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I know we are all having a laugh but the overwatering could hugely affect the breeding industry and not to its benefit. Very few horses are equally adept on soft and firm going and it could lead to stallions with a preference for good/good to firm falling out of favour to be replaced by horses who prefer soft in the going. Everyone a loser in that scenario. Let nature decide the going and only water if its brick hard. Wee rant over.
I think what Mickey describes is already happening. Firm ground horses are already being bred out of the sport.
I watched a video of Sir Prescott talking about watering last week (I found it on YouTube but I think ID might have posted it earlier on this thread as well).
He mentioned Sadler’s Wells and how his offspring showed a preference for ground on the soft side of good. Prescott speculated that Sadler’s Wells might not have become such a dominant sire in the era before watering.
It looks clear enough that clerks are not going to allow “firm” to be in the going description for any big races if they can avoid it.
“I know we are all having a laugh but the overwatering could hugely affect the breeding industry and not to its benefit.”
We are all having a laugh?
Have you not been reading the threads here the last year or two, Mickey?
I don’t think any of us are laughing and what you say about the impact on the breed many of us have said countless times.
If there’s any gallows humour, it’s because there’s no stopping the insanity of inbreeding for precocity and speed with the net result it produces cripples who break down on anything other than mud so they water and these precocious speed horses ironically end up clocking slower times than their ancestors.
It’s Grade A, 24-carat, One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest stuff.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Totally 100% barking mad. Surely the top trainers can see this. Yet still this nonsense continues. So unnecessary.
Never thought of the saddlers’ Wells connection but your right there. We would never had dayjur or Stravinsky brilliant sprints in todays climate which would be a crying shame.
“6.7 on 30-05-2023 at 14:00”
Now calling it Good to Firm in places at Epsom, yet the latest stick reading is still only 6.7.
Compare that with the stick reading on Derby Day last year.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"The Turftrack map shows the only good to firm bits are between the 10F to 8F pole (I assume that part of the track is more open to the elements?) and the 5F chute before it joins the main straight.
5mm applied Saturday & Monday with 3-5mm due Tuesday and reviewed daily thereafter – whatever they put on (the downhill part will get the most of it) will likely mean it could ride a little slower than the official stick readings baring in mind half a ton of racehorse will generate more downward pressure onto the turf than said man with stick!
Looking at the numbers on the Turftrack Stick readings (https://www.thejockeyclub.co.uk/epsom/owners-and-trainers/the-going/), 6.3 reads as good to soft with 6.9 reading as good and 7.5 reading as good to firm – so surely a 6.7 reading would indicate a leaning to good (good to soft in places) and not the official good (good to firm in places)?
I am confused.com as these course going stick readings http://turftrax.co.uk/going_stick_readings.html from the official website seem to contradict their own numbers scale
It was 7.4 at 11.50am on Derby Day last year, that was described as Good and Desert Crown was 1.18 seconds outside standard – I think that puts it into perspective.
The ground this year clearly is slower at present, given the weather it’s clearly had a lot of water put on it already, and it looks like even more will be put in it the next couple of days.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Seems like everything in life these days. Reality just ignored. I was at the springsteen gig in Edinburgh last night when the stadium announced there were no queue where I was trying to get in. It was rammed. I just hope it doesn’t end up with a tacky top surface.
“6.8 on 31-05-2023 at 07:00”
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Where does all of this water come from? If it’s the same reservoirs that everyone else uses then perhaps we could actually do with some Tabloid OUTRAGE™ for once. All this water wasted on these degenerate gambling addicts who are cruel to horses while YOU can’t wash your Range Rover thanks to a hosepipe ban.
We’ve actually had a hosepipe ban in place for about a month or so in parts of Devon and Cornwall, presumably a pre-emptive measure for when said Surrey Range Rover owners turn up to their second homes and need the taps to work.
I’m assuming no one has had running water in the Epsom and Ewell area for days – they’re posh, but they don’t half pong Derby week.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Epsom clerk putting the finishing touches to the ground ahead of the Derby and Oaks pic.twitter.com/WQx91ouiAS
— Luke. (@lukemusf) June 1, 2023
My vote for best reply goes to: “If they come Stands’ side in the Oaks tomorrow, I’ll join the protestors myself.”
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"“7.3 on 02-06-2023 at 07:00”
Fair play to Cooper – he does frequently overwater, but there are occasions (Eclipse day last year was one) when he gets it right and this reading is identical to Derby Day last year when Desert Crown was just 1.18s outside standard on officially Good ground and I’d agree with that.
More of this would be excellent.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"“7.2 on 03-06-2023 at 09:00”
Epsom Downs after overnight watering.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"
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