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A one word answer…

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  • #1512688
    • Total Posts 1360

    Timeform have been banging on about how Envoi Allen is the most exciting horse in training. I’m sure that there are many who would disagree, especially at Seven Barrows.

    So, one word: Envoi or Shishkin? Or you may think of an even better prospect…

    Cork All Star
    • Total Posts 666


    I know the three day/four day Cheltenham debate is sterile – but it is a pity they will dodge each other.

    He Didnt Like Ground
    • Total Posts 737

    Hmmmmmmmm ….. To early to decide so I’ll do what Humpty Dumpty did ….without the great fall

    • Total Posts 543

    I think we are very lucky to have 2 of the best novice chasers I have ever seen around at the same time. I think both will go on to be superstars in their respective divisions but unlikely to ever meet.
    Personally I’m a sucker for 2 milers as I just love the speed they go at over their fences it’s incredible to watch so I’m very excited for shishkin

    Nathan Hughes
    • Total Posts 23310


    Shishkin has more chance imo of dominating the 2 mile division as the Gold Cup and races of that kind of nature seem to take more out of them

    Member since March 2008
    • Total Posts 1155

    Staying chases are more prestigious/lucrative/competitive, so harder for one horse to dominate, so maybe Shishkin. Both are exciting, but we’ve seen many morning glories before

    • Total Posts 2533


    He could be the bext kauto star

    • Total Posts 2540

    As of right now, Shishkin.

    There is an element of doubt about Envoi Allen’s stamina for 26 and a half furlongs for me, whereas it looks like you know what trip Shishkin is going to be good at. So with the possibility in my mind of a future Champion Chase winner v a future Ryanair winner, I’d take the Champion Chase winner.

    • Total Posts 3610

    Well Shishkin over Envoi Allen, because of what Mike said.

    But I’m going to be thran with my one word answer and say:


    • Total Posts 73

    I’d say Envoi Allen on raw ability right now.

    It’s nice to be in this position where they’re both sound and all the dreams are ahead. Amusing looking at all the Request-A-Bets the firms have up: Shishkin to win the Arkle and the next 3 Champion Chases, how many Gold Cups will Envoi Allen win? And so on.

    We’ve gone through plenty of potential superstars who have been cut short since I started following racing: Gloria Victis, Monsignor, Barton, Neon Wolf, Fayonagh, Samcro etc. I just hope these two have full careers while staying sound and genuine.

    I think both Envoi Allen and Shishkin have potential to stay 3m+ on pedigrees and look sensible enough animals who could be trained for it. But on what we’ve seen so far, they’re both effective 2m – 2m 4f but I’d make Envoi Allen pretty skinny in a match race at either distance, or a flat race over shorter. I think Abacadabras has more basic speed than almost any hurdler around right now, so Envoi Allen’s display in ‘walking the dog’ and doing him for tactical pace in the Royal Bond last year was arguably his best win so far in my book. Meanwhile Shishkin (albeit after a bit of a troubled run) was clearly outpaced mid-race in the Supreme before his stamina and good attitude pulled it out of the fire.

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