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On balance I think it’s probably right that this march should be banned but I do worry about the whole idea of banning marches & protests.
The English Defence League have been banned.
The BNP have been banned.
What’s to stop the Government banning anti-war marches or events by other (legitimate) political parties in the name of ‘Public Order’?
I know many Musilms and most, if not all of them, condem the extreme interpretaions of the faith
I’ve spent the best part of the last 10 years living in the Middle East and I know that to be the case.
Dont agree
Islam is simply not liberal in any sense of the word. Which of those middle eastern states that you lived in Carv would be described as liberal? which of them had the same rights and freedoms of the UK and the netherlands say? Where are the liberal imans calling for rights for gays and women?
Even when racist Ken livingstone invoited over a supposed moderate leading iman, it was found that he had been calling for a new holocaust against the jews
There are muslims with liberal views but they are a tiny minority (and often targeted by the majority)
It’s interesting right enough. Loyalists and orangemen in Northern Ireland have continuously been allowed to march through contentious routes to provocate the nationalist community. It has been allowed to continue, regardless of opposition and trouble that is has caused for many years. I see this as being no different from what these repugnant Islamists are trying to do, so should they therefore be allowed to march, regardless of how high the feeling is against them ?(question)
I’m certainly against the lunatic fringe of Islam, but who decides what is right to ban and what isn’t ?
Those intending to march would ban free speech in an instant. They would execute anyone that didnt entirely conform with their world view and would enact genocide against a certain race without hesitation. They do not even deny those aims.
For those that still believe that muslims are liberal perhaps they would like to consider that a very basic tenent of liberalism is free speech
As a rule, in liberal socities, novelists do not get exectuted or "punished"cfor their views. Thats putting it mildly…
October 21, 1989|o7 Reutersf7
LONDON — Twenty-eight percent of British Muslims support Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini’s death sentence on writer Salman Rushdie, accused of blaspheming Islam, according to a Harris poll released Friday.A big majority favor some form of personal action against Rushdie for writing "The Satanic Verses," and nearly two-thirds want his novel publicly burned.
There are muslims with liberal views but they are a tiny minority (and often targeted by the majority)
You are making an assumption that all Muslims are practising extremist Islamists, Clive. Having lived in Libya during the sanctions, Algeria during the civil war, Qatar during its metamorphosis into a modern thriving petro dollar economy and visited all points from Morocco to Oman your assumption is simply not the case. The vast, vast, vast majority of the scores of Muslims I’ve befriended, worked with and travelled with over the last 10 years are more concerned about a roof over their head, food on the table, kids getting an education, getting laid and all the other stuff the rest of us consider normal. They practise their religion in a way that has never been intrusive to me personally.
The garbage this clown is allowed to spew forth is more a reflection of a lazy, KFC guzzling, utterly spineless society that values political correctness above even the slightest modicum of common sense.
Paul O’s point was in relation to personal interpretation not state law.
Those intending to march would ban free speech in an instant.
So what?
Two wrongs, do not make a right!!
Islam is simply not liberal in any sense of the word. Which of those middle eastern states that you lived in Carv would be described as liberal? which of them had the same rights and freedoms of the UK and the netherlands say? Where are the liberal imans calling for rights for gays and women?
But are you not being as arrogant as those you criticising in arguing the western "way of life" (for want of a better expression) is better than their "way of life".
What gives any of us the right to say our moral standpoint is correct and others are wrong?
We may well have liberal rights in our society – but does that make them automatically right?
We criticise muslim extremeists for wanting to impose their laws and ideals on western socity. Are we not being just a tad hypocritical in wanting to impose our so called values on their society?
If I thought there was enough money to put surveillance on each and every marcher, I’d say let them go ahead.
Follow-up everyone on the march, and get details on who they associate with. Tap their phones. Bug their homes.
Within 6-9 months, you would have a pretty good idea of the individuals involved in the extremist Islamist movement in the UK. I would then focus all security efforts on that hardcore. My guess is that it would probably amount to no more than about 400 heads.
Once you have your hardcore, get Special Branch working on a few of them. Get some inside informants, and better, more contemporary, intelligence.
It’s guaranteed that a few of them will drift away from the scene, once they have had a tap on the shoulder from Plod, so let’s say we are then left with around 300 or so individuals we think are a serious threat.
Get their names passed round every intelligence agency. Place them on default ‘enhanced security’ at airports. Mark them.
It would cost an absolute wedge in to implement, but I suspect it would be much less than the economic impact of cleaning-up after a further successful terrorist attack.
PS. My profiling software has Cav down as the Head of Al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula.
PS. My profiling software has Cav down as the Head of Al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula.
Well I have been to Yemen recently…, but not even the delights of "downtown" Sanna
will ever convert this 110% extremist Culchie who hails from the magnificent "Banner" lands of County Clare 
This is purely a publicity stunt by this group. It would be a travesty if such a march would be allowed in that town.
Why not have it in London….i might actually support some of there views on the amount of civilian deaths in the conflict but even attempting to have it in this town screams AGENDA.
Certainly would cause huge riots and that is the last thing the UK needs
German View of Islam
This is one of the best explanation of the Muslim terrorist situation I have ever read. His references to past history are accurate and clear. Not long, easy to understand, and well worth the read. The author of this email is said to be Dr. Emanuel Tanya, a well-known and well-respected psychiatrist.
