Home › Forums › Big Races – Discussion › Grand National 2014
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March 20, 2014 at 13:08 #472652
Don’t know much about Buckers Bridges sire Pelder but he has Lafontaine on the damside [Papillon, Spot and Ever Blessed] which is pretty good. Only an 8 year old though [and a young 8 year old; February foal] but he came 3rd to OHO in the Bobbyjo [@12 lengths if you take away difference in weight]. Bit interesting, that one.Wayward Prince is one of my current nightmare horses.
I’d consider February to be early for a National Hunt foal, so went and had a look at the foaling dates for the Gold Cup field. Katenko the only one foaled in February, On His Own the latest in July.
March 20, 2014 at 13:47 #472664I’ve only ever looked at foaling dates with regards to the early classics but it worries me that, as an 8 year old BB is still on the young side for a National winner
and a young 8 at that. Having said that he could be something a bit special; looks a nice sort from the photos I’ve seen as well. Given that I’ve given up any hope of finding the winner of the race this year might as well take an even wider interest than usual
with other aspects of the race!
March 21, 2014 at 12:38 #472759One of the papers this morning confirms Scholfield on Teaforthree, ST-D on Tidal Bay, Fehily on Rocky Creek and Mahon on Hawkes Point.
March 21, 2014 at 13:11 #472763Surprised Rocky Creek is still running; I thought ringworm was a bit debilitating.
March 21, 2014 at 19:28 #472794they said they where going to do tests on godsmejudge, but not heard any news since weekend before festival in if anything has come up
vf
March 21, 2014 at 23:01 #472817The ground will be interesting and is one to keep an eye out for over the next fortnight. Could very well be heavy ground this year.
March 21, 2014 at 23:05 #472818We could well be looking at a heavy ground National this year. When was the last one?
March 22, 2014 at 13:41 #472895SV, Last heavy ground National was 2001.
Looking for a horse with Red Marauder’s level of jumping ability then! It must be Vesper Bell’s to lose.
March 23, 2014 at 21:43 #473044Been quite a move for Pineau De Re.
I would automatically think 11yo too old – anyone know the stats?
Has put in some reasonable hurdle runs but I can’t find that much recent form over the bigger obstacles to get too excited about. Looks a shocking price now.
March 23, 2014 at 21:54 #473045Been quite a move for Pineau De Re.
I would automatically think 11yo too old – anyone know the stats?
Last two winners have been 11, three of the last ten 11 or older so not inconceivable, although I don’t fancy him myself. Each of the last four winners have been in double digits also so being 11 wouldn’t seem a problem. Hope that helps.
March 23, 2014 at 22:13 #473046Price has only come in again cause that bloke on TML tipped it yesterday morning. Backed it at 50/1 but wouldn’t back it at the price it is now and even then I thought it was more likely to win a hurdle race at Cheltenham. I’d still rather back an 11 year old than an 8 year old. Mind you am no closer to working out who might win than I was months ago but am still kicking myself for not backing T43 ages ago.
March 24, 2014 at 09:56 #473069Been quite a move for Pineau De Re.
I would automatically think 11yo too old – anyone know the stats?
Last two winners have been 11, three of the last ten 11 or older so not inconceivable, although I don’t fancy him myself. Each of the last four winners have been in double digits also so being 11 wouldn’t seem a problem. Hope that helps.
Thanks. Delved a bit deeper and yes it seems the age is no barrier at all. My inclination had always been to look for something under 10 purely because you would probably expect that little bit more improvement.
March 24, 2014 at 12:02 #473077I don’t have the information to hand Stilvi, but I went through age stats a few years ago, from 1983 onwards. Found age groups won pretty much the number of races you’d expect – when taking in to account how many horses run of each age.
9 year olds were the "most successful" numerically, but there’s also been more 9 year olds to run in the race than any other. Just won the number of races their percentage of the field suggested they should.
One interesting stat,
No 13 year old had won in that time, but so few tried that just one win from a 13 year old turns "the worst" age" in to "THE very best" age group.Conclusion:
Any Grand National age statistic is only a "coincidence", all runners should be judged on their own merits.Value Is EverythingMarch 24, 2014 at 18:10 #473092goulanes out
vf
March 25, 2014 at 18:47 #473212I had stuck with two all along. Tidal bay and Seabass, unfortunately Seabass managed to get injured and is out. I hope Tidal Bay stays well, as he is my idea of the winner, but I’m going to try for a reserve at hopefully a decent price, before they start to shorten up, as they invariably do.
I like horses that take to Aintree, and last year Across The Bay was running a cracker of a race until he hit 4 out and was headed, he carried on but hit 2 out and fell away to finish 14th. That was off 150 and he runs off 148 this year.
Two races back (Dec 2013) he won over 3m 4f at Haydock on heavy ground and won running on to take the race in the final 200 yards. I don’t have a worry about him getting the trip as much as he needs to be tidier at the end of the race, as he unseated McGuire in his warm up race at Haydock in February. If he clouts a couple at the end of 4m+, it is hard to keep up the momentum. However, no better training family to get a horse ready for the National than the McCain’s.
At 50/1 with a few bookies, that is worth a few quid. It’s a pity Betvictor has him at 40/1 as they are offering 6 places. The best outside of them is Skybet who are 50/1 and 5 places. I could wait to see if he stays at that and hope for others to go out to 6 places, or Betvictor to drift him out to 50s, but I don’t see that happening so I’m chancing Skybet, who very annoyingly are not NRNB yet.
March 25, 2014 at 19:50 #473221McCain said ‘last year he was messed about by a loose horse but never looked happy with the fences or the fast ground; he’s better in small fields where he can dominate’. Mind you, he’s also said they’re training him for the race this year with a view to him staying better. Make of that what you will
March 26, 2014 at 00:39 #473262McCain said ‘last year he was messed about by a loose horse but never looked happy with the fences or the fast ground; he’s better in small fields where he can dominate’. Mind you, he’s also said they’re training him for the race this year with a view to him staying better. Make of that what you will
I don’t seem to understand it either Moe, in fact I have no idea what McCain is on about.
I watched the race again to see if my recollection of how things went was a bit rosy spectacled, but after watching it from start to finish, if anything it was even better than I had remembered. He was untidy at the 3rd fence, but after that, with a couple of very minor errors, he jumped round extremely well, and to my uneducated eye seemed to be relishing the race until he clouted the second last which put paid to any chance he had, although he was tiring at that point.
As for being better in small fields, he has won 8 races, only 3 of which were single figure fields (5, 7 and 9). The other five were 10, 15, 17, 17 and 19 runners.
Is McCain playing it’s chances down so their are no expectations of the horse. I’d find that a bit strange as I normally find him quite upfront. Don’t get me wrong, this is not one of your fancied contenders, but I think the horse deserves a bit more credit for his running last year. I doubt McCain would put him through it all again if he truly thought the horse never looked happy with the fences. I still think at 50/1 he is overpriced.
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