The home of intelligent horse racing discussion
The home of intelligent horse racing discussion

Lavazza Silver Cup 2017

Home Forums Big Races – Discussion Lavazza Silver Cup 2017

Viewing 17 posts - 1 through 17 (of 29 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #1331390
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    Really looking forward to this one, it’s usually a very decent field……

    https://www.racingpost.com/racecards/2/ascot/2017-12-23/689515

    Art Mauresque – He’s always promised to deliver plenty, but it hasn’t quite happened. Don’t want to be too dismissive of his current wellbeing, as back here on his seasonal debut, he got no further than the first, but it’s his previous form that would raise more question marks. He’s in the right hands, but looks high on what he’s achieved, and question marks over the trip. 33’s

    As De Mee – Really nice type, who was an impressive winner of The Grand Sefton last year, and also proved his wellbeing with a smart run behind Might Bite last time. Early casualty though in The Becher, and though he looks a massive price on his best form, would he be coming here as soon. 33’s

    Ballykan – Ran a bit flat here last time, but previously had ran well enough behind the very decent Rock The Kasbash, at Chepstow. On the face of it, he looks just short of this, but he seems to have got rid of the mental issues he had, and he shaped very well in The Betbright at Kempton, off of a 5lb higher mark. Yard having a decent season so far, and I have him down as a live one here. Close to being my #1, but have to hold fire, as he holds an entry at Cheltenham on Friday 20’s

    Beware The Bear – It was hard not be impressed with him at Newcastle last week, when he came from way back to win The Rehearsal Chase, despite a slipped saddle. I don’t think the 5 lb rise should stop him at all, but he also holds an entry for The Welsh National, and maybe one to tread warily with until running plans become clearer. Obvious claims though 7’s

    Bigbadjohn – Landed The Reynoldstown here last season, but that was a shocking renewal, and he’s done next to nothing since, including in The Ladbroke when he was never sighted. Stable having a difficult time of it, and looks hard to recommend. Looks poor value at this time, as low as 16’s in places. 20’s

    Bishops Road – After a spell in the wilderness, he was slowly, starting to look well handicapped, and this proved to be the case in last weeks Rehearsal, running his best race for some time. Would like it soft enough, and should run his race, but he wouldn’t be on my shortlist right now, as he’s another with Chepstow on the agenda. 20’s

    Caroles Destrier – Never really landed a blow at Newbury last weekend, and this followed on from another moderate performance in last years Welsh National. However, it’s just over a year since he chased Native River home in The Hennessy, and the handicapper has given him a proper chance. He’s already cost me cash this season, when he missed The Badger Ales, but with course form, and a feeling that this is just the race his trainer would seriously target, then at 20’s, he’s near the top of the shortlist. 20’s

    Clondaw Cian – Looks up against it here, and struggling to find a run that would give him too much of a squeak. However, bearing that in mind, the sheer fact he’s in there, for a yard I like to follow, a yard that’s won it before, means I’m not writing him off……just yet, and he showed a liking for the track last month, but still, hardly shortlist material either. 20’s

    Fortunate George – Very impressive winner here last month, and beat a few decent yardsticks in the process. The 10lb rise for that win, asks plenty more of him, but the manner of that victory suggests there might be more to come, despite the tougher opposition here, and he has definite potential. No surprise to see him as low as 11’s. 12’s

    Frodon – Ran a more than adequate race behind Might Bite at Sandown, before eventually getting going behind Top Notch a week later as Ascot. That’s decent company, and bearing in mind how he performed last year, there’s no doubt a prize like this is a realistic target. Definite chance. 12’s

    Go Conquer – A horse I’ve mentioned several times the last few weeks, and they ain’t shy with his entries. Hasn’t taken up any of them since an ultra impressive winner here at the start of last month, a performance that made me sit up and take note. Connections have mooted The National as the target, and he doesn’t want to be winning too much more with his mark in mind for Aintree. He’s in at Cheltenham next week for The Caspian Caivar, and quite simply, he looks to have a big future. Very risky antepost mind. 13-2

    Gold Present – Fine winner at Newbury last week, he’s another who could have The Caspian Caviar as the plan. He still looks well treated, and that’s without mentioning his second in The Close Bros Novices at The Festival. Step up in trip should suit, and he’d be worth considering, but for that Cheltenham entry, and he’s another who looks worth holding fire with for now. 10’s

    Icing On The Cake – Nice enough at his own level, and certainly wasn’t disgraced at Newbury last week, but this is surely a big ask. 33’s

    Kings Odyssey – He doesn’t have that much to recommend him here on first glance, however his run in The Caspian Caviar last year, shows they can get him ready for a big prize. This years renewal of that race though, is surely the #1 target. 20’s

