The high prize money on offer at many tracks there is almost entirely based on cross-subsidies from the casino side (including slot machines) of racecourse operations as well as state subsidies. This is coming to an end, and the sport is in terminal decline there. In these straitened edconomic times, people are becoming increasingly fed up with racing getting handouts when other areas of the economy are having to fend for themselves.
My local racino isn’t in "terminal decline"-exactly the opposite. Just last weekend they held the first graded stakes in the 78-year history of the track. A million dollar purse, and despite a massive thunderstorm that forced the first race to be delayed by 30 minutes, the crowd (and the handle) was huge. And there’s several more race days like that http://www.hollywoodcasinocharlestown.c … 20Schedule . Of course, the track has free admission. I don’t know of any parimutuel tracks in the US, racino or not, with general admission over $6. $3 is about average.
My local racino isn’t in "terminal decline"-exactly the opposite. Just last weekend they held the first graded stakes in the 78-year history of the track. A million dollar purse, and despite a massive thunderstorm that forced the first race to be delayed by 30 minutes, the crowd (and the handle) was huge. And there’s several more race days like that http://www.hollywoodcasinocharlestown.c … 20Schedule . Of course, the track has free admission. I don’t know of any parimutuel tracks in the US, racino or not, with general admission over $6. $3 is about average.
MW, you’re making my point for me.
What was the handle on that race day and what was the total amount of prize money on offer? Do they bear any relation to one another? I don’t think so! The prize money (and what a dreary race schedule for the rest of the year btw) are being heavily subsidised by the casino side of the operation, not from racing-generated income.
For how much longer do you suppose will the state’s taxpayers tolerate the casino’s "excess" profits being diverted away from public projects like roads, schools etc and into propping up racing?
Have to admit that I’m finding it increasingly difficult to justify my love and near-100% usage of the Exchanges in the face of the (almost certain) increase in corrupt laying practices emanating from them
Would it be any better to go back to the old days of just the traditional bookmakers being able to take advantage of laying horses they knew weren’t ‘off’?
Nope, as intimated by my words beneath those you quoted:
But betting the nags was never really for those with carbon-fibre morals was it?
If choosing to involve oneself in betting horses it should be with the realization that you are willingly entering a grubby sometimes near-sordid little underworld populated by a disproportionate number of disreputables
You are correct that it wasn’t any better in the old days, just more easily hidden; hence the craw that sticks when pompous bookmakers decry the potential corruption enabled by the exchanges. Corruption, of course but it is, at worst, less opaque than when it was encrypted on the bookmakers bush telegraph
My hope was – and had long been – that exchange-generated corruption while not being wholly snuffed-out could be adequately policed and contained; but unfortunately, in my view, it does appear that it’s not being controlled and if anything is increasing
I don’t bet regularly enough these days to justify those woolly words with quantitative data I’ve gleaned myself but if the likes of Max, Glenn, Zarkava, Cavelino Rampante and others I neglect to mention who are day-in-day-out punters believe it ot be the case, that’ll do for me
If one chooses to bet, the only mindset to assume is the healthy one espoused by Robert Gibbs: that the game is straight, nose in the formbook, eyes on the TV, ears closed, pat on the back when you’re proven right, don’t make excuses when proven wrong, let the annual bottom-line be the judge – red blame yourself, black (green
) pour yourself a large oneIf one doesn’t bet with this ‘head in the sand’ mindset, don’t bet
- Total Posts 17716
For how much longer do you suppose will the state’s taxpayers tolerate the casino’s "excess" profits being diverted away from public projects like roads, schools etc and into propping up racing?
Forever. The state’s taxpayers pay virtually nothing to the state, compared against we Europeans. And that’s the way they like it.
When I visited San Francisco after the small 1990 earthquake I saw that part of the Freeway above the city had fallen to the streets below. The whole area looked like a bomb site. When I next visited, in 2005, absolutely nothing had been done about clearing it, let alone rebuilding the Freeway. And this is in one of the most public-spirited cities in the USA.
They don’t have much significant public money for "public projects". Simple as that. Nothing gets done without private enterprise. But don’t worry. We’ll be the same in a generation’s time!
The increasing focus on the All Weather here is Racing’s contribution to this creeping Americanisation. And no amount of perceived corruption (or the very obvious incipient demise of American Racing itself) is going to alter that trend.
Zarkava, when i first started out, I read all the books I could. There is a tale of a horse called Tender Heart, who won the Hunt Cup in 1980, landing what many pundits considered the greatest gamble of all time.
Writers and commentators of the time described the race in hushed tones, almost with reverence. Would they describe the Forgotten Voice tale in the same fashion? I felt the response to the colossal gamble was muted and bitter rather than awed.
As you say, Paul Roy’s involvement was a head scratcher. Every time I see or hear him, I think of the "Emperor’s New Clothes."
