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Racing save a few days in the year (no more than 10) would be almost nothing without betting. Sadly few who run the sport realise this. Hence the mess.
Non alcoholic beer.
I dont think so!! However this will never be an issue as
without betting there would be no good races,
so the idea of watching classics or cheltenham without betting would not be an option!!
I often watch racing without betting, but its usually for education or research in order to bet later!!
Do you consider the Maryland Hunt Cup to be a "good race"?
Excuse my ignorance. I had never heard of it until now. I googled it and had a look at the 2010 race on youttube!!
To be honest, NO that does not look like a big race, it looks like a family day out but i could not see much of a crowd, looks more like a point to point meeting to be honest.
It would not be my thing anyway, have you ever seen the grand national, thats a proper steeplechase, the best NH race in the world and its also one of the biggest betting races also. The money draws the quality, betting and good racing go hand in hand.
And thats just the way it is!!
No, absolutely not.
You can be a fan of other sports and not bet. You can be a fan of a Horse but, usually, behind the horse is a rich owner and a tweed/silly hat wearing posh-boy and you just should not support that sort of thing.
How many trainspotters go to the station without a pen, notebook, flask and copy of Razzle?
I dont think so!! However this will never be an issue as
without betting there would be no good races,
so the idea of watching classics or cheltenham without betting would not be an option!!
I often watch racing without betting, but its usually for education or research in order to bet later!!
Do you consider the Maryland Hunt Cup to be a "good race"?
Excuse my ignorance. I had never heard of it until now. I googled it and had a look at the 2010 race on youttube!!
To be honest, NO that does not look like a big race, it looks like a family day out but i could not see much of a crowd, looks more like a point to point meeting to be honest.
It would not be my thing anyway, have you ever seen the grand national, thats a proper steeplechase, the best NH race in the world and its also one of the biggest betting races also. The money draws the quality, betting and good racing go hand in hand.
And thats just the way it is!!
I must point out that Grand National winners Jay Trump and Ben Nevis were both multiple winners of the race, so it’s not that insignificant!
I dont think so!! However this will never be an issue as
without betting there would be no good races,
so the idea of watching classics or cheltenham without betting would not be an option!!
I often watch racing without betting, but its usually for education or research in order to bet later!!
Do you consider the Maryland Hunt Cup to be a "good race"?
Excuse my ignorance. I had never heard of it until now. I googled it and had a look at the 2010 race on youttube!!
To be honest, NO that does not look like a big race, it looks like a family day out but i could not see much of a crowd, looks more like a point to point meeting to be honest.
It would not be my thing anyway, have you ever seen the grand national, thats a proper steeplechase, the best NH race in the world and its also one of the biggest betting races also. The money draws the quality, betting and good racing go hand in hand.
And thats just the way it is!!
It’s usually considered up there with the Grand National as one of the toughest courses in the world. Run over 4 miles of "fair hunting country", 22 solid timber fences that require an excellent jumper and a very skilled jockey. It looks like a point-to-point because very little has changed about the race over the years except that it’s now run for prize money. It’s the only race on the card , there are no concession stands or grandstands, so that crowd is very large considering.
A short article from Forbes about the race
http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/0510/ … ntextstoryThere’s several great books about the Hunt Cup, too.
I’ve never been a big better, it’s the racing itself that I love. Unfortunately, without betting I don’t think flat or jump racing would survive as we know it now. Maybe a few courses and races would continue, but they would be few and far between. Let’s hope it never comes to that, though.
- Total Posts 17716
It’s usually considered up there with the Grand National as one of the toughest courses in the world.
By anyone outside the country itself? One which always seems to need to kid itself into believing that its own version of everything is the biggest, best, toughest
[etc.]
anywhere, to tedious effect.
From what I’ve seen it looks a breeze compared to such phenomenal challenges as the Grand National or the Pardubice. Tiny field… lowish railings … though the timber presents a substantial challenge, most of the riding looks awful … and though they go awfully slowly and carefully, they still manage to fall off, get caught out when the horse swerves and don’t have the strength to encourage them into the fences. It looks more like a cut down version of Badminton, without the time trial element.
Mind you, the scenery is beautiful (very Berkshire), as it is in the Czech Republic for the Pardubice. There Aintree cannot compete. But then, it hardly needs to.
It’s usually considered up there with the Grand National as one of the toughest courses in the world.
By anyone outside the country itself? One which always seems to need to kid itself into believing that its own version of everything is the biggest, best, toughest
[etc.]
anywhere, to tedious effect.
From what I’ve seen it looks a breeze compared to such phenomenal challenges as the Grand National or the Pardubice. Lowish fences … only the timber presents a substantial challenge … and they go awfully slowly and carefully, don’t they?
The fences aren’t exactly "lowish"…
Grand National fences are 4’6" to 5’2" in height.