    Master Dee – I like this horse a lot, and I got a really good run out of him last time at Aintree. He only found On Tour too good that day, and that horse was in the process of confirming that form last week at Newbury, before unseating. Nothing wrong either with his second to Ballyboley at Market Rasen, and with the step up in trip unlikely to be too much of an issue, he has a real chance. 20’s

    More of That – Seems a long time ago now that he was beating Annie Power in The Stayers Hurdle, and since then, he suffered from well documenting bleeding issues. I thought he shaped superbly in the early part of 2017, and I was very keen on him for The Grand National. He didn’t really shine at Aintree, but he still strikes me as if he has one last hurrah in him. If back to his best, the mark of 157 shouldn’t be an issue, but his future may be in The Cross Country sphere, and though I realise he definitely won’t be for everyone, he’s high on my list. 16’s

    Mystical Knight – I respect any JP horse in this, but Mystical really has a lot to do here surely. Market support would be worth noting of course, but from a yard that doesn’t have it’s trouble to seek, JP surely has better options. 33’s

    On Tour – Tidy winner at Aintree, and in the process of running a big race at Newbury last week when unseating. I’m quite keen on him for Cheltehnahm and The Caspian Caviar, but he looks to have an equally good chance here, and another to make the shortlist. 12’s

    O O Seven – Hasn’t quite got enough in the book to take this, but visually, I’ve been quite impressed with him, and I can really see him figure here. Yet another though to wait with, as he’s also in at Cheltenham next week. 14’s

    Pleasant Company – One of those horse who I’ve banged the drum of, for some time. I think he’s miles better than his overall reputation, and he ran well for a very long way at Aintree. Very nice winner at Punchestown, a year and a half ago, against a very competitive field, and also beat a decent field at Fairyhouse. This looks absolutely perfect for him, though he does have other targets in Ireland over Christmas, and has been pulled from a few races lately, late on. Huge player if he traps here. 10’s

    Ptit Zig – Nearly two years since we’ve seen him over fences, though if Huntingdon beats the weather today, we’ll get to see him in The Peterborough Chase. I honestly think they tried to do a “Big Bucks” with him, but despite a fine win at Auteil last year, it’s safe to say that that plan didn’t quite work out. A couple of exits, including in The Peterborough 2 years back, seemed to confirm the suspicion that fences may not be for him, and you can hardly blame connections for trying. The ability was there for sure, and he had loads of decent tries over fences anyway, so if he’s improved on the jumping front, then he has claims, but goes without saying, that it might be advisable to wait until after The Peterborough, at the very least. 16’s

    Regal Encore – Last years winner, and a horse I’ve been banging on about for a while now, and he really repaid the faith last Saturday at Newbury, where for reasons which aren’t quite clear, he was allowed to go off at 100’s. Bizarre. Yes, he had a few “PU” next to him, but he as plenty of decent runs as well, and though obviously risky (I feel he’s moody, rather than a JP Plot horse), I’ll always be interested in him. I’ve bet him for Chepstow, so would love him to swerve this, but only 6lbs higher than last year here, and off the back of that big run at Newbury, giving the winner weight, this looks equally appealing. 14’s

    Rock Gone – Nine year old, but not too many miles on the clock. Never really landed a blow in The Plate at The Festival, and by far the best run of his career, was chasing Go Conquer home last time. Not out of the question that he can build on that, and his mark has been left unchanged, so he should at the very least be competitive. He’s high enough in the market, based on that one run alone, but his mark could be crucial, and should run his race. 10’s

    Sametegal – Often runs well, without getting his head in front, as was the case today in The Grand Sefton. Not convinced this is his trip, and a big ask after todays effort to be back out in a fortnight. 20’s

    Singlefarmpayment – Market leader. Big fan of this horse, and thought he looked very progressive last year. His run in The Ultima was rock solid, and he came up against the more than capable Cogry, who was on a going day, for his seasonal reappearance. He wasn’t going to trouble the front two at Newbury in The Ladbroke, but he was one of the few also rans who actually ran his race, and after a strange ride, he was at least improving when he came to grief. I can see him in The Gold Cup one day, and hard to rule him out at all for this, though he’s as low as 5’s right now, and how much lower will he actually be on the day. An easy decision to hold any bets with this guy. 11-2

    Sizing Codelco – Blew me away at Aintree in the spring, and was just as impressive at Punchestown. I didn’t think, I was convinced, that he had a big big season ahead of him, but it has been dismal to date, with three very poor efforts. There seems quite clearly to be something amiss with the horse, and after somewhat predictably, being pulled up in The Becher today, he was the first one I ruled out here. 33’s