I guess the world has changed. People want in. People want to be part of it. They resent being left out. Public gambles, I love. This one on Amigayle today – form there for everyone to see and best of luck to her. Forgotten Voice? Dazakhee? Jack’s Revenge? No. The entire horse racing customer base was excluded in each of those cases and they resent it. In Dazakhee’s case, the owner and his entire family were celebrating like mad people in Southwell’s winners enclosure. But there was no-one outside to to cheer along with them.
Robert, regarding the apparent paradox. Its about volume and fair apportionment. People will always want to bet. $12 billion was bet on British racing two years ago. My argument is that under a pari-mutuel, the gambling and the betting of ALL those who enjoy betting on racehorses will fuel the industry much more efficiently and with "honest" incentives and rewards.
Currently, this pretty substantial annual betting fuels the bookmaking and exchange industries!
The development of this anomaly is the real paradox.
And all for fixed odds? Your approach would work far better in Hong Kong because, say, Mister Bit, would be available at 10/1 all day and you could get whatever you wanted on it. Some of the pari-mutuel betting at Happy Valley and Oaklawn would make you lick your lips. The fixed odds thing is a smokescreen in my opinion.
By the way, I do bet every day. There’s a page in Mordin’s "Betting for a Living" which explains my position.
Kingfisher, I don’t think that races are as competitive as they might be at Southwell because of the prize money. Corruption is too hard a word. There are no needlemen at Southwell, but there are plenty of trainers with the needle.
Do you remember Dettori’s seventh ride at Ascot in 1997? Of the twelve runners, only one horse got anywhere near him, the mount of Pat Eddery. This was what severely damaged Gary Wiltshire, the bookie who laid Fujiyama as it’s "correct" price of 12/1.
Which jockey wanted to be known as the pilot who foiled the Magnificent Seven?
It’s this kind of understandable expediency that I’m writing about, this kind of "whose turn is it today to pay the feed bills" approach. With a prize money injection, most of the trainers – some of whom I’ve met this year – would fight like lions.
Apologies for long post.
Hong Kong I regard as anti-gambling. Despite evident demand they strictly limit the supply side to around 80 days a year. I’m a daily bettor, no thanks.
France I regard also as anti-gambling, they limit demand side with their egregious takouts. Again no thanks.
I was taken aback when I found out that in countries who have pari-mutuel monopolies 70% of their entire handle goes into exotics. It’s as if people are saying we are being raped so we if we can’t win regularly we’ll chase the big score instead. That is not how I bet or want to.
We have never had it so good since general betting duty was got rid of. There is no better place to bet than here and now.
But before we even begin to dream about/dread a PMU introduction, I just wonder who would actually support it? Would the Government even be in favour!?
Well I’ve been digging around for an answer + the only sure-fire supporter of this would be the trainers, owners + jockeys. The owners get more money and can pay for a year’s training bills with just 1 win. The trainers get more money for 1 win than all the connections would get combined under the current system. The jockeys get higher riding fees + a better salary. Gone are the days of stopping a horse or even being linked with that sort of practice because there’s simply no point.
The horse racing industry would prosper + would bring new fans in given the entry fees, new owners would be attracted since their investment would become more ‘secure’ and the sport would never have to worry about having a bad image ever again.
Imagine how colossal Royal Ascot could be if we offered prize money that was competitive around the world? The Golden Jubilee is supposed to be part of the Global Sprint Challenge along with the July Cup + King’s Stand, yet they offer the lowest amounts of prize-money of any of the GSC races by £88k, £88k & £188k (!) respectively. What is the point of trainers and owners revolving their Grade 1 sprinter’s campaign around Ascot when they can give them June-October off before giving them a crack at sprints worth £1m+ in the Sprinter’s Stakes, BC Sprint, HK International meeting, Takamatsunomiya Kinen + Dubai World Cup night?
You’d think that the BHA would welcome this, but I find it unspeakably ridiculous that the Chairman of them is allowed to invest in basically who the culprit of the corruption is – Betfair. How on earth can the BHA not consider this to be a conflict of interest?
I firmly believe something can be done about this. We cannot just stand around + watch this amazing sport in this country go down the pan.
Kingfisher, I don’t think that races are as competitive as they might be at Southwell because of the prize money. Corruption is too hard a word. There are no needlemen at Southwell, but there are plenty of trainers with the needle.
Apologies for long post.
Dont apologise for an excellent post,it explains your position Max,i like your play on words too.
Currently I am finding ‘corruption’ plays quite profitable. For example suppose there is a low grade handicap at a minor track. Leaving aside the overround for a moment, let us suppose there are 5 runners all quoted at 4-1. Back them all BOG in the morning. By the off the non-triers will have drifted and the plot horses steamed. So you will be on at 4-1 on three horses whose real odds are the same or lower and 6-1 on two drifters. Overbroke and likely to make a profit.
Not quite so simple in practice but doable especially if some of the connections have a reputation for late swings in the betting.
My local racino isn’t in "terminal decline"-exactly the opposite. Just last weekend they held the first graded stakes in the 78-year history of the track. A million dollar purse, and despite a massive thunderstorm that forced the first race to be delayed by 30 minutes, the crowd (and the handle) was huge. And there’s several more race days like that http://www.hollywoodcasinocharlestown.c … 20Schedule . Of course, the track has free admission. I don’t know of any parimutuel tracks in the US, racino or not, with general admission over $6. $3 is about average.