A German’s View on Islam
A man, whose family was German aristocracy prior to World War II, owned a number of large industries and estates. When asked how many German people were true Nazis, the answer he gave can guide our attitude toward fanaticism. ‘Very few people were true Nazis,’ he said, ‘but many enjoyed the return of German pride, and many more were too busy to care. I was one of those who just thought the Nazis were a bunch of fools. So, the majority just sat back and let it all happen. Then, before we knew it, they owned us, and we had lost control, and the end of the world had come. My family lost everything. I ended up in a concentration camp and the Allies destroyed my factories.’
We are told again and again by ‘experts’ and ‘talking heads’ that Islam is the religion of peace and that the vast majority of Muslims just want to live in peace. Although this unqualified assertion may be true, it is entirely irrelevant. It is meaningless fluff, meant to make us feel better, and meant to somehow diminish the specter of fanatics rampaging across the globe in the name of Islam.
The fact is that the fanatics rule Islam at this moment in history. It is the fanatics who march. It is the fanatics who wage any one of 50 shooting wars worldwide. It is the fanatics who systematically slaughter Christian or tribal groups throughout Africa and are gradually taking over the entire continent in an Islamic wave. It is the fanatics who bomb, behead, murder, or honor-kill. It is the fanatics who take over mosque after mosque. It is the fanatics who zealously spread the stoning and hanging of rape victims and homosexuals. It is the fanatics who teach their young to kill and to become suicide bombers.
The hard, quantifiable fact is that the peaceful majority, the ‘silent majority,’ is cowed and extraneous.
Communist Russia was comprised of Russians who just wanted to live in peace, yet the Russian Communists were responsible for the murder of about 20 million people. The peaceful majority were irrelevant. China’s huge population was peaceful as well, but Chinese Communists managed to kill a staggering 70 million people.
The average Japanese individual prior to World War II was not a warmongering sadist. Yet, Japan murdered and slaughtered its way across South East Asia in an orgy of killing that included the systematic murder of 12 million Chinese civilians; most killed by sword, shovel, and bayonet.
And who can forget Rwanda, which collapsed into butchery. Could it not be said that the majority of Rwandans were ‘peace loving’?
History lessons are often incredibly simple and blunt, yet for all our powers of reason, we often miss the most basic and uncomplicated of points:
Peace-loving Muslims have been made irrelevant by their silence.
Peace-loving Muslims will become our enemy if they don’t speak up, because like my friend from Germany, they will awaken one day and find that the fanatics own them, and the end of their world will have begun.
Peace-loving Germans, Japanese, Chinese, Russians, Rwandans, Serbs, Afghans, Iraqis, Palestinians, Somalis, Nigerians, Algerians, and many others have died because the peaceful majority did not speak up until it was too late. As for us who watch it all unfold, we must pay attention to the only group that counts–the fanatics who threaten our way of life.One of my best friends in school was a Muslim….he prayed the same as every Muslim but the difference was that he was Educated. He was from Pakistan and his father took the whole family out of there as soon as he was a qualified doctor because he saw that the country was on the brink of disaster 20 years ago.
The Muslim Countries have very poor education standards…..i would say 3/5 of Afghan’s population cant even read. Corruption rife….its just a disaster.
Sadly he died since that but i would have loved to see his answers to this current disaster.
We have seen recently that Iran which is a pretty developed country educationally compared to there neighbours that University Students have basically been the catalyst to tackle the Iran Supreme leaders.
Problem all of the west friends such as Saudi Arabia/Jordan/UAE/Egypt are all vile goverments
There won’t be a march because this tiny group never intended to hold a march. They just issued a press release claiming they would organise a march, a tactic they have used before.
The result has been massive national publicity for their leader and his views, which was their sole objective. They now have a couple of dozen new quotes from people in authority that they can use in propoganda to ‘prove’ that the UK is anti-Muslim.
AP
But are you not being as arrogant as those you criticising in arguing the western "way of life" (for want of a better expression) is better than their "way of life".
What gives any of us the right to say our moral standpoint is correct and others are wrong?
We may well have liberal rights in our society – but does that make them automatically right?
1. No. Becuase if their "way of life" and beliefs were so wonderful, why are they so openly hostile towards other beliefs? The only major religion that has a particular sneering word for non believers and the only one that continually refers to and attacks the same.
2. Our moral standpoint is (or liberal western should be) against bigotry, sexism, homophobia and racism. We are also for free speech. These are basic beliefs taht any decent person should endorse. The bulk of islam strongly stands agaisnt these very basic standards. Yes, we are superior
3. Of course. Countries without liberal rights frequently fail and on most indicators fall behind those without. A free speech society is a healthy one. A society without bigotry is a healthy one. Healthy socities thrive.
Sadly he died since that but i would have loved to see his answers to this current disaster.
May i ask how? Flying a plane ?
Very good post Roddy. I think thats fairly true. The positive aspect is that there has been a quiet backlash against AQ in many arab states. Their bombing of the jordanian hotels was a major mistake. And of course, we have Iran. But there is a long way to go….
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