    Solstice Son – Led the field a merry dance at Cheltenham last time, and I was quite taken by him. Not quite enough in the book to go overboard with, but trainer in decent form, and if just a shade more restraint with him, and I think he could just surprise a few. He wouldn’t want it any worse than soft though, so although I’m more than happy to mark him down as a very interesting outside, I’d be less than happy to bet him this far out. 40’s

    Southfield Theatre – He was an excellent second in The 2016 Bet365 Gold Cup at Sandown, and then fell at the last in The Badger Ales, with the race won, and he looks well treated, but he just hasn’t stepped up since. I do like him, and he will bounce back surely, but he was lifeless today at Sandown, and not sure we’ll see him out only a fortnight later, after todays laboured effort. 20’s

    The Young Master – Got the better of Southfield Theatre that day at Sandown, and he looked destined for bigger and better things, but the wheels really have came off. Has got jumping issues to contend with, as well as another “so so” performance today in The Becher. A very big ask to take this in a fortnight later. 25’s

    Traffic Fluide – Another who promised so much, but hasn’t quite delivered. To be fair to him though, an injury didn’t help, and I haven’t completely given up on him/ Despite hitting 3 Miles in The Betfair, I’d still have the trip down as an unknown, as impossible to gauge him on that run, behind Bristol De Mai. Overall form leaves him with a bit to find, but still, there’s just something telling me that this might, just might, be the day he bounces back. Interesting, and looks overpriced. 25’s

    Viconte Du Noyer – Looked one to keep on side, after a really game win at Cheltenham last year, but that race doesn’t read that well now. His second at Punchestown is his best since, but even then, he was well behind the impressive winner. He carried a few pounds of mine last time, and he never looked likely. I don’t doubt he’ll pop up soon, he’s on his last winning mark, but I’m not convinced by Stable form just now, and I’ll pass over him just now, though he’ll probably be worth re-visiting on the day. Despite those doubts, he isn’t the worst value here. 33’s

    Virgilio – Not disgraced at all in good company the last year and a half, but after a win against modest opposition at Aintree earlier in the year, he looks high enough in the weights. No slouch by any means, but this might be too demanding. 20’s

    Walk In The Mill – More than capable on his day, as can be seen by the 3 wins he’s had in the last year, and not to mention shaping well in defeat on a couple of occasions. Should put it up to a few of these, and acts round here, but he is on a career high mark. Big ask off that mark, but more than worthy of an entry for something like this, and might just be the case that he hasn’t stopped progressing. 16’s

    Yala Enki – Easy to put a line through him after The Badger Ales, and The Rehearsal, where he didn’t look good enough, but I don’t think those races paint the full picture though. He shaped well enough at Newcastle till the business end, and 3 weeks should be long enough to get him ready for this, and any runners from this yard around this time of year at Ascot, are worth a second look. Hard to recommend on his last 2 runs, but you don’t have to go too far back to give him a live chance here. 14’s

    I think Solstice Son, the outsider of the field at the moment is interesting then, as is Traffic Fluide at a relatively decent price.

    Too many made the early shortlist, so had to trim it a little, and down to these five (for now)……

    Ballykan 20’s
    Caroles Destrier 20’s
    Frodon 12’s
    Go Conquer 13-2
    More Of That 16’s

    I think Go Conquer could prove very good indeed, and that 13-2 would be proper value on the day, but makes no sense to back right now, while I’m very keen on Ballykan, but can’t risk him now, as like Go Conquer, he holds an entry next weekend.

    No bet for now.

    GL

    #1331659
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    As I said, Go Conquer very risky Ante-Post, but having been taken out of The Caspian Caviar today, it makes him that much more tempting here. He’s had loads of engagements which he hasn’t taken up lately, but they gotta run him sometime.

    On the verge of taking that 13-2 here.

    #1332686
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    As mentioned, Go Conquer has had many engagements over the last 6 weeks, but has been pulled at the 5 Day Stage each time. I’ll hold off with him till tomorrow then, and maybe have to take a point or so shaved off him.

    I’ve had a go though, and went with Ballykan at 20’s each way, going by his Kempton run last February, he must have a sound chance here with a run under his belt. He’s another who’s risky, as he’s been pulled from a few targets himself lately, but at 20’s, he’s worth the risk.

