The home of intelligent horse racing discussion
The home of intelligent horse racing discussion

Sussex Stakes 2025

Home Forums Big Races – Discussion Sussex Stakes 2025

Viewing 17 posts - 35 through 51 (of 59 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #1737234
    Oscar
    Participant
    • Total Posts 351

    I think the way that Serengeti, having missed the start, came flying past them might have given some of the jockeys the false impression that the other pacemaker must be going too fast.

    #1737235
    TheTinMan87
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1305

    Delighted with that result, I hate pacemakers so its funny that its gone wrong in a group 1. If your horse is that good they can sort themselves out whatever the pace setup. Give me Sea The Stars, Enable etc any day of the week over those who need it teeing up for them.

    #1737237
    Avatar photoEx RubyLight
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5193

    You have to doubt the quality of the performance!!! How many times in the past 35 years of horse racing involvement have I witnessed a jockey turning around three times in a G1 Flat race, almost thinking of slowing down the horse and then still winning it?
    Hate to say this, but the G1s especially this season have a tendency of becoming a farce. The Derby, the Oaks both decided after two furlongs or so, the Coolmore unsportsmanlike conduct in the King George and now a worthless Sussex Stakes…..
    We surely had better quality in the past and better sportsmanship.

    #1737238
    LD73
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3839

    Thats why it was such a good ride from Kingscote – he wasn’t going fast at the start and was looking behind him several times to gauge just how far ahead he was and when Serengeti finally came upsides and then past him, he again looked behind him and you could see him realise that if he went with Serengeti they would end up going too fast so he then took a pull to drop back several lengths off the lead.

    That particular move still left him plenty far ahead of the rest of the field (cheap lengths that he gained from the start for not much effort) but ensured that he was going a more sensible pace (which the other jockeys ignored and sat off) and it was that particular move I think that actually won him the race, as it allowed him to save just enough energy for the horse to be able to get home in front.

    The overall time was only 1.12sec slower than standard which would again indicate Kingscote didn’t go too fast and got the fractions pretty much bang on for his horse and had the other jockeys not had a collective brain fart and sat closer to him from the start they would have all said it was a perfectly run race.

    #1737241
    Avatar photoEx RubyLight
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5193

    Agree with you LD and would also like to point out that the winner is now three from three at Goodwood. I hope the next time he runs against Field Of Gold will be without pacemaking duties. But it was definitely a very intelligent ride from Kingscote.

    #1737242
    LD73
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3839

    Just like Continuous in the King George, Serengeti’s participation/role in the race turned out to be a complete waste of time – the fact that Lordan (after rushing his horse to the front after missing the break – I mean as a pacemaker you first main job is to ensure that you don’t blow the start) he then seemed completely oblivious to where his horse was positioned in comparison to his stable mate (who he was supposedly making the pace for) and it was a complete joke of a ride and rather amateurish……….that is why it was another tactical cock-up by Coolmore.

    #1737243
    LD73
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3839

    Ruby – I did mention his unbeaten run at Goodwood in an earlier post – I would be surprised if they used him again in a pacemaker capacity honestly as I think he is better than that, although I wouldn’t give him a hope in hell of winning another of the G1 mile races but given his liking for Goodwood, the G2 Celebration Mile at the end of next month would seem a no brainer.

    #1737244
    Avatar photoRefuse To Bend
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3765

    Kingscote has ridden a blinder credit to him. Weaver said the 2nd, 3rd and 4th were the better horses well they weren’t today because if they were then one of them would have won. Weaver is saying the stewards should look into it, why?

    The more I know the less I understand.

    #1737247
    kasparov
    Participant
    • Total Posts 121

    “I feel like a villain, but when I saw it wasn’t a grey nose coming towards me I kept going.” Quite the admission from Richard Kingscote, suggesting that he might not have tried to win in other circumstances.

    #1737249
    Avatar photoGingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34708

    As for people wanting an inquiry into the race:
    Rosallion, Henri, Field and Docklands could all be described as “best (and / or had got used to being) held up”. Therefore you can understand why all the other jockeys wanted another horse to go for home first – to bridge the gap. The ex-American / Aussie horse the only non-pacemaker who’s fully effective racing prominently, but he is also effective held up. Bit free early so probably would’ve been too keen if racing in a clear third. Connections probably thought their best chance of winning was if the principles went too fast too soon and Carl Sparkler picks up the pieces. So can also understand his rider not racing in third.

    So tbh, everyone can see the pace and types of horses involved I think it is obvious why it happened and no point of inquiring.

    Value Is Everything
    #1737253
    Avatar photoGingertipster
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34708

    Kingscote’s comment certainly suggests the authorities should have another look at the Lingfield Derby Trial, Kasparov. Coolmore second string Stay True given an easy time by Kingscote when first string Puppet Master challenged.

    Value Is Everything
    #1737257
    LD73
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3839

    Problem is that the authorities have let this type of thing i.e. pacemaking/team tactics/horses running (or not) on their own merits etc go on for far too long without enquiries to now go to starting to ask questions when incidents happen……especially considering it is racing’s powerhouse operations (Coolmore predominantly but also Godolphin & Juddmonte) that by and large are the only ones with the sheer number of good class horses available to sacrifice as pacemakers in all these high profile races.

    Would be the proverbial pandora’s box if they did and we all know they lack the testicular fortitude to take on these type of issues especially when real big names are involved.

    #1737258
    LD73
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3839

    I cannot lie but the WTF just happened here atmosphere that settle over the whole crowd at Goodwood immediately following the race was highly amusing though.

    #1737274
    Helcatmudwrestler
    Participant
    • Total Posts 768

    Its a bit like Emperors new clothes this pacemaker stuff when they say horses run on merits .
    Kingscote said in interview i saw nose coming up werent grey late on so he kept on . So what would he have done if it was FOG nose .
    In the Beckett interview the interviewer stressed the horse ran on his merits .

    Beckett then said he was in there to help !! . Of course he was we know that so why stress Qirat was run on his merits , does he normally go straight to lead ?? .
    Anyway Iam glad he won , some stallion values deflated there .

    #1737275
    Helcatmudwrestler
    Participant
    • Total Posts 768

    Gosden was funny after too , iam not going to make excuses , then makes excuses . Brilliant stuff .
    I do love Glorious Goodwood though , cracking weeks racing .

    #1737290
    zanybody
    Participant
    • Total Posts 89

    Are there any regulatory bodies, sports or otherwise, that actually do the job they are there to do?

    #1737292
    Helcatmudwrestler
    Participant
    • Total Posts 768

    Iam really looking forward to Qirat next up , he will defo be ridden to win on his merits however won’t be given too much rope so in theory should find it very difficult but he looks a cracking horse to look at and I hope he is a late maturing type like what Beckett alluded to , Carl Sparkler was average , my ante post Cox Plate bet looks iffy now .
    Qirat on that , as a gelding would win millions in OZ .

Viewing 17 posts - 35 through 51 (of 59 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.