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well I would rather live in this ‘weak society’, or a million others like it than anything the Gulf Arabs have to offer.
Ever lived in The Gulf UM?
If a British version of Choudary was down on the local corniche here calling for the banning of Ramadan, his feet wouldn’t touch the ground. And rightly so.
I respect them for that.
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GDP per capita tells you the standard of living they have and outside Brunei, Turkey,Saudi Arabia, Qautar and UAE there are over 30 of the 40 odd Muslims countries where people live on for a year what many of us would punt away in a day to a week.
When you open your doors of course it attracts them like flies.
I’m all for Feed the World, Help the tsunami victims etc and would never see a friend go without if it was within my power to help.
However the UK, as much as they think they are aren’t the world cop, you have to draw the line somewhere
These immigrants are a huge drain on the economy and if it keeps going in years to come the UK will be needing Midge Ure and Bob Geldolf to come back from the dead and run a live aid concert to feed your kids.
Adolph Hitler was Austrian born never stopped him being a c***
Probably went to the same school as my friend only the transferred it to England. That so called leader praised the 911 terrorist and the UK should say stuff the law and toss him out on his ear. You look like Paki extremist and think like a Paki extremist and praise violence against peaceful innocent people then you are a Paki extremist whether your born in Motherwell or the Motherland.
First and foremost terminology like ‘Paki’ is racist language from a different era and should not be allowed to creep back into unchallenged usage.
Before anyone starts please don’t mention cricket or attempts to reclaim the word by deluded people who may even be Asian themselves,it is not ‘ just a word’ it is demeaning,dismissive and for me not totally unconnected with how many Muslims from Pakistan and other countries may feel about how they are percieved and maybe even what they then feel inclined to support which may even include the first step on the road to becoming ‘radicalised’.
I know its simple but a foolproof method to avoid racist- looking generalisations about what people from any particular nation are like is to treat people as you find them regardless of colour,country or creed or anything else for that matter and deal with them accordingly as individuals with no assumptions…….I probably detest some of the same things in any number of individuals as you do and believe in a lot of others too including preventing and finding out the root causes of so called ‘muslim extremism’) but I resist racist disrespectful language and jumping to conclusions about what everyone who comes from the same country or has the same religion ‘must’ be like as it only gets us to where we are now……….
Ever lived in The Gulf UM?
If a British version of Choudary was down on the local corniche here calling for the banning of Ramadan, his feet wouldn’t touch the ground. And rightly so.
I respect them for that.
…well I don’t. I regard that as despotic and incredibly weak and no I’ve never lived in the Gulf nor would ever want to.
Islamic states, in fact any country where children are indoctrinated into a faith from birth – which is most of the planet it seems, have no appeal to me.
Although they cannot realise it because they know no different, I regard it as being trapped in a cage from which there is no escape – you cannot escape from Islam and it’s pretty darned hard to get away from most of the other faiths too if it’s been drilled into you from birth. People have no choice and the most alarming of all, is that they don’t appear to want a choice or deem it necessary to have one. This is the very antithesis of everything I stand for.
Regarding the UAE, whilst remuneration and vast improvements including repatriation seem to have been made since [according to Wikipedia], the stain remains that until quite recently they abducted and enslaved thousands of boys as camel race jockeys. Not to mention that all too common victimisation and illegality of some minority groups.
Perhaps the ‘stunning women’ [what little you can see of them] and financial incentives cloud people’s judgement.
For me, the UK and England in particular is the greatest country on the planet in which to live in the long term and I wouldn’t want to be anywhere else. Post war migration – excessive though it has often been, has enriched the culture here and in my opinion, improved vastly the mainstream populace as they have had to adjust rapidly to such change and are still having to do so – we are better people overall as a result.
An old Irishman that I met a few years ago worked in England for several years. He said that he thought the English were the most tolerant people in the world. He’s right, and it’s one of the things I’m most proud about this country. Agree totally with what you’ve said UM.
