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Would Golden Miller or any other Aintree expert have any information on the dimensions of The Chair down the years. Only a judgement of the eye of course, but it looked a pitiful version of its former spine tingling self in The Becher just now.
Would Golden Miller or any other Aintree expert have any information on the dimensions of The Chair down the years. Only a judgement of the eye of course, but it looked a pitiful version of its former spine tingling self in The Becher just now.
Do course builders lower the Grand National course in very soft ground for safety, Cav? For a long time I’ve suspected they do; not that it’ll be made public.
Value Is EverythingI think what you are seeing is the effect of the removal of the wooden core. There is comparatively little ‘birch’ either, so nothing really to offer resistance and the horses are essentially brushing through loose spruce.
Yep, Joe is correct. The dimensions are the same but with softer cores, which is a good thing for safety, but the spruce dressings are far too loose in my opinion.
When the commentator calls “as they approach The Chair”, you hear about the fence before you see it, you know whats coming next, the excitement builds. Always one of the biggest thrills in horseracing, that few seconds before they actually jump the fence.
What a damp squib it was today, have never seen it look smaller. Valentines and the final ditch are visually the most fearsome fences on the course these days imo.
The third fence always used to make me gawp as it looked monsterous back in the day – still a tough course to jump round (especially in today’s conditions) but it is no longer the ultimate jumping test that it was.
There was a loss of 2 million viewers for the national this year on ITV and that was blamed on the fine weather,but could it be down to these soft fences that has now turned the national into just another long distance chase and the general public are slowly noticing that the thrills and spills are much diminished and they’ve lost interest in it?
If we could arrange for a few more of these in the National it might be more popular
There was a loss of 2 million viewers for the national this year on ITV and that was blamed on the fine weather,but could it be down to these soft fences that has now turned the national into just another long distance chase and the general public are slowly noticing that the thrills and spills are much diminished and they’ve lost interest in it?
If the public want to see “more thrills and spills” then they can go XXXX themselves.
EDIT: ie If the public want to see more deaths of racehorses then they can go….
Personally, I doubt the “public” do want that.
Fall in viewers in one year means nothing.Value Is EverythingThe mystique has been forever lost and the race is now a glorified long distance staying compacted handicap chase.
Whilst I fully understand why the fences were made safer for welfare concerns (with the guts of the fences needing to have safer material that was more forgiving) I think they have gone slightly too far the other way now. There is now less respect for the fences now because you know that you can take more of a liberty with them and actually get away with it and as a result they tend to approach the fences at a much faster pace than they should.
The truly sad thing is that we only have to get one unfortunate renewal of the race where our luck runs out with fatalities and we will be straight back in the same boat that we were in before changes were ever made – hand on heart most of us probably now go into the day first foremost thinking to ourselves ‘please don’t let there be any fatalities’.
There is now less respect for the fences now because you know that you can take more of a liberty with them and actually get away with it and as a result they tend to approach the fences at a much faster pace than they should.
“Get away with it” has imo always been a misleading phrase. Horses lose both momentum and energy by making mistakes, so although they may not fall it still reduces their chance significantly. I backed the first 4 in the Betfair and the winner of the Grand Sefton yesterday, a massive reason for backing all five horses was they’re all particularly good jumpers – normally making ground at their fences. Also backed 5 of the last 7 Grand National winners, had the first 4 home in one of those years and several second places too – with again jumping ability one of the main reasons for backing them. Horses can go through the top easier than they used to – but make no mistake – jumping ability is still of massive importance over Grand National fences.
That said, do think The Chair has been lowered too much, may be they don’t want to risk a horror show in front of the stands. Ditto Beechers.
Value Is EverythingBy getting away with it I meant not falling – back when the top wasn’t as loose as it is now horses had to make a better shape over the fences or they would fall.
Not saying you still don’t need a decent jumper just that jumping ability is not a premium requirement like it once was – you note many more horses going through the tops of the fences than ever before with a horse like Monbeg Dude being a prime example (he barely got high enough to get over a regulation fence let alone a National fence) and yet he finished 3rd & 7th in two Nationals……I highly doubt he would ever have got round in the race prior to the various changes made.
Now I don’t want people to accuse me of wanting to see horses fall in the race but knowing horses now have a much bigger margin of error does for me take away from the race being considered the biggest jumping test for a horse. I now would have to think that maybe races like the Welsh National, Eider or Midlands National are just as difficult a test for a horse especially when given they are usually run on hock deep ground – one could even argue that maybe the toughest jumping test is now the Velka Pardubicka.
With that all being said, the National is still a race you look forward to each year and I don’t see that changing at all.
You know they’ve gone too far the other way when mistakes made at the Chair and Bechers would have resulted in falls over regular fences, but instead barely get a peck on landing here. I’m not pining for more falls or anything like that, just for the actual course to prove a better challenge than say the Mildmay course? I’ve said it a million and one times, but why could they not have just replaced the wooden cores with regular park fences and just spruced them up? All the image and challenge with none of the extra risk.
By getting away with it I meant not falling – back when the top wasn’t as loose as it is now horses had to make a better shape over the fences or they would fall.
Not saying you still don’t need a decent jumper just that jumping ability is not a premium requirement like it once was – you note many more horses going through the tops of the fences than ever before with a horse like Monbeg Dude being a prime example (he barely got high enough to get over a regulation fence let alone a National fence) and yet he finished 3rd & 7th in two Nationals……I highly doubt he would ever have got round in the race prior to the various changes made.
His jumping stopped Monbeg Dude winning an Aintree Grand National, he won a Welsh Grand National and even won at Cheltenham. I’d rather a horse “got round” and paid for his poor jumping by not winning, than falling and risking injury/death.
Value Is EverythingPerhaps a park fence dressed in spruce would be a better option. For anyone in any doubt about why things had to change. Here are the cores that were in every fence – this is Becher’s in the late 1990s.
You know they’ve gone too far the other way when mistakes made at the Chair and Bechers would have resulted in falls over regular fences, but instead barely get a peck on landing here. I’m not pining for more falls or anything like that, just for the actual course to prove a better challenge than say the Mildmay course? I’ve said it a million and one times, but why could they not have just replaced the wooden cores with regular park fences and just spruced them up? All the image and challenge with none of the extra risk.
Thought I heard they’re planning on (or actually doing so) replacing the cores of normal fences with soft cores too.
Value Is EverythingPerhaps a park fence dressed in spruce would be a better option.
It will never happen, I would think Aintree and the BHA are very happy with the current scenario. Thought yesterdays race was an extremely tedious affair, sadly like most races over the National fences these days
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