Your Opinion Needed On The Future Of Hunting (hence Point-to-Point)

[IanDavies]

The 2004 Hunting Act pretty much banned actively hunting wild mammals with dogs and came into force in 2005, leaving trail hunting permissible.

It was arguably a “Class War” Labour attack on those perceived to be wealthy and elitist but, while Theresa May promised a free vote on repealing it in 2017 if she got a majority (she didn’t), Rishi Sunak has ruled out repealing the legislation and it seems Hunting’s natural political ally, the Conservative Party, is distinctly lukewarm towards it nowadays.

In the wake of recent ITV coverage – the Avon Vale and another hunt only last night – Labour has announced an intention to outlaw trail hunting (saying it’s a front for now illegal actual hunting) if it gets into power.

Point-to-Point horse racing may find it very hard to continue if Hunting is banned, not so much because existing meetings are organised by Hunts (the sport could take over and recruit paid raceday staff) but because the venues will be mostly owned by those sympathetic to Hunting.

Pointing ending would be a bit like football losing everything below League Two.

My question is: are you in favour of banning hunting altogether (knowing it may mean the end of pointing), leaving legislation as it is, or repealing the 2004 Act.

FWIW, I feel the same way about foxes that Ali did about the Viet-Cong – “I ain’t got no quarrel with them Viet-Cong” – but that said I know they’re destructive and need to be controlled so I’m actually neutral on the hunting subject.

I’d be sad to see Pointing go to the wall, though.

Vote and reasons for them welcomed.

I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"

[Cork All Star]

I have voted for the middle option.

I am strongly opposed to the first option.

The third option is exceptionally unlikely to happen, so there is no point voting for it.

[IanDavies]

Thank you for your input, CAS.

All I’d say is there IS a point in voting for thr third option if it’s what you believe in as this isn’t about trying to predict the future, it’s about trying to gauge sentiment among forumites.

I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"

[Gladiateur]

I’d ban trail hunting, too.

Only because I hate dogs.

[IanDavies]

Thank you for your input, Gladders.

I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"

[Cork All Star]

I personally do not think hunting should have been banned. The Burns Committee which actually studied evidence did not recommend a ban. But it was ignored and political and emotional considerations carried the day.

And as we have seen with the wholly unnecessary mess racing has got itself into with the “whip”, emotional arguments are powerful.

I see zero prospect of the ban being overturned. Even a Conservative government with a Prime Minister from a rural constituency realises there is little or nothing to be gained politically by allowing hunting again. It is a dead letter.

I think it is a dead end debate as well. No one is ever going to persuade the other side around to their point of view.

[IanDavies]

Well it certainly won’t be overturned if those who opposed the ban won’t even vote to overturn it on an internet forum.

I agree it’s a polarising subject for debating purposes, but I’d still be interested to see how votes on this matter are distributed on a racing forum.

I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"

[Cork All Star]

With respect ID, it won’t be overturned by people who vote Labour either.

[IanDavies]

I don’t suppose it will, CAS, last I read 80% of the population favour an outright hunting ban and, apart from the fear of losing Point-to-Point, I wouldn’t lose any sleep myself if that eventually transpired.

I’m just curious to see if there’s any more enthusiasm for Hunting on a racing forum than there would on, to take a random, more mainstream, example: MUMSNET!

Maybe I should join and start a poll there?

I could call myself “Karen” – or “Kazza!”

I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"

[Cork All Star]

“I’m just curious to see if there’s any more enthusiasm for Hunting on a racing forum.”

Judging by some of the comments here, there is not much enthusiasm for jockeys using a piece of air cushioned foam on a horse’s backside, so I doubt there will be much support for hunting with hounds.

[Gladiateur]

“I could call myself “Karen” – or “Kazza!””

I thought you already did that on Saturday nights.

[Nathan Hughes]

My mother grow up on a farm and as a boy we would visit fairly often.
The hunt never interested me.
I love foxes but could see the destruction they could cause. I’ve never quite understood the keeping them under control bit as opposed to keeping them out with better perimeters, although I’m not a farmer either so it doesn’t affect me
Point to point would be a loss, could they find a way around it perhaps?

Here’s me and my brother

Charles Darwin to conquer the World

[IanDavies]

“I thought you already did that on Saturday nights.”

You wish, Gladders!

There might be a way round it, Nathan – all depends how many venues would make themselves available for meetings post-hunting.

I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"

[Richard88]

An utterly disgusting and barbaric pastime that should have been left behind decades ago. There is no place in civilised society for it.

If pointing is a casualty of any further restrictions on hunting then so be it. If all football below League Two relied on sadistic animal cruelty to survive then I’d happily see the back of that too.

I suspect that illegal hunting is rife and if anyone doesn’t believe that trail hunting is frequently used as cover for the real thing then I have some magic beans to sell them.

Yes foxes are a pest but I am fairly sure that in the 21st Century we have other ways of controlling them.

Can you guess which option I picked? For what it’s worth genuine trail hunting would be fine by me but as it has been widely abused by illegal hunters I support the removal of the right to do so.

I am born and raised in the rural Westcountry so this is not the view of some out of touch city dweller.

[Marlingford]

I’ve voted “stay as we are”.

As a child, I was appalled at the notion of hunting – animal rights organisations are good at getting their viewpoint into schools.

As an adult, I think the matter is more complicated, including on animal welfare grounds. But I am still repelled by the human pleasure element of hunting given that the goal is to kill an animal.

I think the ship has sailed re a repeal anyway though as CAS says.

[Cork All Star]

“Yes foxes are a pest but I am fairly sure that in the 21st Century we have other ways of controlling them.”

According to the government’s website, it is still legal to:

Use cage traps and snares to catch foxes.

Check cage traps at least once a day to stop a captured fox suffering.

You must:
only use free-running snares, which relax when the animal is captured;
check snares at least once a day;
humanely kill any fox you catch while it’s in the trap or snare;
release all other animals unharmed – except grey squirrels and mink, which you must humanely kill

You can shoot free foxes using a suitable firearm and ammunition. The British Association for Shooting and Conservation has a code of practice on shooting foxes at night(lamping).

You can use dogs to stalk or flush out foxes above ground, but only to stop serious damage to your property.

You must:

use no more than 2 dogs;
shoot the foxes as soon as they break cover;
carry proof that you own the land or have written permission from the landowner.

[IanDavies]

What a fantastic debate with some passionate contributions.

Is there anyone on this forum who wants to vote to repeal the 2004 Hunting Act and furthermore make the argument for their vote on this thread?

I am "The Horse Racing Punter" on Facebook
https://mobile.twitter.com/Ian_Davies_
https://www.facebook.com/ThePointtoPointNHandFlatracingpunter/
It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"

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