….. where children are indoctrinated into a faith from birth – which is most of the planet it seems, have no appeal to me.
Including this country where children are taught the Christian story as being "fact" in schools?
Like in this country where by law we are forced to observe Christian festivals …. tell me where you can go shopping on Easter Sunday?
Or where men in frocks, sorry Bishops, still have automatic seats in the House of Lords.
Or where the "Church" is established.
etc. etc. etc.
you are forced to have the days off,
Why should I?
Fine if a shopkeeper wishes to close their shop because of their religious observance, that is their pergoative.
There used to be an excellent Garden Centre not far away from where I live which was Jewish owned, so they never opened on a Saturday – presumably they lost a great deal of business as a result but good luck to them – but it was their choice.
What I strongly object to is most shops being forced to close, by law, just because it happens to be Easter Sunday. Shops should be allowed to choose to open when they wish to and if it is economically viable for them to open on Easter Sunday they should have the freedom to do so if they wish.
It is like the ridiculous Sunday trading laws in England (and I think Wales as well) where shops are restricted to opening for just six hours – just because it is Sunday!!!
I agree with your points about Christiainity to an extent Paul but consider this…
If you were neither Christian or Muslim, where would you rather live? Uk or Saudi?
Not a option if you are a Jew, because Saudi bans jews from entering on racist grounds.
But lets water it down a bit and say as a hindu or sikh? in Iran / indonesia….. or uk?
Not on economic grounds…but tolerance and how safe you would feel for your children and ability to pass on your values to them?
I think you’re being a bit to pedantic there Paul. Let’s face it, Christmas is hardly celebrated as a religious festival. If it was so enforced on us by Christians, then it would be celebrated when Jesus was actually born, and not December 25th which just so happens to coincide with the new year celebrations.
I think we should give a little bit of leeway to the religious types. I’m not much of a believer myself anymore, but i do recognize that Christianity has helped shape Britain. In fact, if it wasn’t for religion, the United Kingdom wouldn’t exist as we now know it.
Now because of how history has formed and mapped out, we now live in a society dominated by atheists, agnostics and Christians. However, Islam enters the fray, and they just so happen to be believers of the most forceful and oppressive mainstream religion.
I believe that Islam is incompatible with British society. The reason being that Islam is like a claw that doesn’t let go, and its followers are bound to ancient scripture that don’t belong in the 21st century. Its followers are far too meticulous about what they read.
My Papa is a Catholic, and abides by lent, goes to mass on a regular basis. When i stopped going, he didn’t say much and isn’t forceful on his religious views. He also likes a booze. I’m saying this as i think those who come under the Christian umbrella are a lot more tolerant than muslims, and the reason why i think Christianity is more compatible with British society than what Islam is.
The only way to keep tabs on the problem with foreign religions giving birth to fanatics on these shores, is to be more careful with how many are let in. This isn’t about racism or sectarianism, we are now talking about the nations national security and future well being.
I’m saying this as i think those who come under the Christian umbrella are a lot more tolerant than muslims, and the reason why i think Christianity is more compatible with British society than what Islam is.
Have you ever visited the "Christian Voice" web site?
Although I do agree the majority of Christians are tolerant, pragmatic and have no wish to force their doctrine on anybody else.
I also happen to believe that is also the case with most mainstream, for a better word, followers of most religions,including Islam.
It’s not the Christian voice website that encourages people to execute infidels and blow up passenger airlines.
I’m not bashing muslims, but what is it about them that opresses free thinking and makes them so happily to conform to their parents religion, and be so meticulous about Islamic scriptures and how they are interpreted ?
You see, there lies some of the problem. A lot of senior muslims don’t want their youngsters mixing it with British youth in case it opens their mind, and opens a door to a world they never knew existed i.e one without religious beliefs.
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I’m saying this as i think those who come under the Christian umbrella are a lot more tolerant than muslims, and the reason why i think Christianity is more compatible with British society than what Islam is.
