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And here is his chance
traveled well, handed the track and fast conditions, and was only 2.5L behind the leaders at the mile pole before being run down into 6th beaten 7 lengths
He then goes on to run in Eclipse over 10f to finish a close up 3rd behind two proven middle distance horses
The handling of the track and Fast surface in 2006, and now the close up 3rd in the Eclipse gives connections the inkling that it may be worth trying GW in Classic again, he’s another year on, more mature and probably stronger, so he’s given a prep in the Moulin and off he goes
Connections have no control of the weather and slop is the track condition, this is a unknown for most horses including GW, but seeing as the track is still considered fast and this race has probably been the plan since his Eclipse run, they take the decision to run him
Sadly for GW and connections this decision is fatal
Did they see it coming, NO and nor did anyone else , unless your name is Mystic Meg of course
Well put. Anyone who thinks Coolmore acted wrongly or put GW’s health unnecessarily at risk really doesn’t understand them as people, and horsracing as a sport. It is a very, very low, and unsubstantiated angle on which to look at this weekend’s very sad events.
Well put. Anyone who thinks Coolmore acted wrongly or put GW’s health unnecessarily at risk really doesn’t understand them as people, and horsracing as a sport. It is a very, very low, and unsubstantiated angle on which to look at this weekend’s very sad events.
I don’t think one person had said that Coolmore put GW’s health unnecessarily at risk – nobody could have predicted the events that unfolded.
But I would like to disagree, as someone who thinks the horse shouldn’t have ran in the race, that I don’t understand horse racing as a sport, I really don’t think you can claim, that those of us who think the horse shouldn’t have ran, don’t understand the sport.
My reasons for thinking the horse shouldn’t have ran are purely and simply based on form. We were talking about a horse that hadn’t won for over a year, a horse that has never won over 10f, a horse that didn’t do very well when trying the same thing last year, a horse with a huge temprament problem – and to add to that he was racing against the best dirt horses in the world in a race regarded by many as one of the highest quality classics that had ever been staged.
I don’t think that horse should have ran and I stick by my opinion. Do you still think I don’t understand horse racing as a sport?
Mike
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Well put. Anyone who thinks Coolmore acted wrongly or put GW’s health unnecessarily at risk really doesn’t understand them as people, and horsracing as a sport. It is a very, very low, and unsubstantiated angle on which to look at this weekend’s very sad events.
I don’t think one person had said that Coolmore put GW’s health unnecessarily at risk – nobody could have predicted the events that unfolded.
But I would like to disagree, as someone who thinks the horse shouldn’t have ran in the race, that I don’t understand horse racing as a sport, I really don’t think you can claim, that those of us who think the horse shouldn’t have ran, don’t understand the sport.
My reasons for thinking the horse shouldn’t have ran are purely and simply based on form. We were talking about a horse that hadn’t won for over a year, a horse that has never won over 10f, a horse that didn’t do very well when trying the same thing last year, a horse with a huge temprament problem – and to add to that he was racing against the best dirt horses in the world in a race regarded by many as one of the highest quality classics that had ever been staged.
I don’t think that horse should have ran and I stick by my opinion. Do you still think I don’t understand horse racing as a sport?
Mike
That begs the rather obvious question;………do you understand it better than the horse’s trainer?
Mikky
I’ve just give you reasons why connections thought it was worth another tilt, now you may disagree with them, but imo
The horse PROVED he handled a dirt track last year, but what he didn’t do last year is STAY, then, in the Eclipse a year later he showed 10f was not beyond him on turf
What GW had to PROVE is he handled slop and he stayed 10f on Dirt
Connections were NOT wrong in having another go IMO
And although i cannot be sure, here is why i think he ran like he did
The pace or the race
going by the sectionals set prior to the Classic, the sectionals suggest that early on it was at sprint fractions, the equaling of the track record also suggests strong fractions
GW couldn’t go the pace
The track, with the rains coming, it caused the sealing of the track, this takes away any cushion
GW was not letting himself down properly
The Slop
The cause of severe kickback
GW hates it and that is probably why his jock has him out wide down the backstretch
Add the above together and you have a horse that is going to perform like GW did imo
Although he was done for, he was still running at the mile pole, thus showing nothing amiss, summat happened in the straight a bad step or something to cause his demise
Marb
People who i consider decent judges fancied this horse, and though i may disagree with their choice in this race, they were far from misguided
i can understand why they went for GW , which i’ve outlined above, but you and the RP analyst, who btw i don’t rate as decent judges failed to see
There seems to be a wider pattern emerging that older horses possibly past their best or who had sustained injury’s previously such as Best Mate, Rooster Booster, Persian Punch and now George Washington have been killed on the racetrack, and yes, I do think the trainers have to take some resposibility for that, it’s hardly as if it’s happening to 3 year olds like Authorized or Motivator is it?
