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Another Arab buying an English team

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  • #11542
    Goldikova
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    • Total Posts 1537

    The fake empire that is the Premiership will be getting another Arab owner in the form of Portsmouth. It’s a good job that people who know football also know that the Premiership isn’t as good as La Liga.

    I know many will slate the SPL even though it’s absolutely irrelevant to the subject matter. However, as much as we don’t have things the English league does, they don’t have things that the Spaniards do.

    Now if i became a billionaire over night and bought a smaller English club and made them world beaters, it just wouldn’t feel right. I sincerely hope the Spaniardss retain ownership of their own clubs, because they have things which are overlooked, technical ability and good weather.

    If i were Ronaldo, i’d put finance aside and have a crack in Spain. It will be the acid test for him. The English top flight is just gonnae become a bastion of mega fakeness.

    #230905
    insomniac
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    • Total Posts 1453

    Graeme, are you Michel Platini in disguise?
    The top Premier League teams may or may not be as good as the best in Spain but so what? If wealthy foreigners want to pour money into what you consider a sub-standard product, so what? What’s the problem?
    Perhaps it’s just a hobby to them and they’re prepared , nay expect, to lose money in the venture; much like a racehorse owner.
    The only problem I can see is that no wealthy arabs want to pour money into Chester City :cry:

    #230949
    Goldikova
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    • Total Posts 1537

    I’d be dissapointed if people said ‘so what’ if some Arab or American wanted to buy the club i support and the 100+ years history that goes with it because they want a hobby. If i were Platini i’d make clubs balance the books. It’s just ridiculous now.

    #230975
    insomniac
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    • Total Posts 1453

    Can’t see that history vanishes just because a club has a new owner, regardless of that owner having no family/local ties with club.
    I’m sure we’ve discussed the Platini "English clubs in debt" scenario before. It seems to bother him more than it seems to when large Italian/Spanish/German clubs run up debts.. If you (and he) are real fans of history then you’ll appreciate English (and probably Scottish) football (indeed European football) has a long and proud tradition of being in debt.
    Borrowing is a legitimate business strategy – you shouldn’t conflate businesses borrowing millions as a sign that, economically, they’re up sh1t-creek just like the guy borrowing cash off a loanshark. Healthy businesses borrow, and borrow big; always have done, always will. Platini ‘s moans seem juvenile and naive. Does he have another agenda?
    As far as I’m aware, Platini is not a merchant banker (well, he is in rhyming-slang parlance :lol: ), a risk assessor. an auditor or chartered accountant; he has no business or banking acumen that I know of. If you banisherd every business that ever showed a loss, or borrowed long term, then you’d hardly have any businesses left .
    I rather think Platini has two problems:-
    1) He knows bugger-all about running a business/ banking/ finance/ leveraging etc.(Rather like our Prime Minister & Chancellor). Yet it seems that this is the only stick he can use to beat the English with.
    2) He is jealous of the Premier League’s success.
    I doubt if he’d last 5 minutes on

    The Apprentice

    He’s a jealous little French turd whos footballing talent exceeded his business acumen.

    #230994
    Goldikova
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    • Total Posts 1537

    It’s not about running up a big debt, it’s about not paying it back. Other big European clubs have to make up what they loss, Man City & Chelsea don’t balance the book by the clubs revenue, they do it by some billionaire throwing loose change about.

    Celtic = debt free & bigger club traditionally than Man City. Celtic have to get money by getting into the Champions league and selling season books, along with merchandise and tv revenue.

    Man City = don’t need European football, money from season books or player sales, and don’t need to have a wage structure or tv revenue.

    If Platini wants clubs to work within a structure then i’m with him 100%. It’s very tiresome when you hear about small EPL clubs blowing bigger European clubs out of the water because of who own them, and not because of what they’ve achieved.

    #231000
    Andrew Hughes
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    • Total Posts 1904

    He’s a jealous little French turd whos footballing talent exceeded his business acumen.

    Yes and I understand Beethoven hadn’t a clue how to grow marrows and Einstein was a lousy plumber.

    #231001
    Pompete
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    • Total Posts 2391

    Celtic = PLC listed on the London Stock Exchange owned by amongst others:

    Line Nominees Ltd 36.53%
    Bank Of New York Nominees 6.53%
    Telsar Holdings SA 11.36%
    Vidacos Nominees 3.61%

    At the moment of course as there is nothing stopping these faceless companies selling out to an Arab, an American or anybody else for that matter. Lots of tradition there, no.

    #231009
    Goldikova
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    • Total Posts 1537

    I’m unable to comment on who owns those companies/shares. I’d imagine they’re Celtic fans anyhow, as they will be friends of Desmond. When i talk about Arab an American owners, i should state that i’m talking about the ones who haven’t previously had any connection to a club, and have every intention of spending without means.

