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Howard Johnson…

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  • #356770
    Irish Stamp
    Member
    • Total Posts 3176

    Agree – it’s hard to imagine that a leading trainer in the UK or France (think Nicholls, Pipe, Henderson, Macaire, Cherel, Gallorini etc.) would do this to a horse and then put the horse in danger and the jockey by racing it again.

    Please check your list of trainers.
    Mr Henderson instructed a vet to inject a drug on a horse known to have chronic bleeding problems and on the day the horse was racing for the first time at 6 years old.
    Besides breaking a clear simple rule that states only food and water on racedays, this horse was a known ‘chronic bleeder’. To me that is a case of animal cruelty.
    The vet, acting under the trainer’s instructions, lost his licence. The trainer was banned during the summer for just 3 months and was allowed to run his horses under another trainer’s name.
    I hope I’ve got the facts correct. There is also another thread about this "leading" trainer.

    Indeed Nor and IMO Henderson shouldn’t be training as he broke the rules (I’ve said as much on here) and he shouldn’t have raced the mare if he was that worried about her welfare.

    That is totally different to this though – Johnson however had the operation performed knowing it was banned under the rules of racing, knowing that it could result in a fatal injury to the horse and knowing that it would put the jockey at serious risk of injury too.

    #356800
    Nor1
    Member
    • Total Posts 384

    Irish Stamp

    wrote

    Indeed Nor and IMO Henderson shouldn’t be training as he broke the rules (I’ve said as much on here) and he shouldn’t have raced the mare if he was that worried about her welfare.

    That is totally different to this though – Johnson however had the operation performed knowing it was banned under the rules of racing, knowing that it could result in a fatal injury to the horse and knowing that it would put the jockey at serious risk of injury too.

    I’m not sure it is totally different. The outcome could have been the same. This is what I have read about the effect chronic bleeding has on a horse when racing:
    Many horses that collapse and die whilst racing, or just after they have finished, have a post mortem result showing blood in their lungs.
    It can prevent a horse from breathing properly whilst racing which then causes difficulty in running.
    Bleeding tends to be a lifelong problem and in severe cases the condition is too bad to treat.

    So it really depends on how bad Moonlit Path’s condition was to whether she could have collapsed and died whilst racing. She was medicated on her debut raceday. Is one of the reasons for the rule (no medication on racedays) to prevent trainers running sick animals?
    Her racing record shows she ran four times, being pulled up on her last one. I wonder what happened to her? Where she is now?

    #364285
    andyod
    Member
    • Total Posts 4012

    I saw where Howard had a winner today 11/7/2011. I trust the local vet had the horse checked for frozen limbs before the race.Wouldn’t want limbs falling off before the "winner all right" would we?

    #19210
    Avatar photocormack15
    Keymaster
    • Total Posts 9336

    The BHA will be holding their disciplinary enquiry into the Howard Johnson/Strking Article case on Wednesday/Thursday of this week.

    Full details here.

    https://theracingforum.co.uk/horse-racing-forum/general-racing-information-f33/bha-press-releases-and-information-t86516-26.html

    #365136
    Anonymous
    Inactive
    • Total Posts 17716

    Thanks for this, Corm. Surprised (reading the link) to also see that

    Alan King

    has just been fined by the BHA for a positive amitriptyline sample from

    Awesome Freddie

    on 15th April. £1000 fine and

    "subject to examination for twelve months"

    is about the lightest punishment they could give.

    #365159
    Avatar photoDrone
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6352

    Amitriptyline is a familiar drug with many uses, though mainly as a treatment for depression and anxiety in humans, dogs and cats

    Is it administered to curb these ailments in horses too?

    #365171
    moehat
    Participant
    • Total Posts 10217

    Used to treat muscular problems as well, I believe which is what I assume it was used for.

    #365184
    jinnyj
    Member
    • Total Posts 141

    Interesting – I met Awesome Freddie a couple of weeks ago – he didn’t look depressed to me! :lol: Hes a tall horse though and so could suffer muscular problems!

    #365192
    Avatar photoDrone
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6352

    Depression and anxiety are just two of a plethora of ‘mood disorders’ and there’s plenty of racehorses whose moods are frequently disordered: the ‘nervous’ type for example

    Hence my enquiry regarding the use of amitriptyline in horses

    Given it appears to be a banned raceday substance, I’d agree it does seem likely that it’s used to boost physical performance and/or treat physical afflictions rather than ameliorate mental problems

    #365204
    Roseblossom
    Participant
    • Total Posts 355

    Depression and anxiety are just two of a plethora of ‘mood disorders’ and there’s plenty of racehorses whose moods are frequently disordered: the ‘nervous’ type for example

    Hence my enquiry regarding the use of amitriptyline in horses

    Given it appears to be a banned raceday substance, I’d agree it does seem likely that it’s used to boost physical performance and/or treat physical afflictions rather than ameliorate mental problems

    From the findings:

    The urine of the horse was found to contain amitriptyline, which is a prohibited substance. After considering the evidence, including a statement from Alan King, the Panel was satisfied that on a balance of probability the contamination may have occurred through cross contamination from an employee who was taking amitriptyline on medical advice at the material time.