    #1332756
    Avatar photoBigG
    Participant
    • Total Posts 14647

    Thanks Bobby, another great write-up :good:

    I quite like the look of CAROLE’S DESTRIER in this. He didn’t
    get involved at the business end of the Ladbrokes Trophy Chase earlier this month,
    having traveled well for a good way, but he was entitled to have needed the run
    having not been near a racecourse for a year. He’s a c/d winner, and if Neil
    Mulholland has him back to the kind of form that saws him run Native River to a
    1/2 length in the Hennessy, then he would have to be involved in the shake up. I
    think 20/1 is too big, and although I’m taking a chance that he makes
    the 5 day declaration stage tomorrow, I’m fairly confident that this is a target for him
    and I’d expect his odds to shorten if he keeps his place.

    It’s a very tough looking race, good luck with Ballykan Bobby, NTD is flying at the moment
    so if he lines up he must be in with a good shout :good:

    #1332760
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    Cheers Graham.

    Still keen on Caroles myself, and I’ll be adding him or Frodon, or even both, before 1000 tomorrow. Obviously scrubbed MOT from that early shortlist, so left with the other pair, as I’m treating Go Conquer with some caution. Had a rethink, and I’d much rather bet him at half the odds should he make it, rather than have him as a non runner.

    At this moment, I’m inclined to go with Caroles, as there’s more juice in the price, and this looks more suitable than Chepstow. I’ll sleep on it.

    #1332772
    Mike007
    Participant
    • Total Posts 9752

    If he was to make the final cut I quite like Rock Gone in this off his low mark.

    #1332774
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    Added both Caroles Destrier EW 20’s, and Frodon Win 14’s. Now just to hope they’re declared this morning.

    #1332795
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    Well Ballykan & Caroles Destrier don’t go, which is a shame. Not too worried about CD, but disappointed with Ballykan, I’ll hopefully get my money back from him later in the season.

    Frodon still there, and I will add to him. I’m going to leave Go Conquer probably, as I’ve bet him for Cheltenham, and no point adding him here now.

    Interesting that they’ve kept More of That in there, but I keep coming back to Traffic Fluide, who’s very big at 25’s, while Master Dee & Regal Encore still appeal too.

    #1332837
    Avatar photoKevMc
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1326

    Really like Gold Present. Expected to need his run first time out and still won (although slightly fortuitously). Will appreciate the step up to three miles and going this way around (jumped right). 8s looks a nice price.

    #1333336
    Avatar photoCharlesOlney
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2031

    Personally I think Clondaw Cian is a bit overpriced at 25/1. I thought he ran well at the course 2 starts ago and didn’t seem to me to be particularly happy last time out. Back to a venue he seems to go well at and off a light weight I can see him going well.

    Regal Encore looks set to give it a damn good crack at the double in this race and he’s one to definitely keep on side after that performance at Newbury.

    I’ll get involved tomorrow eve after final decs but those are my initial thoughts after a quick look.

    #1333476
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    Still hopeful of a good show from Frodon, but in a race where a bit of damage was done from Ballykan, I really should leave it alone, but I’ll have another go.

    Still not hit the limit of what I would play in a race like this, so I’ve decided that it has to be Go Conquer, who’s surely too big at 7’s, as was On Tour at 14’s. Messy messy race for me, and I’ll have a wee saver in there to try and get the stakes back. Regal Encore filled that role perfectly at Newbury, and may have him to do it again this time.

    #1333523
    Avatar photoSteeplechasing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6337

    Go Conquer. I’ll follow him until beaten although Gold Present will be dangerous and I’ll add a saver on him.

    Good luck, and, once again, great write up, Bobby.

    #1333530
    Mike007
    Participant
    • Total Posts 9752

    Singlefarmpayment for me.

    #1333558
    Avatar photoVenture to Cognac
    Moderator
    • Total Posts 16073

    Cheers Joe, yeah, pretty much the same approach with me, and I had to have a go with him here. Think he’s a smashing price.

    #1333572
    Avatar photoraymo61
    Participant
    • Total Posts 7058

    Am on Walk In The Mill at 11/1 and 10/1 and a saver on O O Seven at 15/2.

    Should be a good race to watch this!! :good: :good:

    #1333575
    LostSoldier3
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 1874

    It’s a hot race but I think 40/1 Icing On The Cake is too dismissive. Unexposed at the trip, recent run looks like strong form and bottom weights have a good history in these Ascot handicap chases.

    #1333578
    Avatar photobotchy1
    Participant
    • Total Posts 6588

    Go Conquer @ 7’s for me.

    Been entered for a few races lately and saved a fair few quid not backing him AP for most of them. Looks like a horse with a fair bit more left in the tank to me to me. I thought he would of been a strong FAV here :scratch:

    More worried about Regal Encore than anything else, a big run against 2 very good horses last time out.Wont be far away if he repeats that run.

Viewing 17 posts - 1 through 17 (of 29 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.