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Workforce is still unexposed and the Derby run was still smart, and as such is still a danger to win the Arc, but it’s silly to center your logic around the Derby form.
Can I use his King George run then? Not only how abysmal it was but the fact that he ran in it anyway. Stoute’s record in Paris doesn’t inspire confidence either.
I have Planteur at 14s (plus some 9/2 in the place market) Fame at 13/2 and have covered on Behkabad. Not unduly worried about not collecting.
What is unusual is for Sir Michael Stoute to go out of his way to tell anyone what is happening back at the camp. Workforce must be doing something really special to have him tell the prees he and Ryan Moore are buzzing with excitement over the way he’s working.
Whatever happened in the King George it wasn’t the performance you would expect from a Derby winner. It wasn’t even a good King George so I must assume something was badly amiss and was nothing to do with a hrd race at Epsom or him being too immature.
If he was he wouldn’t be going anywhere near the Arc as it just doesn’t compute with SMS’s way of thinking. He would simply give the horse more time and target the King George and Arc next year.
If SMS is preared to forgive Workforce then so am I. This is not a good Arc by any stretch of the imagination and if he comes back to the form that won him the Derby Enough said!
Workforce strikes me as the type of horse people are always going to make excuses for. So far he’s had four starts and bombed out in two of them, thats not the type of horse I’d be looking to back. One good run, one bad run bit like Rewilding.
Well contrary to earlier thoughts, doubt Jan Vermeer really gets 12f.
Still fancy Dar Re Mi and Sariska at the prices.
What a tipster eh?
Lol! – JJ!
Not bad!!!…you did land that cheeky treble earlier on in the year didn’t you?!
Unlucky with the others…poor old ‘Dar’ was another winner (one of many) from Dubai who never really came back!
The record of winners (afterwards) on Dubai World Cup Night – might be something to consider in future…
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Geez Ian don’t be so forvinging will you?
Acainst Cape Blanco it was only the 2nd race of his life and his bit slipped through his mouth. That’s like riding a rocking horse.
I was one of the first to say the Derby was a pig of a race but he ran so badly in the King George no one could take that seriously.
Don’t foget almost everything that came out of the yard over the last two months has run like apig. I think SMS had like 7 winners in July and 7 in August
Now all of a sudden they are starting to fire again and Workforce by all accounts is leading the way.He might just be the biggest certainty to run in the race since Sea Bird II because this is one bad Arc if ever there was one.
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You call me obtuse, I call you a coward. Tongue in cheek? Comedy? Don’t give up your day job. I’m not at all amazed you can repeatedly make a long winded defence when your position prior to the Dante was obvious ….. and still remains on this site. The true form of an internet possuer. Your suspicions are little more than hopeful posturings.
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And just in case you really forget ……
Zarkava
Tue Apr 13, 2010 8:59 pm
by Zarkava on Tue Apr 13, 2010 8:59 pmwallace-no7 wrote:
CAPE BLANCO is in good form, he is possible to start back in the totesport.com Dante Stakes at York.You can forget him then. Had a quick look back at O’Brien’s Dante runners. Freemantle, Black Bear Island, Our Aristotle, Albert Hall, Frozen Fire, Septimus…get the picture?
Seems this thread is a bit calmer
Workforce has absolutely no chance, layers must be soaking up the gallop reports
…the form of his Derby win amounts to about, er zilch, although I suppose rewilding did win a grp2 when off for his life against a Leger prepper and a horse who’d been off for a year..top class Even if he can now run again, after being thrashed overall in the King George and again by Cape Blanco, why would Stoute want to ruin him again in an Arc he can’t win? Stoute isn’t fazed about the Arc anyway is he? Much more likely to run him for an outing, like he did with Conduit
Fame and Glory = Soldieroffortune, enough said, even if he turns up he hasn’t the toeSarafina’s backup for Behkabad and Youmzain’s won 1 race in 4 years.
That leaves 2 high class French 3yo colts who have progressed relentlessly, been totally consistent, will relish the 12f but have ‘Longchamp’ acceleration – indeed, one of them is unbeaten at Longchamp – and have murdered everything in the top French trials. One is also clearly a bit better than the other.
Is it simples?
Japanese horse for the tri-cast
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Hi Zen. Apologies, missed your post due to the thread duplication. Ahh well I got Sariska right. As for F&G I just don’t know right now. It’s been a funny old campaign. The horse seems to have been looked after since the start of summer with one race in mind. Perhaps the light campain will help his chances? I keep coming back to the run last year in the Arc and his 2009 Derby effort. Both leave me with doubts about F&G in the Arc this year. The Coronation run didn’t exactly encourage me either.
In the plus column is the fact that F&G couldn’t have run into a weaker Arc ever. He certainly has a better chance than Planteur for mine. As stated on the other thread Planteur has a big red line through it on my formbook. Behkabad clearly on top at this stage but I’m still looking for the blowout horse. Hmm there once was a horse named Marienbard who slipped through the net via Germany and stole an Arc. Camponologist has similar form from the same camp. Word is he’s off to the Melbourne Cup though. The pursuit continues!
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BTW any idea what happened to Air Trooper Zen? I hope he hasn’t also fallen victim to the Black Hole Of Dubai! It’s a good plan that – Andre gets horses going and makes them stand out while Saeed absorbs them, regresses them and ultimately makes them disappear off the face of the earth. Godolphin is like a never ending tome of "What ever happened to …. ?"