Have you ever visited the "Christian Voice" web site?
Although I do agree the majority of Christians are tolerant, pragmatic and have no wish to force their doctrine on anybody else.
I also happen to believe that is also the case with most mainstream, for a better word, followers of most religions,including Islam.
You have got to be kidding.
وسهـولة استخـدام الجـوال.
بسـم الله نبـدأ ..
(1) الضغـط باستـمـرار عـلى زر ( القـائمـة ) يـتـيـح لك الآتـي :_
* التـنقـل بـيـن البـرامـج أو التطـبيـقـات المفـتـوحـة.
* الخـروج مـن تطـبيـق أو برنـامـج دون إنهـائـه.
* إنهـاء التـطبـيـقـات أو البـرامـج وذلـك عـن طـريق الضغـط علـى زر ( C )
( مفـيد فـي حـالـة عـدم استـطـاعتـك الـخـروج مـن برنـامـج معـيـن ).(2) استـخـدامـات زر مـربـع ( # ) :_
* فـي وضـع الاستـعـداد .. الضـغـط بـاستـمـرار عـلى رز ( # ) يـحـول الـوضـع إلـى ( صـامـت )،
*والضـغـط مـرة أخـرى يـحـول الـوضـع إلـى ( عـام )
( مـفـيـد جـداً عـنـد دخـولك وخـروجـك مـن المـسجـد أو الـمـدرسـة ).* فـي حـالـة الـكتـابـة .. ضـغـطـة واحـدة عـلى زر ( # ) لتـشغـيـل ( القـامـوس ) أو إيـقـافـه.
* فـي حـالـة الـكتـابـة أيـضـاً .. الضـغـط بـاستـمـرار عـلى زر ( # ) يـحـوّل الـكتـابـة مـن ( نـص ) إلـى ( أرقـام ) والـعـكـس.(3) اسـتخـدامـات زر ( القـلـم ) :_
* لـتحـديـد نـص اضـغـط بـاستـمـرار عـلـى زر ( القـلـم ) مـع تـحـريـك الاسـهـم.
* للنـسـخ أواللصـق اضـغـط بـاستـمـرار عـلـى رز ( القـلـم ) واخـتـار ( نـسـخ ) أو ( لـصـق ).* لتـحـديـد كـائـنـات ( صـور أو مقـاطـع ) أو رسـائـل أو أسـمـاء أو مـلفـات، اضـغـط بـاستـمـرار عـلـى زر ( الـقـلـم ) مـع تـحـريـك الاسهـم.
* لـحـذف الأسـمـاء أو الـرسـائـل أو الـكـائـنـات أو المـلفـات الـمحـددة، اضـغـط عـلـى زر ( C ).
(4) لـطـلـب أمـر صـوتـي – فـي وضـع الاسـتـعـداد – اضـغـط بـاسـتـمـرار عـلـى زر الاخـتـيـار الأيـمـن ( اللـي فـوق الـزر الأحـمـر ) ثـم تحـدث
(5) لـمـسـح حـافـظـة مـعـيـنـة مـن الـقـائـمـة يـجـب نـقـل جـمـيـع مـحـتـويـاتـهـا لـكـي تـستـطـيـع مـسحـهـا.
مـلآحظـة :.. لإضـافـة حـافـظـة جـديـدة فـي الـقـائـمـة اضـغـط خـيـارات > حـافـظـة جـديـدة.
(6) لـتـشغـيـل الـكـاميـرا اضـغـط بـاستـمـرار عـلى الـزر الـفـضـي ( الجـانـبـي )
* فـي وضـع التـصـويـر اضـغـط ضـغـطـة واحـدهـ عـلـى الـزر الـفـضـي ( الجـانـبـي ) لالتـقـاط صـورة.That’s just one oh thousands of emails I have had this year from crazy Mulsims. Some English Some Arabic mainly religious junk. It’s got so bad I never use it any more and if I try to get onto messenger it takes me half an hour to delete and reject all the messages of these twats want to join………Why me?…..I have no idea.