George was a 4yo – he wasn’t even fully mature!
t’s your ignorance
I think you may find it you who is being ignorant of the facts
the facts are that a horse that runs 8f like GW is handling the surface, the fact that he then gets passed and makes no further progress means his stamina is petering out
Simple as A B and C
And given that Rooster Booster wasn’t killed on the racetrack, your ‘ignorance’ claims are even more confusing.
GW positions behind leader in 2006 Classic
1st call – down by 7 lengths –
2nd Call – down by 2.3/4
Str – down by 4.5 lengths
Finish – 7 lengths
How the feck does a horse that is not handling the track managed to improve it’s position by nearly 5 lengths
A horse not handling track would go backwards, not forward wouldn’t he??
A horse running out of stamina would then make no further progress and fade after making this earlier forward move wouldn’t he???
And remember GW got side swiped, which could have cost him a length or two
There seems to be a wider pattern emerging that older horses possibly past their best or who had sustained injury’s previously such as Best Mate, Rooster Booster, Persian Punch and now George Washington have been killed on the racetrack, and yes, I do think the trainers have to take some resposibility for that, it’s hardly as if it’s happening to 3 year olds like Authorized or Motivator is it?
This paragraph is poorly observed rubbish ~ it doesn’t make an argument of any tangible nature and it’s also inaccurate in the scant information it conveys. Rooster Booster wasn’t killed on the track and Best Mate and Persian Punch were notably sound racehorses who had shown top class form in the season prior to their deaths. It’s true that Best Mate suffered a broken blood vessel prior to the Gold Cup in 2005 but that was to my knowledge the only blemish in the career of an amazingly sound racehorse. Similarly, Persian Punch’s performance in his last outing prior to his death was better than any single performance in his first four years racing according to RPR’s. How exactly George Washington and the other trio are lumped together is beyond me.
There’s a horrible familiarity to the way this thread is going. Exhibit A:
https://theracingforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=70166&highlight=
Marb, as one of the peacemakers in the above thread, even to the extent of clarifying to Steveh31 that Grasshopper was not equating total posts to the right to speak authoritatively, your comments of a broadly similar effect to Triple_Crown above are a little misguided at best.
I’m not sure there was anything about Empty Wallet’s forthright but measured and reasoned contributions to this thread that warranted the conclusion of “it’s your ignorance”, either.
***
Away from all of that, I don’t regard the manner in which the demise of Best Mate, Persian Punch et al was brought into the topic as appropriate.
There is not a trainer in the country who does not accept that each time he or she sends a horse out to race, he or she is effectively playing roulette with that horse’s life (NB Zorro may remember writing these words with regard to Quixall Crossett in early 2002. They certainly apply here as well as anywhere). All of the examples you gave (barring Rooster Booster, on whose demise Smithy has already put you right) were re-entered into training in good faith, displayed sufficient form and fitness at home at least to justify the decision to return them to action, and perished in the same kinds of ways that other animals returning from shorter, longer or no periods away at all have done in time immemorial.
For as long as examples such as Aldaniti and Moorcroft Boy at a pretty good level (and countless examples at a variety of lower ones) continue to come back from long layoffs and do themselves justice or even better previous achievements, and for as long as we get examples of juveniles breaking down irreporably on the racetrack (to say nothing of those who do so before they ever get there), any hypothesis regarding a “wider pattern” may not necessarily stand up to a great deal of scrutiny.
gc
Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.
I’m glad that Rory picked up on the same point I was about to comment on – how on earth do you work out that Best Mate, Rooster Booster and Persian Punch were all either past their best or had suffered injury’s [sic]?! As Rory has said, all three were sound racehorses with very little history of serious injury, certainly none had suffered any documented tendon problems, possibly the most common cause of a horse breaking down. A broken blood vessel doesn’t count as an "injury" and unless it happens on a regular basis it cannot be treated as a sign of weakness.
All three horses you have bizarrely brought into this debate suffered their demise from heart attacks which again, bears no correlation whatsoever to the fatal fractures sustained by George Washington and is something which tends to happen for no definitive reason and with no signs beforehand.
It cannot be argued that they were kept in training for too long either – all three may have been in the twilight of their careers but none of them were "past it" nor were there any grounds to say any of them shouldn’t have been in training at the time they died ~ ditto can be said of George Washington.
Fwiw I agree also with Rory’s opinion on the SL article – there was nothing wrong with it whatsoever, it was a journalist doing his job and reporting on a championship race.
Hi everybody
If this point has been raised earlier on this forum then I apologise.
What’s pretty concerning to me is Coolmore’s absolutely unnecessary obsession with running horses in the Breeders Cup Classic. Granted top, established horses have nothing to lose but the chances of gain are remote. Furthermore, what good is the gain to an operation whose produce run predominantly on European turf?
Giants Causeway is the notable exception but as like most BC Classic horses, he was tougher than a coffin nail, classier than Fred Astaire and was bred for the job. Not all aforementioned attributes could have been applied to George Washington, Oratorio, Hold That Tiger, Hawk Wing, Galileo or Black Minnaloushe.
I think that horses from Ballydoyle should steer well clear of the classic from here on unless a suitable candidate emerges from under AOBs supervision.
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