    I’m sure many of the companies that Pompete has mentioned have had a return on their minimal investment, and i can assure you they don’t fork out money on transfer fees for players.

    I’d be delighted if the Arabs who buy Man City and Portsmouth said, "we’re not going to run this club at an operative loss because we think that the books should be balanced in accordance to what Platini and Graemethedonkey think, for the better of the game.

    Call me old fashioned, but srely other people also think that clubs should be making an attempt to balance the books ?

    #231019
    Pompete
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    • Total Posts 2391

    GTD, If you’re a Celtic supporter why care about anybody else or what they are up to?

    When I was about 11 years old Celtic played Portsmouth at Fratton Park on a Wednesday night for Eion Hand’s testimonial – 25,000 Celtic supporters turned up!

    We all know how big a club Celtic are and their tradition – just enjoy it you’re a lucky man and don’t worry about other clubs or the EPL or anything. Other than the media and the nu-middle class JCL’s we’re all just supporters and none of us really gives a **** who owns us or their reasons for doing so as we will still be here long after they’ve gone. EPL or Div 3 makes no difference to me.

    #231020
    Goldikova
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    • Total Posts 1537

    The money in the EPL effects clubs across Europe for obvious reasons. There used to be days when clubs could go into the European leagues and get right good value. Now nobody can because some English club will outbid anyone by spending over the odds.

    It just makes a mockery of the game when we’re faced with the probability of players rejecting AC Milan to join Portsmouth.

    #231023
    Pompete
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    • Total Posts 2391

    I never thought I’d see the day – a Celtic supporter worrying about little old Portsmouth making a mockery of things.

    Have a fcuking word with yourself matey.

    FFS

    #231047
    Goldikova
    Member
    • Total Posts 1537

    Worried about Portsmouth, yeah i don’t think so somehow. Hopefully Platini will put an end to it because there are many people throughout the footballing world fed up with English clubs. Portsmouth will always operate at a certain level, as they don’t have the foundations to be a ‘top four’ club.

    Christ, going by this thread you’d think there aren’t millions of people who think the same as i do.

    #231059
    Andrew Hughes
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    • Total Posts 1904

    It is tempting and perhaps rather easy to portray Platini as anti-English or in some way jealous of our multi-billion pound Premier League. Maybe that is true, though I’d prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt.

    But it is only reasonable that a man in his position should be concerned about the amount of money flowing into the Premier League and from where it comes. Just as the FA and the Football League should be interested in ensuring the integrity of all 92 professional clubs, so should UEFA be concerned to ensure that all its member countries thrive. The lesser point is that one country monopolising the available pool of talent does not make for a thriving competition – something that is well understood in American sports. But the more important point is that with big money comes big risk – clubs like Celtic and Man Utd may well have the depth of support to enable them to survive in the event of financial meltdown or rogue owners selling off the club and land for development. But it would be better if such chaos could be avoided.

    A Europe-wide salary cap and more stringent regulation of who can own football clubs would be good moves. In my opinion, of course.

    Another point is that football clubs are not really businesses.They are sporting associations with businesses attached. The bottom line for a football club is not profit/loss but points and trophies. They do not compete for customers with other football clubs and we would not want a world in which clubs could merge/go bust/be taken over by other clubs. I may want my club to do well, but I don’t want to see any of the others be disbanded. Survival of the fittest on the field, for sure, but not off the field.

    #231071
    Pompete
    Member
    • Total Posts 2391

    Andrew a number of fair points which I’m sure most football supporters would echo.

    On the issue of how clubs are financed these are the latest figures for ‘Income from Broadcasting’ taken from Deloitte’s Football Money League, Feb 2009.

    1 Real Madrid 135.8 (37% of total income)
    2 AC Milan 122.5 (58%)
    3 Barcelona 116.2 (38%)
    4 Manchester Utd 115.7 (38%)
    5 Inter Milan 107.7 (62%)
    6 Juventus 106.6 (64%)
    7 AS Roma 105.7 (60%)
    8 Chelsea 97.8 (36%)
    9 Liverpool 96.5 (46%)
    10 Arsenal 88.8 (34%)

    All figures in Euros

    Given these figures it seems to me that the view English clubs are disproportionately advantaged by revenues received from T.V. rights is inaccurate. And given the following report from Football Economy I wonder what Platini’s got to say about this?

    Serie A Clubs Form Their Own Premiership – 2/5/09

    Italian football clubs look likely to adopt the English Premiership model after 19 of the 20 Serie A clubs voted to break away from the Lega Calcio. The underlying issue is television rights. Serie A clubs sell their rights individually, rather than collectively, which means that the biggest sides such as Juventus or AC Milan earn in excess of £85m for their domestic rights, while smaller clubs, such as Chievo, only receive around £4m. In exchange for this arrangement, Serie A clubs contribute a lump sum to their counterparts in Serie B. This amounted to £90m – about 20 per cent of the television revenue until last year – and was negotiated down to £60m for this season. Because each club’s contribution was proportional to the size of their television deal, Serie A clubs went along with the status quo. It did not cost the smaller clubs very much and allowed the bigger clubs to continue enjoying big broadcasting deals.

