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Oh, give over. Some of the racing this week at the AW tracks has been excellent and some of the horses of reasonable quality.
I for one will be disappointed in January when they phase out the twilight meetings. Do you really just want to watch racing for three hours? I’m just getting started by three thirty.
Also, for the bettor, AW racing is an excellent alternative to jumping which is not everyone’s main cup of tea. I’m glad I live in an era where the punter has a choice of events on which to bet, rather than twenty years ago where you bet on what you were told.
They need to sort out the admission prices though.
It’s just smoke and mirrors based on prejudice and history to keep comparing these meetings with low grade greyhound racing.
Max , you have missed the point , Kempton is now exactly like a low grade greyhound meeting
<br>Punter choice is certainly showing , nobody is attending !!!
<br>cheers
R
I agree with Maxilon to a degree here. Anyone remember Saturday afternoons in the 70s?<br>Wetherby and Uttoxeter are abandoned, and the (now depleted) ITV 3 is comprised of three from Hackney Wick?<br>Thank god those days are gone, and we DO now have a choice. While I don’t pretend to enjoy the a/w as much as NH, it is kind of soothing to know that on a quiet Thursday afternoon you can turn on the TV and see 14 live races. Back in the day, you would need to pop down the bookies for a fix which I couldn’t do as a fourteen year old LOL<br>We never had it so good. Remember that. Racing is for watching as well as betting. No-one is obliged to place a stake on the 525 at Kempton. But the fact that it is there is a good thing.<br>I would draw the line at all racing being of the same ilk. However, as an alternative to nothing, it is OK.
Also true is that most people on this forum like racing and remember Kempton for what it was , a fun place with reasonable racing , with good craic on a wedensday summer evening
Ricky…its the same races as before! Just about everything was directly transfeered from the flat and lets face it, the flat programme was about the worst of a grade one track
true Clive , just hate to see it downgraded so much
<br>ON REFLECTION i agree with Max , his wider point is good
<br>Ipromise to shut up about Kempton for a while :cheesy:
Polytrack is very much a surface of chaos so it produces substandard ,bookie biased racing that most punters will find bleeds them dry over the long term.<br>The racing at Kempton is not really racing its pseudo virtual racing fodder this time using real characters.<br>It is catering for bookmakers AND the xmas corporate market.The twilight meetings attract the xmas office party crowd and have been aggressively marketed as such.Thats why there are so many of them just now.<br>I used to be much less tolerant than this and would have called for its abolition immediately but these days I am happy to let them build what they want and put on whatever racing they want.As someone has already said on this thread we do not have to go there and we do not have to bet on it.
(Edited by Plato at 6:40 pm on Nov. 25, 2006)
I used to be much less tolerant than this and would have called for its abolition immediately but these days I am happy to let them build what they want and put on whatever racing they want
Thats very kind of you! :cheesy:
<br>As usual in discussions about AW racing, the anti brigade just ignore any inconvenient facts, so for the sake of balance, may I point out that three twilight meetings held Wed/Fri/Sat produced 15 winners at 5/1 or less from 18 races, and only one winner at a double figure price.
If that’s unpredictable chaos, can we have more of it please.
And if you really think the results are that hard to predict, then just lay every favourite and surely you’ll make a fortune?
AP
Now then AP
We mustn’t let a little matter like the facts get in the way of a good story. Tut,tut!
Rob
In terms of quality though, 8 of the 12 races at Friday and Saturday’s twilight meetings have been down at Class 6. Makes Lingfield and even Wolves look classy.<br>Still there is an all banded afternoon card at kempton on Monday which will have the crowds and rails bookies flocking in!
(Edited by Lingfield at 8:27 pm on Nov. 25, 2006)
People may have a perception that the south is affluent with jobs and good wages available but in reality people are mortgaged to the hilt, pay through the nose for entertainment and groceries and get stung on their council tax to subsidise the north.
You could always move. I believe Rochdale is pleasant this time of year.
There may be perfectly good reasons for deciding that all-weather is not for you. But many of the remarks made about the game are clearly prejudiced and reflect poorly on those who make them.
Quote: from Aranalde on 8:26 pm on Nov. 25, 2006[br]
People may have a perception that the south is affluent with jobs and good wages  available but in reality people are mortgaged to the hilt, pay through the nose for entertainment and groceries and get stung on their council tax to subsidise the north.
You could always move. I believe Rochdale is pleasant this time of year. <br>
I’m afraid that the fell running, whippet racing, working men’s clubs and cold make limited appeal
For all those that hate allweather racing (which i gather<br> we are forced to watch) tell me how its removal from the scene would benefit existing turf racing?
AP
After we know the results over 3 meetings we can all point to a brief pattern one way or the other.Over the long term that actually says nothing about whether the racing is reasonably predictable before the races are run or not.In any case chaos does not mean only long price horses winning.That would be all too easy and the opposite of chaos for me.Order comes from some reasonable consistency in patterns and/ or in performances.The problem with Kempton for me is that I can see virtually no consistent pattern that seems to hold. That may be my failing however and good luck to you if you are cleaning up at Kempton.
If someone can turn a profit backing on the Polytrack then good luck to them.Though I know no serious punter that is doing so over the long term.Indeed I know of one off course bookie that analysed his profit levels from his punters on the different codes of racing in his shops and lets just say he can’t get enough of the polytrack and made the comment to me that he would pay for the likes of Great Leighs himself!That was only an analysis of 6 months however.
Blind laying of the favourites can never work because the market adjusts itself and the prices needed to lay on the exchanges would make that almost cetrain to be an unsuccessful strategy in the long term.
Neither am I anti all weather.I used to bet extensively at the old Wolver and at Southwell and on the old Lingfield.I loved the challenge and the patterns that could be used.Now there is only Southwell for me and that has become slightly marginalised because of the lack of similar surfaces.
Purely from a punting point of view I am anti polytrack therefore.That is my experience and three days results at Kempton does not go far in changing that.Judging from the number of punters betting in the ring at Kempton and Lingfield a few others have a similar experience.For my part I go to those tracks rarely these days and when I do go I tend to watch rather than punt.I miss the fun that the old surfaces represented for me.But good luck and well done to someone who is cleaning up on the surface.They deserve their rewards IMO.
The problem with Kempton for me is that I can see virtually no consistent pattern
<br>And neither can the the layers – great innit ;)
Quote: from apracing on 8:10 pm on Nov. 25, 2006[br]<br>As usual in discussions about AW racing, the anti brigade just ignore any inconvenient facts, so for the sake of balance, may I point out that three twilight meetings held Wed/Fri/Sat produced 15 winners at 5/1 or less from 18 races, and only one winner at a double figure price.
If that’s unpredictable chaos, can we have more of it please.
And if you really think the results are that hard to predict, then just lay every favourite and surely you’ll make a fortune?
AP
<br>
As usual in these discussions, AP uses the fallacious argumentative technique of proof by selective instance.
When looking at a sample of data it’s better to look at the full sample rather than a few races. The last time I looked there was no favourite-longshot bias at Kempton! The place defies the universal laws of racecourse markets!
Look in today’s Post: 36% loss at level stakes on all favs in non-hcaps, 16% loss at level stakes in all hcaps. That means the jolly backer in the shops loses four times as much at Kempton than elsewhere. FOUR TIMES!
I seem to recall offering to bet TDK at the start of the year that Kempton would be bringing up the rear in the RP favs table. He suddenly went AWOL. I’m prepared to extend the offer to anyone that wants to put their money where their mouth is, though don’t expect any takers……
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