Maryland Hunt Cup fences are 3’9" to about 5′, with most around 4’10". The toughest fences are 3 (nearly unbreakable chestnut rails), 6, 13 (where War Gold is buried), 16 (which has a difficult uphill approach), 17 (where Trouble Maker is buried), and 21 (the water jump). They seem higher because horses cannot brush through them; they take a lot of force for the top rail to snap, and there is no room for horse or rider error. Because of this timber horses are trained to be careful, "looky" jumpers. No fence is jumped twice. All horses carry 165 lbs. "A breeze"? I don’t think so.The Duchess of Westminster watched the race in the 1960s and remarked that, "I had heard that these fences were big and hard, but I had no idea they were this size. I can see now how Jay Trump won the Grand National so easily after a background of these terrible fences".
Winners of the Maryland Hunt Cup automatically qualify for the Grand National, along with winners of the Grand Pardubice and Virginia Gold Cup, so the British Jockey Club seems to think the race is suitably difficult.
- Total Posts 17716
Winners of the Maryland Hunt Cup automatically qualify for the Grand National, along with winners of the Grand Pardubice and Virginia Gold Cup, so the British Jockey Club seems to think the race is suitably difficult.
The
politesse
of visitors such as Anne, Duchess of Westminster to the Maryland Hunt Cup is testament to their courtesy, not to the truth of its difficulty; and no doubt some of the horses taking part could mix it abroad at professional level (just as is the case with the best point-to-pointers here).
Rails are nasty because they hurt when hit: thus the heavily bandaged forelegs, the slow pace and tendency of the runners to "balloon" them – all of which produces the stop-go, Badminton cross-country effect we see.
It is essentially an eccentric spectacle, an amateur race for pretty amateur-looking horsemen. Jay Trump was an exceptional horse, who won the Maryland Race thrice (including in record time) and who was prepared for Aintree by the man many would consider the finest National Hunt trainer of all time – Fred Winter. His is a fantastic story, but he’s remembered because he won the Grand National from such an unlikely background. No other horse has come out of the Maryland race and done the same.
It is essentially an eccentric spectacle, an amateur race for pretty amateur-looking horsemen. Jay Trump was an exceptional horse, who won the Maryland Race thrice (including in record time) and who was prepared for Aintree by the man many would consider the finest National Hunt trainer of all time – Fred Winter. His is a fantastic story, but he’s remembered because he won the Grand National from such an unlikely background. No other horse has come out of the Maryland race and done the same.
What xenophobic and factually inaccurate drivel.
As already posted, Ben Nevis won both races.
- Total Posts 17716
As already posted, Ben Nevis won both races.
Apologies, I stand corrected – and am very glad to be so as far as Ben Nevis is concerned.
As far as the Maryland Hunt Cup itself is concerned, what do you find "xenophobic" about my post, in which I praise Jay Trump’s story as "fantastic"?
Going back to the original theme of this thread, I rarely bet outside either the big meetings or when on-course (and if this week is anything to go by I should stick to this!!!!!) but appreciate this is the exception rather then the rule.
Going back to the "what’s the toughest" subject matter this thread seems to be taking a turn towards, I think trying to compare the modern day Grand National with the Maryland Hunt Cup and Pardubice is like comparing apples with oranges. All are tough in their own unique ways.
- Total Posts 17716
Going back to the "what’s the toughest" subject matter this thread seems to be taking a turn towards, I think trying to compare the modern day Grand National with the Maryland Hunt Cup and Pardubice is like comparing apples with oranges. All are tough in their own unique ways.
I would agree with you,
Katie
– which was rather my point. The American claims that their race may be "the most difficult horse race in the world" (Forbes article cited by
Miss Woodford
) needed to be put in perspective, though.
On the Racing first v. Betting first front, the current score seems to be approximately 26-3, with a few abstentions.
- Total Posts 17716
On the Racing first v. Betting first front, the current score seems to be approximately 26-3, with a few abstentions.
I accept this count.
Romantics would vote "racing first".
It’s tempting.But, perahps unbeknownst to all the people who participate in this thread, it happens to be the clarion call of the vile taxmen (Sarkozy and co).
They themselves know it holds no water but they think it’s good hype, to fool the non-savvy.
Their function is to destroy the punters’ fortunesand
racing in its turn.
So I voted with the nays.- Total Posts 17716
I don’t think I would have looked twice at Racing if it didn’t include any betting because I come from a gambling background and the betting aspect defiantly drew me in to broaden my horizons.
Now I’ve sort of prioritised my interests during my 3-4 years involved in the Sport and have become less of a bettor and to have more interest in the actual horse itself which has lead me to go to numerous open days, big meetings to be a part of history, hundreds of pounds spent on the breeding of the horse, their behaviours and background etc.
Whilst I’m now in a position where I can take away monetary interest in sport and still be thrilled and excited about Racing, if it wasn’t betting I don’t think I’d ever be in the position I am now.
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