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Well done OG backers. Unfortunately Dawn Approach retires under a cloud and the true worth of his form must now be in some doubt
Very true SC.
Shame he will not run on again, these were not the conditions to do him justification. Do you think they might take a U-turn? Jim Bolger is not exactly orthodox. Although, his hands are pretty much tied.
Very true SC.
Shame he will not run on again, these were not the conditions to do him justification. Do you think they might take a U-turn? Jim Bolger is not exactly orthodox. Although, his hands are pretty much tied.
I doubt it TB. I’d be pretty confident JB didn’t want to run the horse in The Derby. He complained about the ground today, and I think they’re now just trying a salvage job on his reputation for stud.
As I mentioned earlier, his form is so closely tied to Toronado that they depend on each other for franking it. It will be interesting to see what that horse does in the future.
Olympic Glory was electric this afternoon and I hope he stays in training as a 4YO.
The improvement of Top Notch Tonto is a tremendous story and I can’t hear much sniggering after that performance…£70,000 well spent, it would seem. And what an effort from Kingsbarns – he is one colt we can seriously look forward to next season.
Dawn Approach and Camelot are off to stud with a similar cloud of uncertainty hanging over them. How good were they? Despite achieving so much in a relatively short amount of time, I think we were all expecting a little bit more.
They should still be remembered as two seriously good colts.
So pleased to see Top Notch Tonto run such a brilliant race today, what a great call to supplement him.
I was a fan the first day I saw him at Newmarket on the July Course winning a Class 3 Handicap by a nose, who would have believed that he would be chasing home Olympic Glory in the QE11 3 months later.
Apparently he has his own Facebook page and he has already weaved his way into our hearts being such a good looking individual, just what racing needs and as he is a gelding we can look forward to seeing him back in action next year in Group company now.Dawn Approach has been my favourite colt of the season and it was sad to see him run such a lack lustre race, but he has been a joy to watch throughout his career and I wish him well in his retirement to stud and will miss him.
Things turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out...I’d be pretty confident JB didn’t want to run the horse in The Derby. He complained about the ground today, and I think they’re now just trying a salvage job on his reputation for stud.
As I mentioned earlier, his form is so closely tied to Toronado that they depend on each other for franking it. It will be interesting to see what that horse does in the future.
Agreed. I bet if you had asked Jim Bolger this time last year what his proposed programme for DA might be he would have said something like Guineas, St James, Sussex/Eclipse, Juddmonte, Irish Champion, Champion/QEII. In other words start him off over a mile and step him up later in the season. I know this will open up the debate again and of course there is only one Derby but that race was a disaster as was the decision to go to France so soon after a tough race at Goodwood. I could forgive one of those decisions but not both. That Derby performance meant we were never going to see if the horse could actually get further than a mile. If he HAD handled a step up around Juddmonte time we might even have got to see him in an Arc.
Of course in the event he had to stick to mile races which meant the QEII was the only race open to him and he clearly didn’t fire yesterday on that ground. It may also be that the others had caught him up anyway.
In 40 years of watching racing it is pretty obvious to me that there is a distinct advantage in aiming and training a horse at a particular race verses just giving it a go as an afterthought. Look at Treve and Moonlight Cloud. Every race was cherry picked and connections resisted the temptation to run them in other races that they may well have won but that ultimately may have cost them in the long run. Sky Lantern is another who was, for the most part, handled brilliantly. The one race she ran in as an afterthought was the Nassau. She was unplaced albeit having met trouble in running.
That doesn’t necessarily mean one has to be conventional – Freddie Head ran MC on consecutive weekends – but that there should be a plan based around what the horse can handle. It was always the plan for MC to run those two weekends but she had only raced once beforehand and so was fresh.
For me the best trainers always do the best thing by the horse not by the owner or the public and, in so doing, almost always end up DOING the right thing by the owner and public.
I could write a one hundred page thesis on some of AOB’s decisions over the last couple of years but the strangest one has to be supplementing Leading Light (who by the way imo had been perfectly campaigned en route to the Leger) for the Arc and then not bothering to ensure there was a decent pace! What a waste.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
I think you should write your thesis Joni.
Big John might be reading, and if he is he will surely reprimand that clueless, crowd-pleasing buffoon AOB, and install you as Race Planner forthwith.
Joni..I wish you had owned Dawn Approach and not Sheik Mo, he would have been looking at a flawless record as he headed of to stud.
Things turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out...It just goes to show how important placing horses is and how good at it some trainers are; think Sir Henry and Ed Dunlop when he sends his horses on overseas raids.
Well put Joni. I have to say personally, I don’t believe Dawn Approach was as good as most people thought. I always thought Toronado was a better horse, was well below form in the 2000, stopped to nothing, I could just never have Glory Awaits as a group one horse and remained skeptical. So, I was not surprised by future results.
However, the way he was campaigned after the 2000 leaves a lot to be desired. The decision to run in the Marois was particularly astounding.
Joni..I wish you had owned Dawn Approach and not Sheik Mo, he would have been looking at a flawless record as he headed of to stud.
And a much more boring sport. SO the Derby didnt work out…it was hardly the most ridiculous notion to go for it.
SHL
Couldn’t agree more Harry.
As a boxing analogy, Joe Calzaghe and Sven Ottke were expertly ‘placed’ throughout their careers, but are they higher regarded than weight-hopping take on all-comers such as Roberto Duran & Oscar De La Hoya? Are they balls, nobody cares they have a few ‘L’s in a box.
I see that Hannon is saying Olympic Glory could very well go to the Breeders Cup Mile, surely the journey would be wasted if the ground was firm? and what does this mean for Toronado, it’s all gone a bit quiet and I’m wondering if he’s got over his setback if they are now thinking about OG for this race, any news?