    #365251
    Avatar photoDrone
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6352

    Thanks for that

    I’ve had a dig around the ‘net and it appears that amitriptyline has no role in equine medicine and is literally ‘a banned substance’, not only when found in horses post-race as I chose to infer from Pinza’s report

    Therefore, given that the presence of the drug was almost certainly due to inadvertent cross-contamination the ‘minimal’ penalty seems quite correct

    #365263
    apracing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 4009

    Cross contamination from a stable employee? How exactly could that happen?

    I find it hard to imagine any sequence of events that would transfer a drug from the blood stream of a human to the urine of a horse!

    AP

    #365285
    Avatar photoDrone
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6352

    Perhaps the stable employee dropped a pill into the horse’s feed whilst medicating himself :)

    I’ve no idea if amitriptyline is present in sweat but if so – and given that drug tests seem to be able to detect miniscule amounts – I suppose it is possible that contamination occurred via transference from the worker’s hands to the feed or even from hands to the horse’s skin

    #365289
    apracing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 4009

    I’m just surprised that the BHA haven’t made it clear what exactly happened. If I was licensed trainer, faced with the prospect of a £1,000 fine if this was repeated in my stable, I’d like to have an idea of what I should look for and what actions my staff need to avoid.

    AP

    #365323
    wit
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2171

    AP,

    different drug, but this from the Shahjee inquiry by HKJC on 13/05/2011 here:

    http://www.hkjc.com/english/corporate/r … ewsMonth=5

    "Dr Wan provided evidence to the inquiry that two urine samples provided on 1 April 2011 by the Stables Assistant allocated to Mr Yiu’s stable and who attended to SHAHJEE at the relevant time were found to contain very high concentrations of ketamine and its metabolites, and that all items swabbed at the residence of the Stables Assistant under consent had also shown significant traces of ketamine. Further, swabs of a number of items which the Stables Assistant had contact with within Mr Yiu’s stable as well as the immediate stable environments of SHAHJEE and another horse attended to by the relevant Stables Assistant had also shown traces of ketamine. Dr Wan further advised that blood and urine samples taken on 1 April 2011 from SHAHJEE and the other horse trained by Mr Yiu which was attended to by the relevant Stables Assistant had all shown, upon detailed analysis, evidence for the presence of minute and insignificant traces of ketamine and its metabolites.

    Having considered all of the evidence before them, the Stewards formed the view that the finding of ketamine and its metabolites in the post-race blood and urine samples taken from SHAHJEE on 20 March 2011 was most probably as a result of contamination caused by the Stables Assistant who attended to the horse on that day.

    ……..The Rules of Racing place a heavy onus upon trainers in respect of their responsibility to present horses under their care and control to race free of prohibited substances so as to protect the integrity and reputation of horseracing and the Club together with the interests of the owners of horses racing in Hong Kong. Mr Yiu was advised that given the very unique circumstances of this case, the Stewards were of the opinion that there had not been any failure, omission or neglect on his part which had resulted in ketamine and its metabolites being found in the relevant post-race samples taken from SHAHJEE on 20 March 2011. Accordingly, the Stewards did not believe that any charge of having breached the Rules of Racing should be issued against him in respect of this matter.

    However, he was advised that should he harbour any concerns in respect of the performance, suitability or demeanour of the stable staff allocated to him in the future, he should immediately advise the Club’s Management of such concerns…"

    #365326
    cooknail
    Member
    • Total Posts 10

    @ apracing

    In relation to a different case a couple of years ago, I was advised by a chap at the BHA that the stable lad in question had probably peed into the horse’s bedding rather than cross the stable yard to the loo. Apparently this happens all the time. Then the horse ingests the human pee while rootling around in his bedding for food.

    It’s all very edifying.

    #365339
    Avatar photoDrone
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6352

    Apart from its use as an illicit psychotropic drug – which is presumably the reason it was found in the stable lad’s urine – Ketamine is used legally as an analgesic/tranquiliser/anaesthetic in humans and a wide range of animals including horses

    I learnt this from an episode of

    Midsomer Murders

    :) in which veterinary ketamine was being pilfered from a stable in order to feed the drug habits of the wasted youths of

    Midsomer Somewhere

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