    From the 2010-11 season Serie A rights will be sold collectively as is also the case in the Premiership and most other European countries. This will mean a more equal distribution of television revenues. That is why big clubs have been negotiating to further reduce and eventually eliminate the Serie B contribution. When negotiations stalled, Serie A decided to break away. It’s a big blow for Serie B clubs who on average lost £5m last season even with the £90m contribution from Serie A. For a long time many Serie B clubs have lived above their means. They have paid wages comparable with those in the Coca-Cola Championship despite the fact that average attendance is about a third as high and stadium revenues one tenth of those in the English second tier. Serie A clubs feel that they simply cannot afford to continue bankrolling the lavish spending habits of Serie B sides. It seems likely that a settlement will not be reached and Serie A will break away. It looks as if the green light for this has already been given by the FIGC, the Italian FA.

    On the wider issue of Ownership while I would fully support a rigorous examination of any potential owner to ensure they are a ‘fit and proper person’ with sound finances if an individual wishes to use their personal fortune to run a football club why should they be stopped from doing so. You can’t regulate good or bad management either on or off the pitch.

    Anyhow, I think some people take this all too seriously and in someway equate their own self worth as a reflection of their clubs fortune – my clubs bigger than yours etc…what a load of old bollocks it’s just 22 blokes kicking a ball about….

    #231081
    insomniac
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1453

    Per Graeme…

    because there are many people throughout the footballing world fed up with English clubs.

    For "fed up" substitute "jealous".
    This anti-EPL malarkey bears a resemblance to the anti Godolphin, Coolmore, Sangster, Aga Khan etc. sentiments voiced by various horse-racing fans over the years. The success of some seems very hard for others to take.
    Didn’t hear too many English bleating when the Italian La Liga was the sainted European football base. Crikey, it’s not very often that here in England, we come out tops, but, with aid of Sky and foreign deep-pockety investment, the EPL is just that – the tops. I rather think it’s pure anti-English jealousy by Platini. Naked, anti-English jealousy ; it may come as a surprise to some but, yes, there are actually some Johnny foreigners who don’t like us!!
    If an American or a Russian or an Arab wants to fire-hose money at English football (much as some want to waste money on thoroughbred racehorses) why should they be stopped? Okay – so it’ll make life tough for non-English clubs to buy the top players. But so what? It may (perhaps already has) have a knock-on benefical effect in encouraging those big foreign teams to wean more home-grown young talent and, maybe. sell them for silly money to the English teams.
    If an English club gets itself into debt through incautious borrowing (eg Leeds Utd – once a BIG club I believe), and goes into obscurity, then tough. If that fate awaits Man City, Man Utd, Liverpool, Newcastle, Chelsea or whoever, then once again, tough. So what? Why do the Platini-anti-free-market protectionist "little" Europeans not just let thing run there course, without interfering?
    If Sky ditched the EPL and bunged all that dosh at the French League, and their clubs reached the position that English clubs now do, with foreign investors buying up their top clubs and giving them money to burn, I would guarantee two things would happen:-
    1) Platini would stop complaining
    and
    2) The English wouldn’t complain either.
    But of course, as it’s currently the EPL that’s top-dog, you can’t stop the jealous carping from the "protectionist" socialist little Europeans like Platini,
    If the Platinis of this world ran Horse Racing just imagine the sort of rules they’d introduce:-
    1) No owner to own more than say, 10 horses
    2) No trainer to have more than 50 horses in training
    3) ANy horse representing an owner that has won more than a certain sum in win money must carry an automatic 7lb penalty for the rest of the season.
    Don’t be fooled into thinking that the Platini gripe is some noble, fair-play all-round doctrine. It’s the kind of unthought-through jealousy of the success of others (in this case the English) that is typical of the small-minded socialist.

    #231088
    Goldikova
    Member
    • Total Posts 1537

    Sorry insomnic, i trudged by the word ‘jealousy’ and stopped at ‘anti-English’. :lol:

    #231100
    Andrew Hughes
    Member
    • Total Posts 1904

    Interesting figures, Pompete, I was unaware of those.

    On the subject of Platini, Insomniac, if you say he is a jealous socialist motivated by dislike of the English, then I’m sure such a strong view would only have been arrived at after much consideration and with a weight of evidence to back it up. As such I bow to your obviously greater familiarity with the man and his works and I shall henceforth boo at the television whenever I see Michel.

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