If you want the above translated it says you’re naive
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It’s a song by Akmad Musilimi Abeerbeer Dumbmule
Cover version of the Barry McGuire hit Eve of Destruction
For me, the UK and England in particular is the greatest country on the planet in which to live in the long term and I wouldn’t want to be anywhere else. Post war migration – excessive though it has often been, has enriched the culture here and in my opinion, improved vastly the mainstream populace as they have had to adjust rapidly to such change and are still having to do so – we are better people overall as a result.
No problem with any of that UM. I’ve never said otherwise. I’m very pro immigration myself. I work in a company that last count had 94 nationalities in it and the multicultural aspect of my employment here is what I enjoy the most.
I regard that as despotic and incredibly weak and no I’ve never lived in the Gulf nor would ever want to
Fair enough, but remember guys like Choudary and his goons are laughing their ars*s off at your tolerance. Where else could a bloke make public statements about Papal execution, public flogging for drinkers, launch hateful invective about a time of the year most people cherish and encourage hatred of fellow citizens and still be given a free house, free education, free medical benefits, free everything. Stupidity replaces tolerance on these occasions.
Islamic states, in fact any country where children are indoctrinated into a faith from birth – which is most of the planet it seems, have no appeal to me.
Thats my point. Thats exactly what Choudary wants for the UK. Why would you be tolerant to that????? And seemingly proud of it???
don’t appear to want a choice or deem it necessary to have one,This is the very antithesis of everything I stand for.
Bit of a contradiction there..
Regarding the UAE, whilst remuneration and vast improvements including repatriation seem to have been made since [according to Wikipedia], the stain remains that until quite recently they abducted and enslaved thousands of boys as camel race jockeys. Not to mention that all too common victimisation and illegality of some minority groups.
Not so long ago the Mayor of London was apologising for his city’s role in the slave trade. Funnily enough most of the Asian people I work with are happy in the Gulf, they all travel extensively and base that on personal experience. Most of them come, make money and go home eventually, unhindered by the system here. Of course victimisation and illegality are problems just as minorities everywhere on earth suffer, the Native American Indian and Aboriginal people would certainly agree with you.
Perhaps the ‘stunning women’ [what little you can see of them] and financial incentives cloud people’s judgement.
None of the Lebanese, Jordanian, Moroccan, Tunisian, Libyan, Syrian, Egyptian women I work with wear anything on their heads. Try a night out in Beirut or Amman,its what little you cant see
The system here welcomes you if you have a skillset they require, you get paid accordingly, they provide good healthcare and education and a peaceful multicultural environment to raise your kids in. Shagging on public beaches, puking and pissing on the roads etc… have never much appealed to me so I live here pretty much unencumbered. In return the locals ask you to respect their millennia old culture and traditions when your in public in their country. If you don’t your going home. And you know what, by and large it works….amazing how people respect a bit of strong leadership when its channelled in the correct way.
Be tolerant not stupid.
Not so long ago the Mayor of London was apologising for his city’s role in the slave trade. Funnily enough most of the Asian people I work with are happy in the Gulf, they all travel extensively and base that on personal experience. Most of them come, make money and go home eventually, unhindered by the system here. Of course victimisation and illegality are problems just as minorities everywhere on earth suffer, the Native American Indian and Aboriginal people would certainly agree with you.
The mayor of londons "apology" was just usual Livingstone crap. As if there is anyone around who still needed apolofgising too
The Native americans and agoriginies are not cu
rrently victimised. Its in the past. Its whats happening now thats is relevant and no one can surely claim that many of the asian basic workers in Dubai are treated witn the standards we would find acceptable in the westAs for "strong leadership" and so on, I certainly wouldnt want to live in a society where my "feet wouldnt touch the ground2 if i expressed an opinion that the goverment didnt like. There is nothing admirable about that at all and allowing such suppressing at a basic level leads inevitably to exploitation of powers with inevitable results
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