Apoloies in advance to Senor Rubbish Bin if this one was Andre’s fault.
this forum gets worse.
anyway, some thoughts on the actual race
Big Buck’s
16 Sep 2010, 12:36Postby Big Buck’s on 16 Sep 2010, 12:36
Workforce has absolutely no chance, layers must be soaking up the gallop reports
…the form of his Derby win amounts to about, er zilch, although I suppose rewilding did win a grp2 when off for his life against a Leger prepper and a horse who’d been off for a year..top class Even if he can now run again, after being thrashed overall in the King George and again by Cape Blanco, why would Stoute want to ruin him again in an Arc he can’t win? Stoute isn’t fazed about the Arc anyway is he? Much more likely to run him for an outing, like he did with Conduit
Fame and Glory = Soldieroffortune, enough said, even if he turns up he hasn’t the toeSarafina’s backup for Behkabad and Youmzain’s won 1 race in 4 years.
That leaves 2 high class French 3yo colts who have progressed relentlessly, been totally consistent, will relish the 12f but have ‘Longchamp’ acceleration – indeed, one of them is unbeaten at Longchamp – and have murdered everything in the top French trials. One is also clearly a bit better than the other.
Is it simples?
Japanese horse for the tri-cast
thoughts?
Interesting – thanks!
Here’s throwing some thoughts back out there…hold your fire people!
Having listened to one on ATR – it seems as though the bookies think that there is a skimmer too!
Happy to lay the top of the market as the two French colts have only raced against each other…In an article I had read before the Arc trials it was said that this Arc was (not weak!) but lacking a clear Fav – a ‘Sea The Stars’ or ‘Zarkava’.
It was compared to the one that big ‘Dylan’ won! – which for me wasn’t an outstanding edition – wasn’t here then so don’t know what people said about the strength & depth of that one?!‘If’ this Arc is akin to that one then ‘F&G’ must have a chance if all is well with him? – Race notes say he pulled hard last year…
Something else from the Arc of 2007 came to mind also…
that year ‘Zambezi Sun’ was the fancied French colt yet ‘Sagara’ reversed with he and ‘Soldier’ on the big day!Now everyone has become wrapped up in the dual between ‘Bheki’ & ‘Plantr’ – is there a case that something similar could occur this year?
No idea what happened to him (Air Trooper) I’m afraid!
I wonder if ‘Goldwaki’ is going to run (know he has a lot to find) – Fabre has sent him the ‘Cherry Mix’ route to this if he is?!
I noticed that on the day of the trials (by looking at the history on oddschecker) that one firm who went largest 40/1 removed him! Another firm only 20’s!
The form through ‘Querry Boy’ made ‘Scorcher’ an interesting prospect :
http://www.zeturf.com/en/resultats/1713 … x-Sica-Boy
but he disappeared too…
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The Japanese runner Nakayama Festa is certainly interesting. Many of my Japanese contacts often lament the fact that Deep Impact and others have run in the Arc without a French based trial beforehand. They always refer back to El Condor Pasa who ran so bravely on unsuitably heavy ground years ago.
Nakayama Festa shaped well in his trial before blowing up at the end on soft ground. Should strip a lot fitter for the run. Would probably improve a fair bit on a firmer surface as well. Is that likely though?
The final question NF has to answer though – Is his peak form good enough? Probably not if there was an outstanding opponent engaged. As you’ve mentioned Zen we’re lacking a superstar so NF has a better chance than numerous other longshot candidates. He’s been set for the race for a while too and that always stands well with me. I wouldn’t have him much longer than 14/1 at this stage.
Goldwaki? He might run a bolters fifth if he starts.
The other Japanese runner can pack his bags now. He doesn’t look to stay a mile and a half and it wont get any easier come Arc day.
I guess you’ll want to know what I think of Duncan if I rate the Japanese horse. He’s the type that makes his own bad luck. I guess he was due a good turn last weekend.
Duncan went to the lead in a very typical Foy boat race. A repeat of that performance cannot be anticipated, especially when he has to go 5 seconds faster just to catch the 3yo’s. In a bigger field with a proper leader pace I expect a lot more from Nakayama Festa than his weekend conqueror.
Duncan got a lovely drag along following Harbinger at Ascot and with a similar run off a decent pace could place 5-6th in the Arc. Just not up to better quality Gr1 races for mine. They’d be better off packing the bags and heading for the Breeders if determined to go down in Gr1 flames.
Best of luck solving the Arc puzzle.
Something else from the Arc of 2007 came to mind also…
that year ‘Zambezi Sun’ was the fancied French colt yet ‘Sagara’ reversed with he and ‘Soldier’ on the big day!Now everyone has become wrapped up in the dual between ‘Bheki’ & ‘Plantr’ – is there a case that something similar could occur this year?
Possible but not that likely. We’d have probably had more of an inkling about the lack of substance to Zambezi Sun’s form that year if Eagle Mountain hadn’t shipped Fallon in the Grand Prix de Paris. The Prix du Jockey Club he ran in was not as strong as this year’s renewal also.
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Put it this way, Workforce could run 10lbs below his best and win in a canter.
Sir Michael do the good thing and get him ripe for this race, thank you MRW.
Euro just ‘throwing some thoughts out there’…
Chisi – is the only person to have said that they don’t believe that the Arc is a forgone conclusion – I’m exploring the realms of that notion!
Back to that chain of thought re: had Fallon stayed on…
‘Eagle’ never won over that distance anyways! (True he was placed!)
I should have also said earlier that ‘Sag’ did reverse before the big race in the prep itself!
Yet he was sent off at bigger odds for the Arc ‘cos ‘Zam’ was meant to have been given a "tender ride" or "ideal prep" that day in the Niel.There’s been more talk of that this year…
…the form of his Derby win amounts to about, er zilch, although I suppose rewilding did win a grp2 when off for his life against a Leger prepper and a horse who’d been off for a year..top class 
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