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Maggsy
The old form books are still surprisingly easy to find via used booksellers who specialise in horseracing. There is one in Manchester, and two near Newmarket. Having inadvertently helped set off alarm bells with the proprietor in a previous post, I don’t want to cause more upset by posting their names, but if you care to use the personal message facility I’ll give them to you, assuming that is allowed.
Hensman, Maggsy
"the Little Owl and Sunset Cristo races"
I have found this form book the most difficult to come by in recent years. Now you would think that the same number of form books were printed each year and therefore the same number trickle onto the market, but that does not seem to be the case with this one. I eventually found one in a job lot and had to sell on all the others I did not need!
It may be that the weekly one that builds up into a book is more readily available.Hensman
Regarding form in the Spells it All out article. I would agree that the sentence " Form is considered a major factor to winner finding and what is form if it is not that one performance is better than another"? is important.
I would also think that the statements "and most important, how they performed in the latter stages of each race" and re Sunset Cristo "The form is impressive and note not only how it ran, but what it had behind it". Would also help to explain how VDW might have sought to find if a performance was better than another.
I have also been trying to get hold of the details of the Little Owl race .. does anyone fancy sharing the story ?
dave jay
I am not quite sure what you mean? I don’t think anyone will go through a couple of years form and post up all the relavant results/details unless of course they have this to hand and know how to transfer it to the forum. I have not got it in that format.
In the season previous to when VDW gave it as "a racing certainty" Little Owl ran in the Sun Alliance Novices chase at Cheltenham where it was hampered and fell. It was no lost cause though at the start of the race as it was 2nd fav. So in 1980-1 season it was being brought on from that. Whether VDW backed it previously to March 1980 we do not know.This really is like the secret of secret clubs – I’m sure I haven’t gestured the correct hand shake or head nod yet
Yes, agreed SS, this is becoming like a secret church for the disciples of the Dutchman!
However, with over 7,000 viewings, it’s clearly struck a chord. You’re either with ’em or agin ’em, as the dreaded John Guant might utter.
Hensman, no problem at all posting the names of 2nd hand racing booksellers, in fact that would be classified as generally helpful.
It’s contrived links to commercial enterprises and other forums that I object to.
Sailing Shoes
Where’s the secrecy? The form for all VDW’s examples, including the Little Owl one, is in the Form Books and the back numbers of the Life to which, with a modicum of effort, anyone can access. Indeed for the later VDW examples the form is on the Post website.
I’m not sure there is secrecy as such – just nobody seems to know the rules to the system and people seem to come up with varying selections.
Cormack
I have sent Maggsy the info. by the messaging facility, but in case anyone else is interested I’ve found the following very useful sources of second hand racing books, including form books:
Janet Carters: 01638 717619
Greg Way: 01638 507217they are booksellers in the Newmarket area who specialise (in Janet’s case I think exclusively) in racing books. Both have websites which can probably be found by Google but I don’t have them to hand.
Browzers books, based in Manchester. Their ‘phone number is 0161 773 2327, but they have a really good website the address of which is either http://www.browzers.co.uk or http://www.browzers.com.
I’ve bought books from each over the years. They are all very helpful and one or other has usually had what I want in stock or has found it for me within a few weeks.
"just nobody seems to know the rules to the system and people seem to come up with varying selections".
Sailing Shoes
It is a method not a system, which is why there are few ‘rules’ as you would see them.
The fact that it is a method means that the principles of VDW have been interpreted differently. Hence the arguments.
I only ask because a friend of mine calls himself ‘Little Owl’ .. I just wondered if there was anything interesting about the horse that I could mention to him in the passing .. that would make it look like I know more than I actually do.
Samson,
Then why do people debate selections? When it appears now to be an interpretation of the original (even if it appears to be written in code to me) methods?
Also, if VDW was still writing coded messages furiously do you not think his methods would have changed dramatically?
Sorry if this seems like a poke in the fire.
"Then why do people debate selections"?
Whose selections? VDW’s?
You hit the nail on the head in a way when you said that it seemed to be written in ‘code’ plus of course the ‘missing link’. Some claim to have solved the puzzle and of course they keep it to themselves or delight in tormenting others who can not find it. Selections by followers of the method will always differ up to a point because unless you have the ‘full Monty’, then individuals have tailored the methods to suit themselves and make it profitable. This means that exponents of VDW who have not got the full picture will frequently discuss/argue over selections. Some like handicaps, some specialise in non handicaps, some have a bash at both. Others will not touch the big field sprints etc etc
I was going to say I hope this helps, but it probably does not!!
Mtoto – you’re not actually VDW yourself are you? Just wondered as you do seem to have the old Dutchman on the brain!
Cormack,
No, I’m afraid not. Old I maybe but not that old. As this is a racing forum it is hardly surprising the only thing I mention on here is racing, but I do have many other interest.
As to having an old Duchman on the brain I hardly think that is fair. As said the only reason I came on here was to find out how others looked at VDW and why? Some answered the question but the why seems to be based on very little as they haven’t bothered to read the literature. I and a couple of others have tried to answer any questions raised about the method so once again it is hardly surprising the talk has been about VDW.
I went on to another thread and asked a question of someone who looked as if he had some views on VDW. Now this person has a couple of thread that talk about VDW, he has also written a book on the subject. Plus he has a whole page on his website dedicated to VDW and his ideas. Some of which I agree with and some I have doubts about.
So to be honest I don’t understand your question. I have found out what I wanted to know. Even on here very few have had a good look at VDW so have no real idea what its about. The other thing that is blatantly obvious judging by the number of hits there are a lot who are interested, either that or they are hoping to see a good row.
So knock me of the members list and I will go away. I have achieved what I wanted, I have no wish to "educate" anyone about VDW. However I do find it hard to ignore some of the rubbish that is spoken about his methods.
Bye
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