Blackbeard to conquer the World
I think this thing people have against Sheikh Mo and Jim Bolger, making all the wrong decisions about Dawn Approach is ignoring completely what we knew/know about both horse and trainer beforehand.
Dawn Approach ran in the Derby as 5/4 favourite, not an outsider. Fact is it seemed the obvious thing to do after the Guineas. Only needed to stay the trip to win. Before Epsom the horse had shown an equitable temperament, settling well enough at a mile to suggest he had a good chance of staying, even if not exactly bred for it. This was not just another Group 1, it was Britain’s biggest race, the most important 3 year old race in Europe, nay The World! May be the horse’s chance was overstated, but surely if a horse has a favourite’s chance – let alone a short priced favourite’s chance – to win The Derby. In fact, drop the “favourite”, just a good chance is enough. Any owner or trainer should take it!?
His sire New Approach had also run in the Derby with stamina doubts, only very shortly after finishing 2nd in the Irish Guineas. Although better bred for the job than his son, seemed more likely to pull given his natural tendency to get on with things… and won despite taking a hold. So do those people who wish the son had not run in the Derby also wish we did not have the opportunity of seeing his father win the race? Sheikh Mo/Jim Bolger were "proven right" in the latter’s case, an “afterthought” that paid off?
It does not matter if your view beforehand was that Dawn Approach would not stay. People tend to remember the occasions they are so called "proven right" and forget when proven wrong. With everything we knew beforehand… the horse deserved to take his chance, win or lose.
Dawn Approach – like his sire – showed he’s tough when coming back only 17 days later to win the St James’s Palace. There were people who also said beforehand that he should not have had this opportunity either – too soon after failing at Epsom. Even afterwards, some said he’d have won a lot easier without The Derby; only winning by a short head from Toronado despite the distances back to the others being what you might expect. Could be said Sheikh Mo and Jim Bolger "proven right" with an “afterthought” again?
Unlike Royal Ascot, when given a break for the Sussex it was the St James’s second that came out on top. The Dawn Approach fan club once again blaming others, "went too soon" etc. Yet he beat the Queen Anne winner and Eclipse second Declaration Of War by further than Al Kazeem did in the latter race, with a further 5 lengths back to the fourth. If Dawn Approach is better than that he’s some horse. No doubt in my mind the boy in blue ran to form, it was Toronado who improved slightly.
Then came the Marois just 11 days later, an “afterthought” that did not pay off? May be it was asking a bit to win so soon, but Dawn Approach had already proven capable of running well in quick succession. The small gap is always a good excuse, often a valid one. But unless he’s to wait until later in the season for the Moulin, a race that may be run on ground not thought suitable – there were few options for a miler. Even if failing there was a long break to recover before the QEII. DA was not up to the task, but I seem to remember thinking the Bolger camp were not in such good form at the time. Declaration Of War took in the same two races and ran well at both Goodwood and Deauville, before winning the International; boosting both Marois and Sussex form. Winner Moonlight Cloud had just a 7 day gap, much less than Dawn Approach. Had Moonlight Cloud run a stinker, French racing fans would no doubt have blamed Freddie for his greed. We like to blame someone for favourite horses losing, we like to think the short gap was to blame. It’s possible, may be even probable, but the Bolger horse ran a similar race this time with plenty of lead up to Saturday’s QEII.
Should we blame Sheikh Mo? Was it his decision to go to Deauville? Looking at Jim Bolger’s record with his best horses… He often runs them in good races back to back. Apart from the already mentioned New Approach Derby (13 days), Banimpire won the Ribblesdale with a 4 day gap between races. Finsceal Beo 2nd in the French Guineas just a week after winning the English, before going on to win the Irish 14 days later. Lush Lashes won the Coronation Stakes 14 days after finishing 5th in the Oaks… and so on. Were all these races “afterthoughts”? None of those were Sheikh Mo owned, well, may be New Approach. Most, if not all of Jim Bolger’s top class horses this century have been aggressively campaigned whoever owns them. They’ve even gone to Singapore mid-season before now – and come back to win Group 1’s in the same year (Alexander Goldrun).
I can just see Jim Bolger saying to Sheikh Mo, “might as well go for the Derby, even if we are not victorious we’ll still win at Royal Ascot”. (Jim’s used to winning there when racing back to back).
And after Goodwood…
“We’ve got nothing to lose, no other near to hand engagements, so let’s go for the Marois”.
I am firmly of the opinion this attitude should be applauded. Not “greedy”, more that horses are not in good form forever. Indeed, better for the horse than running a few weeks later when conditions may not suit and/or showing signs of not being quite 100%. Unconventional yes, but Australian trainers do it all the time. Makes sense to go for another win whilst the hooves are hot.
Value Is EverythingAll good points as usual Ginge but I do wonder why Jim never had DA even entered in the Derby. As you say, his father had won the race so why not enter his son as well? We know the answer don’t we. Jim’s famous stamina index told him he had no chance of staying. It was only when Sheikh Mo came on board that the decision was made.
I completely understand the people that say they were right to go for it. There IS only one Derby and it DID look a poor race. I just don’t think they were making the right decision by the horse with this and with the Marois. You are right that JB does it all the time and all the horses you mentioned suffered badly for it later in the season. I thought Banimpire was the best filly of that year but was completely over-raced as was Finsceal Beo. Each to their own but I would much rather see a horse campaigned in a less scatter gun way even if it means seeing them a bit less. Personally I would rather see great horses run to their best each time rather than just run no matter what and hope for the best.
I understand others disagree and that’s fair enough. JB is clearly a fantastic trainer but his poor old horses do really earn their corn!
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
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