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DJ
Why would HE setting the pace be necessarily setting it up for DC. A cumulative 26 horses couldn’t pass him when he won both his Champions so why change a winning formula. You may well be right when you say that his 2m days are over but he showed that by winning his RSA Hdl that he has some stamina so why not put it up to DC instead of playing into his hands by allowing the younger horse lead and thereby run the risk that DC would show the better turn of foot up the hill ahead of him.
empty wallet – you remind me of EC every day!
(Edited by davidbrady at 10:29 pm on Dec. 10, 2006)
Quote: from davidbrady on 10:28 pm on Dec. 10, 2006[br]
empty wallet – you remind me of EC every day!
<br>I’ll take that as a compliment David , but EC may not like me being compared to him ;)
Made a mistake in some research i posted and in haste to delete it, deleted the wrong post too :(
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- Total Posts 17716
Hardy Eustace isn’t a spring horse, as his Nov/Dec hat-trick in his novice season shows.<br>Since that season however (02/03), his campaign each season has been specifically geared toward Cheltenham, a point confirmed by his trainer on several occasions.<br>In the past 3 seasons the horse has won just one race prior to Xmas, an uncompetetive 8k, 3 runner conditions race where he started at 8/1 on. In that 3 years he has made just one journey over the water prior to the festival, to finish 2nd in the Cleeve Hurdle.<br>However, this season he has been trained differently imo, a point illustrated by his victory in the Ascot hurdle – his best pre-Xmas form by some way – and his close 2nd yesterday, both in competetive overseas races.<br> The inference is that either he has been trained differently, or he has improved a lot since last season. I know which I’d chose to believe.<br> On the point of him front running, it should be pointed out that Rooster Booster was upside him at the last when winning his first Champion Hurdle, but he had the speed to leave the former champion standing from that point. Only last year on this forum this same horse was accused, by a number of posters, of winning 2 Champion hurdles by stealing then from the front, now he needs a strong pace.<br> Bullsh*t, on both counts.
Hardy Eustace isn’t a spring horse, as his Nov/Dec hat-trick in his novice season shows.
I dont think that proves it at all, its when they graduate it counts.
You say HE was trained each year for a Champion Hurdle….before his first Champion Hurdle (literally the week before hand) they were considering running him in the Coral Handicap! But the horse had really come to himself in the last few weeks so they ran him in the Champion. You say HE out sprinted Rooster Booster? This despite the fact HE was been shown the whip etc before the last while RB was hack cantering over him? HE just stayed on the better that day. We saw him struggle early on in his next race at Punchestown which is a fast track but he again ground the grey down.
This is a horse that ground his rivals into the ground in the SAH and again looked happy as a pig in muck when raced over further at Ascot, and again at Cheltenham on Saturday he was running on very strongly at the end of the two miles.
davidbrady
Fair point. But I think it was a case of damned if you do and damned if you don’t. At the respective times of their careers now, I don’t think it matters how Hardy was ridden on Saturday, he was fighting a losing battle in trying to beat Detroit City.
Can anyone really see Hardy being good enough to finish better than fifth or sixth in a stronger race than he ever won at the Festival. Whereas the stayers looks much less competitive.
Can anyone really see Hardy being good enough to finish better than fifth or sixth in a stronger race than he ever won at the Festival.
Thats fair enough but if you think that then surely there is a big question mark about DC’s form considering he only beat a horse (who you say yourself will probably finish around 5th in a Champion) a lenght despite getting weight from him.
Quote: from davidjohnson on 9:05 am on Dec. 11, 2006[br]davidbrady
Fair point. But I think it was a case of damned if you do and damned if you don’t. At the respective times of their careers now, I don’t think it matters how Hardy was ridden on Saturday, he was fighting a losing battle in trying to beat Detroit City.
Can anyone really see Hardy being good enough to finish better than fifth or sixth in a stronger race than he ever won at the Festival. Whereas the stayers looks much less competitive.<br>
Why….what makes you think it will be stronger then the last two years? DC apart, its brave inca, macs joy et al. again for me and i have seen so great evidence of his HE powers dimisihing. He looks to be running as well as he did two years ago to me. That means he might not win it, but he wont be far away.
SHL
No question Detroit City has to improve to win a Champion, but every run since his debut has suggested he’s going the right way and he looks capable of doing so. I’m not involved in the Champion Hurdle ante-post and at current prices have little intention of doing so as I believe the market is refelective of their chance.
I think HE is being brought over to UK for better ground, the ground in Ireland is terrible at the moment. I cannot see DC winning a chapion hurdle, he should be aimed at staying races.
JohnJ.
GH
On a strict interpreation of form it’s likely that Detroit City has run a fair way below his Greatwood form, as a 10 length beating of Crow Wood implies. Remeber the beating at the weights that Desert Quest dished out to the same rival in the Elite at Wincanton. However I wouldn’t be happy taking the Bula at face value, mainly because of the steady pace and it reflects quite well on the front 2 that they went so far clear as they did.
I don’t so much feel that Detroit City is open to improvement because he’s a juvenile, moreso a case of he’s a a big, strong, lazy sort that keeps plenty back for himself. He would have won further on Saturday if he hadn’t have idled after the last. Het him in the Champion and with the likes of Brave Inca and Macs Joy in the race I’m pretty sure he’s capable better.
I actually said on an earlier threat that after the Bula would be the time to lay Detroit City. As I suspected and wrote, there was a likelihood he would win the race without having to improve and shorten up. The same will probably happen if they go for the Agfa next. Hard to see him meeting the sort of rivals there that he’ll need to improve to beat.
- Total Posts 17716
Grasshopper
Imo, it would be wrong to assume both principals ran below form on Saturday, a view no doubt predicated on the proximity of the rags.<br> In a slowly run race, which would have suited neither horse, the  3rd & 4th horse were left for dead in the straight, thus the margin of victory in no way does justice to the superiority of the first two.<br> Whether DC improved or not is a moot point, taking the scalp of HE was no mean feat for a 4yo, and his trainer certainly believes he still has progression in him.
With apologies to DJ, who posted in the meanwhile.
(Edited by reet hard at 1:17 pm on Dec. 11, 2006)
One fact is clear to me. If you want to take DC on in the Champion Hurdle, you would do well to back against him or lay him nearer the day.<br>As I see it, most ‘once a year’ punters will be backing "the grey that looks like Rooster Booster" in March. Also, as has been said, the Agfa can only contract DC’s price more.<br>I personally would wait until after the Agfa, and back Macs Joy and Iktitaf against DC. If Macs Joy can’t win it next year, he never will. DC is definitely opposable.
Macs joy is best on a flat track horse for me, although I still think he might have beaten BI if Geraghty had been a bit more positive over the last two flights in the CH last year, something he confirmed at Punchestown..
I think the Bula was basically 2 match races in one. Crow Wood was ridden to beat Arcalis, not to beat the other 2. Initially I was keen to make positive noises about the first 2 pulling clear of him but on reflection, Crow Wood is a speedy two miler that would have found the Bula cobditions stretching him, he didn’t get up the hill behind Boychuk there last year on testing ground either so it possibly isn’t too wise to give the first 2 too much praise for pulling clear.
It was such a slow run race til near the end, and with only 4 runners it wasn’t a real indication ahead of the C H imo, I was impressed tho that D C did kick on when challenged an altho H E came back at him in the final stages he did have the measure of him over the last 2 fences an never really struggled, Im sure there is better to come and on better ground, Im really looking 4ward to the C H now, some good horses running :)
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