MW, you’re making my point for me.
What was the handle on that race day and what was the total amount of prize money on offer? Do they bear any relation to one another? I don’t think so! The prize money (and what a dreary race schedule for the rest of the year btw) are being heavily subsidised by the casino side of the operation, not from racing-generated income.
For how much longer do you suppose will the state’s taxpayers tolerate the casino’s "excess" profits being diverted away from public projects like roads, schools etc and into propping up racing?
From Equibase:
Handle: $2,553,416
Total prize money: $1,632,050
Charles Town is one of the few tracks to experience a major increase in handle over the past few years.
Keep in mind, too, that this track has been a cheap bullring for its entire existence. The management is doing an excellent job of balancing the $5000 bread-and-butter claimers with the new open stakes program that is attracting Grade 1 horses to West Virginia.The governor is a major supporter of horse racing, and always attends the West Virginia Breeders Classic. Given the thousands of jobs that the industry generates, it will continue to be "propped up" for a very long time to come.
For how much longer do you suppose will the state’s taxpayers tolerate the casino’s "excess" profits being diverted away from public projects like roads, schools etc and into propping up racing?
Forever. The state’s taxpayers pay virtually nothing to the state, compared against we Europeans. And that’s the way they like it.
When I visited San Francisco after the small 1990 earthquake I saw that part of the Freeway above the city had fallen to the streets below. The whole area looked like a bomb site. When I next visited, in 2005, absolutely nothing had been done about clearing it, let alone rebuilding the Freeway. And this is in one of the most public-spirited cities in the USA.
They don’t have much significant public money for "public projects". Simple as that. Nothing gets done without private enterprise. But don’t worry. We’ll be the same in a generation’s time!
The increasing focus on the All Weather here is Racing’s contribution to this creeping Americanisation. And no amount of perceived corruption (or the very obvious incipient demise of American Racing itself) is going to alter that trend.
All-weather racing is an European innovation. Most American bettors can’t stand it, in part because it isn’t actually "all-weather". Plain old dirt has proven to be much better at withstanding winter weather and summer heat.
From Equibase:
Handle: $2,553,416
Total prize money: $1,632,050
Charles Town is one of the few tracks to experience a major increase in handle over the past few years.
Keep in mind, too, that this track has been a cheap bullring for its entire existence. The management is doing an excellent job of balancing the $5000 bread-and-butter claimers with the new open stakes program that is attracting Grade 1 horses to West Virginia.The governor is a major supporter of horse racing, and always attends the West Virginia Breeders Classic. Given the thousands of jobs that the industry generates, it will continue to be "propped up" for a very long time to come.
I’m not having a pop at Charles Town. MW, but that prize money must be at least 10 times what could be raised from the handle, although there may be income from off-track betting and race sponsorship – what might that be, do you know?
Regardless of what the governor thinks, there will come a time, perhaps very soon, when the racino says to him/her something like, "Allow us to put an end to the racing part of the business and we’ll split the millions of dollars savings 50-50 with you". Hard to say no to that.
I think it was Tuffers that suggested doing away with low-grade handicaps on AW and replacing them with claimers. I’d suggest this would make the system worse.
I’ve no idea what the races are being investigated, but I’d be surprised if it isn’t these small field claimers where horses are running stones below form and because of the economic situation connections have virtually no risk of losing their horse. Check out the betting on the race Avon River won at Wolverhampton earlier this year.
Open claimers and sellers on the all-weather this winter have been an absolute circus. In their present form they simply have to go.
When I read the other day that police had raided Telepathic Heights, I assumed it was in relation to these all-weather investigations, but no. Anyone following the outsider of three system in these races this year must live in a skip, they all seem to be won by the pummelled horse.
Fields are too small (too many races and too few horses) and race conditions haven’t kept pace with changes in the horse racing economy. They just had a classified seller at Musselburgh, presumably to stop horses running below their class, that had an 80 rated horse in it. That is absurd.
There’s nothing wrong with claimers
per se
, but framing them so that any horse rated above the mid-70s can pretty much be ported in to give connections a short price fav to lay, with little chance of losing it, is just silly.
A better idea would be to have handicap claimers reinstated, especially for the lower reaches where decent class handicappers masquerading as 50-rated three duck-egg jobs have become depressingly common. They would offer softer opportunities for honest connections if run parallel with ‘who’s the biggest cheat’ open handicaps.
I think it was Tuffers that suggested doing away with low-grade handicaps on AW and replacing them with claimers. I’d suggest this would make the system worse.
I’ve no idea what the races are being investigated, but I’d be surprised if it isn’t these small field claimers where horses are running stones below form and because of the economic situation connections have virtually no risk of losing their horse. Check out the betting on the race Avon River won at Wolverhampton earlier this year.
As Glenn has said they need to be framed properly. Claimers with much lower maximum ratings and claim prices would make them much more competitive.
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