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John Carr has said he’s bang on target for Cheltenham.
I was shocked to find he has only had 1 winner this season, his record as a trainer looks abysmal.
I never heard of the man before last year anyone know what his past is?
John Carr has said he’s bang on target for Cheltenham.
I was shocked to find he has only had 1 winner this season, his record as a trainer looks abysmal.
I never heard of the man before last year anyone know what his past is?
He trained the winner of the Champion Hurdle last year – the guy clearly hasn’t a clue.
like the guy I’d never heard of who just happened to train last years Grand National winner – this is the latest ploy by the Irish – no longer horses we’ve never heard of but trainers….aha, they’ve been rumbled!
The bizarre thing about Gordon Elliot was that at the time of Silver Birch’s win in the National he hadn’t trained a winner in his native Ireland.
All his winners had been in the UK and as things stand now he has had twice as many winners over here as over there (12-6).John Carr has said he’s bang on target for Cheltenham.
I was shocked to find he has only had 1 winner this season, his record as a trainer looks abysmal.
I never heard of the man before last year anyone know what his past is?
He trained the winner of the Champion Hurdle last year – the guy clearly hasn’t a clue.
would that be yourself you are talking about
You think because someone wins a big race they are a good trainer?Grand National winners Rubstic and Red Rum were trained by trainers who’s records were a joke. First thing a punter would do if they saw the name Ginger McCain next to a horse was put a line through it……..Donald is of course a different ball game but the old man was near on useless.
How many times have you heard people say Red Rum trained himself……you ever wonder why?
It just so happened John Leadbetter had a small yard near to Harry Bell’s. when John Douglas and Harry had a fight he moved the horse there.
Margaret Bell harry’s daughter was friends with John and she kept him right on more than one occasion advising him……………..having been to his yard several times back then I can assure you his yard was a joke in comparison to what you would expect and he couldn’t train a pig to be dirty. Nice guy but didn’t have a clue………..when Rubstuc had gone john quickly followed being unable to attarct any owners.
A Horse can make a trainer but give them a dozen other horses and they’ll be lucky to have a winner in 50 runs.
I wwould rmuch rather judge the horse on its Champion Hurdle victory of last year, rather than its last run. That win is the true reflection of what the horse is capable of – so it would be folly to dismiss its chances out of hand simply because the trainer is not a familiar name or "face"
If the horse is in fine fettle and working well, who’s to say he won’t repeat last year’s feat.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
I wwould rmuch rather judge the horse on its Champion Hurdle victory of last year, rather than its last run. That win is the true reflection of what the horse is capable of – so it would be folly to dismiss its chances out of hand simply because the trainer is not a familiar name or "face"
If the horse is in fine fettle and working well, who’s to say he won’t repeat last year’s feat.
As carzy as it may sound "H" I don’t think he truly gets the trip and think he will struggle to be in the first 3. He looked like a non stayer behind Straw Bear to me and agin last year was a bit disappointing when he raan on very one paced after talking the lead….he just never put any distance between himslef and twp very tired horses and Afsoun looked to be finishing better tha he was.
I know he was ayounger horse when he ran behind Noland but he actually looked a huge threat until he hit that rising gound then nothing.
He may be stronger now I don’t know but what I do know is this is a much better race this year, in most people opinion and he’s going to have to improve a helluva lot to win it…..fair play to him if he does I just can’t see it.
I wouldn’t even think about backing this horse until you’ve seen him in the paddock and preferrably in the flesh as tv pictures never do things justice.
I think he beat some ailing champions who slit their own throats a bit because they didn’t think they had anything other horse to worry about. Even if he was back to his best, he has a job on his hands to beat Sizing Europe, Harchibald or Osana.. I can see him battling out fourth with Katchit (apologies to the Katchit fans!).
I wouldn’t even think about backing this horse until you’ve seen him in the paddock and preferrably in the flesh as tv pictures never do things justice.
I think he beat some ailing champions who slit their own throats a bit because they didn’t think they had anything other horse to worry about. Even if he was back to his best, he has a job on his hands to beat Sizing Europe, Harchibald or Osana.. I can see him battling out fourth with Katchit (apologies to the Katchit fans!).
Don’t forget that whilst everyone thinks of Sizing Europe as the new kid on the block, he has run over hurdles as many times as Sublimity. IMHO it wouldn’t be surprising if Sublimity still has more improvement in him. In addition, despite his inexperience, he has already won a Champion Hurdle. He’s the one they all have to beat and he has the form in the locker.
