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Ian watch the start again …Cobden and Frost are next to each other and theres plenty chanting going on , Frodon was bang on for the Irish race first time out , they knew how Rachel would ride this and everyone knew Frost wouldn’t be able to stop start the pace like 2020
I know the owner. Hes a very nice guy and kate is lovely
Could get an inside track on this but probably wont
I don’t like the OTT criticism of Sheehan. “Journeyman”, “Stupid”. It is unfair, and hindsight is 20/20.
I personally thought the most questionable ride in the race was Blackmore on Minella Indo. But it was understandable after Frodon and Frost dominated the race last season.
BUY THE SUN
What between him getting pulled to the front and his coming a (disastrous according to some) 3rd place in the KG?
No matter how soon after the race is still hindsight.
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It’s a game of opinions, opinions make the market and I certainly see plenty of opinions I don’t agree with here!
The jockeys of horses with different owners plotting sacrificing one’s chance to help the other before a Grade 1 – sorry, IMO that’s pure Flat Earth Society material.
Bryony Frost and Rachael Blackmore tactically inept?
They’ve got more tactical nous than the rest of the weighing room put together.
Things really went against them in this race and there has been so much aftertiming flak as a result.
I will cite it again – in 1984 at Ascot Lester Piggott in the King George went off so bloody fast on Teenoso even Dick Hern’s pacemaker couldn’t get past him until Swinley Bottom.
But it WORKED (so there wasn’t a peep out of the aftertimers afterwards).
The race became an attrition WAR despite the fast ground and the mudlark Derby winner of the previous year was last man (well, horse) standing.
Blackmore was on a Cheltenham Gold Cup winner coming back to 3m on a park course.
Plus she’d seen what mugs Frost had made of them all last year.
So she served it up.
What could Frost do?
Frodon likes to lead, she won last year by getting to the front and slowing it down, then kicking on again, it was her only chance.
As for Sheehan, he’s not ridden a good race on a horse which barely stays, but arguably some of the flak is harsh.
I wonder if he will ever get a similar chance again?
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Some of us picked Tornado Flyer tbf and didn’t need to be a post-race clever clogs.
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Whenever I read people writing about things like “an overly strong pace” AFTER the race I have to smile.
If only we could all sit and watch a race together – how many would say it with confidence during the first half mile?
It is incredibly easy to be critical once they have weighed in.
Minella Indo clearly wasn’t at his best anyway, but if Blackmore rides the same race again another day and she bottoms an entire field of suspect stayers to win, the very same people will be saying it was the obvious winning tactic.
I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Indeed. If Saint Calvados had won Sheehans ride would have been drooled over.
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That’s exactly the point, though, TTC. The ride Sheehan gave the horse meant he had no chance of winning whatsoever.
“If only we could all sit and watch a race together – how many would say it with confidence during the first half mile”?
Me.
Or rather:
Yes, it is true to say that when the first half mile is “overly strong” a punter can not write the leaders chance off completely at that point, Ian… Because if those leaders then slow the middle of the race right down then (after that rest) they may still have enough energy for the finish…However, what can be said after the first half mile is:
If they don’t slow it down significantly (emphasise “significantly”) those leaders have no chance in that ground.King George first 4 furlongs / half mile (taken from ITV coverage) was:
13.68
14.72
14.98
15.00
First half mile in 58.38 seconds.Which means if that pace had been kept up throughout they’d put up a time of: (58.38 X 6 =) 350.28 seconds. Physically impossible in that ground!
Over 25 seconds faster than the 375.90 seconds they actually finished in.Value Is EverythingFull 24 furlongs according to ITV coverage:
13.68
14.72
14.98
15.00
16.54
16.39
16.19
14.98
15.41
16.30
16.08
15.42
14.81
15.97
16.77
15.66
16.27
15.63
15.42
14.66
13.13
14.63
15.98
17.19Remembering Saint Calvados barely gets 3m, ie The slower they go (lesser the test of stamina) over 3m the better for the horse’s chance… The 13.13 and 14.63 when Saint Calvados took it up were suicidal considering what had (on that ground) gone before.
Value Is EverythingTend to agree with you TTC, the worst ride in the race was by far was blackmores, sheehans mistake wasnt that bad, similar to a reel steel moment in the GC when he came up swinging, wouldnt have made a difference if he was pushed a further furlong out or kept tight to where he was, result would have been the same, same with SC
Harsh on sheehan.
Id much rather he did what he did, than sit out the back and just get found out anyway
Absolutely Ham.
Has much been made of Cobden yesterday? Nicholls golden boy basically pulled McFabulous up Dettori-style, before Brewingupastorm fell and he reluctantly started riding again. He then gained fairly rapidly on the Mullins mare up to the line. Never give up Harry! Easier to pick on Sheehan though.
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To answer your questions, Ian:
Even the best of jockeys sometimes get the pace wrong.
Teenoso’s 1984 flat King George: That was on very firm ground. Horses can go a lot faster and maintain that pace longer on very firm and also on ground many did not realise was so firm. Hence he appeared to many as going too fast but wasn’t.
The only race I can recall being absolutely amazed about a horse maintaining an “overly strong” pace was Frankel’s Guineas. But even so – can remember argueing on here at the time that Frankel deserved a rating higher than the actual winning distances suggested… Because he would’ve put up an even better performance with even fractions.
It’s not “aftertiming” to criticise what jockeys do. Can hardly say “they went too fast” before the race has even started. But we can see what is happening while the race is running and we can also say that jockey X should have known not to do Y given the type of horse it is, trip, expectation, pace and ground. Although yes, people need to allow for all five of those things when criticising.
Yes, Blackmore was right to “serve it up” to Frost, but overdid it. However, hers was by no means the worst ride.
Yes, Frost was on a front runner and did the right thing in initially going to the front. But she could have let Minella go once evident Rachael wasn’t going to allow her to slow it down… And still been in front or even alongside the pack. Yes Frodon won the previous KG by front running but she wasn’t being allowed to dictate and therefore needs to react and change to Plan B.
Won’t go over it all again, but Expected a late challenge from the barely stays 3m Saint Calvados anyway. However, after not just a strong pace but an overly strong pace – I expected a very late challenge. Sheehan probably won’t get another chance, for good reason.
Value Is Everything
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