I wwould rmuch rather judge the horse on its Champion Hurdle victory of last year, rather than its last run. That win is the true reflection of what the horse is capable of – so it would be folly to dismiss its chances out of hand simply because the trainer is not a familiar name or "face"
If the horse is in fine fettle and working well, who’s to say he won’t repeat last year’s feat.
As carzy as it may sound "H" I don’t think he truly gets the trip and think he will struggle to be in the first 3. He looked like a non stayer behind Straw Bear to me and agin last year was a bit disappointing when he raan on very one paced after talking the lead….he just never put any distance between himslef and twp very tired horses and Afsoun looked to be finishing better tha he was.
I know he was ayounger horse when he ran behind Noland but he actually looked a huge threat until he hit that rising gound then nothing.
He may be stronger now I don’t know but what I do know is this is a much better race this year, in most people opinion and he’s going to have to improve a helluva lot to win it…..fair play to him if he does I just can’t see it.
Yes, FOF, it promises to be a fascinating race for sure, and one we are all eagerly anticpating. I agree with you that this year’s renewal has a better quality field. I should add that I’m more hopeful than confident about Sublimity winning. Isn’t it funny how many of us become less confident about our big race fancies as the d-day approaches. I know I certainly do (must be that old pesssimistic monster casting its doubt over me – again!).
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
Bang on target my ass- he’ll be lapped.
Just out of interest, Carvs, do you base that on seeing last years’ CH as a weak renewal, or the doubt regarding Sublimitys’ race fitness with him lacking a run since that waddle in the Boylesports?
I do think many pundits have unfairly crabbed Sublimity’s victory last year. Here is a list of the last ten CH winners and the Racing Post rating achieved:
2007 Sublimity 170
2006 Brave Inca 171
2005 Hardy Eustace 168
2004 Hardy Eustace 170
2003 Rooster Booster 173
2002 Hors La Loi III 166
2000 Istabraq 171
1999 Istabraq 170
1998 Istabraq 174
1997 Make A Stand 167You can see that last year’s race was well up to standard and if you bear in mind that Sublimity was having only his sixth run over hurdles (making him the least experienced in that list) it’s not difficult to suppose he could improve on the rating of 170 achieved last year.
I’ve always knocked him Tuffers for several reasons.
1. Hardy Eustace came under pressure fmuch earlier last year than he did in any other of his CH runs.
2. Not one of the fancied horses mainly HE Straw Bear and Detroit City ran anything like a good race.
3. He found nothing the minute he hit the rising ground and he looked too much like the same horse I saw finding nothing behind Noland……despite looking all over the winner approaching the last.
If I had bet him the fact he’s only run once would not bother me one bit.
He probably doesn’t stand much racing so they don’t want to run him. I doubt if there is anything wrong with the horse.My feeling is that at some point around the 3rd last Katchit or perhaps Osana are going to turn the screw and head for home and they won’t be slowing down lkike HE and Brave Inca were……….Whatever does make the break is the one they will all have to beat.
I can see Sublimity going after the leader/s but I don’t think he will find an ounce if he comes of the bridle.
I have been a fan of Sizing Europe for months, well before he was fav for the CH……..the horse has a high cruisng speed and although he may not have the short burst of speed Sublimity has has a huge stride that gets him on to horses without breaking his back to do it.
He looks in a different league to Sublimity to me and has more ammo.
There will be more than SE chasing Katchit. for me is the horse most likely to lead after the 3rd last. Afsoun may take better to a stronger pace than Sublimty and has only 3 lengths to find on him. Harchibald with his high cruising speed will no doubt stick his nose in………Osana I don’t know enough about but he also could be there if his price is anything to go by.
To me whatever catches Katchit wins and I just can’t see Sublimity having enough firepower to do it……Sizinfg Europe Katchit Harchibald and Afsoun against the field for me.
Fist
We’re all obviously free to have our own opinions of the form but if we take RP ratings as a benchmark, Sizing Europe’s win in the AIG matched Sublimity’s win in the CH. My concern about Sizing Europe is that he doesn’t have the fluent hurdling style you would normally associate with CH winners in that he seems to spend a bit too much time in the air over his hurdles.
That said I’m sure he’ll go close – I just think he has it all to prove whereas Sublimity has already done it.
You think because someone wins a big race they are a good trainer?
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