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BTW Zarkava, when I read that that you thought the Debussy run was due to hating a right hand track rather than being reined back I thought that was risible.
However, I do respect your opinion (2yo threads a treat) and I reviewed the race with your views in mind and I have to say on reflection you may have hit on something…would be interested to hear jockeys comments.I completely agree, they’re all trying to bred 12f horses and instead getting 2-milers. I put this down to breeding PR – everyone knows Authorized would’ve won the Leger & probably Galileo too. But because they don’t run over this distance, nobody knows that they’ll impact more stamina than expected. The Galileo-Darshaan cross is giving us some of the slowest Group horses around at the moment.
I agree that they’re obviously trying to breed 12f horses, who in their right mind would want to breed a 2-miler, but the way this race has been run has suited Nathaniel down to the ground and no-one can say for sure whether he’d have been beaten by Workforce or Rewilding had they not sustained their injuries, not can I categorically state that Workforce or Rewilding would have won.
Given the pure class that Workforce has exerted on a handful of occasions and given the turn of foot he’s shown in the Derby, Arc and Brigadier Gerard, I believe he would’ve won.
Just like to say that the finale to today’s race was a very sad sight. Never nice to see.
Ian and Andyod
Watch the race again. Then re-read your comments on here about O’Brien riding a bad race. You guys need to stop being daft and just concede the obvious – SNA was not good enough on the day. Pace, ground, track, etc, may not have helped but to lay the blame at Joseph O’Brien is plain daft.Andyod
You posted the oddest logic – for backing a horse – ever a few pages back. SNA could not lose because Aidan was putting his son up???? That was reason for your confidence. Lo and behold, horse is well beat and you blame the jockey!!I read your age on another post so you’ve obviosuly been following the game a long time – a lot longer than me – but I can’t take you serious when you post so many daft comments. It would probably be in your best interests to withdraw the comment about the bad ride on SNA.
Ruby
I understand your frustration. But that is racing. Being adaptable to a changing race is part of being of a racehorse. Pace suits hold up horses – it does not suit front-runners. As for the unfortunate incident at the end – a freak accident. Sadly it happens. But as sad and all as it to see, you must keep it in persepective.Just watched the race on ATR webbie as I was attempting to play footy earlier today.
Rewilding RIP – he deffo broke down in my book.
I think some are being a tad unfair about Nathaniel. The race was slowly run and he quickened best, irrespective of being in the right position. He is obviously a classy animal with more foot than maybe we gave him credit for?
Thought St Nic ride was fine, that horse just wants a longer trip in IMHO. I can see him running in a Gold Cup one day – I know there is Fame and Glory as well in the camp.
Workforce was….what he is. Good performer who tried his best but is beatable.
Be interesting if they did run the same race again in a month at a diff track…I don’t think the result would be any different as a faster pace would surely suit Nathaniel as much as any of ’em!
Zip
Perhaps Workforce is not as good as we like to think.His most recent races have not been great.Although SYT is supposed to be very good.
As for RiGitS.If you have grown up around horses you should not be so disappointed.S++t happens as Forrest Gump put it.The public will get over it.They pay to watch boxing do they not?I have seen boxers die in the ring.By Ark time it will be history.
I would like to address the pacemaker situation.Confront recently ran as pacemaker for Workforce,moved out to let him pass then boxed SYT on the rail while he could.Nobody spoke up.Today Debussy went as pacemaker and slowed down the race to a crawl. Nobody mentioned the difference between those and the Ballydoyle pacemakers who invariably try to make an honest pace for the race and not mess with the horses who enjoy an honestly run race.Rules for pacemakers need to be rewritten and enforced.
Poor Godolphin, the slow pace did not help Rewilding when he went for his race.Had the race been run at an honest pace things might have played out differently.
Credit to Buick for taking the race to the others.
For Ballydoyle it went all wrong but at least they still have the horse for the BC.Waiting with a Montjeu to sprint past a Galileo who knows nothing but speed!Second to Frankel in a closely fought tyo race he was.
Finally congrats to the Rothschilds for reaching into their vault to supplement the winner.Nice gamble that.People are being seriously harsh here on Workforce. He was the only one able to quicken off horribly dead ground at Sandown and pick up the winner conceding a fair bit of weight. He sustained his run for over 3f in the Derby, and he’s basically not won today because he didn’t run in a straight line. Ascot is an incredible wide track and he’s gone right from one side to the other. God knows how many lengths he’s given away doing that.
I cannot help noticing that the winner is a son of Galileo just like the Guineas winner. Also a three year old. Some crop this year from Galileo.Next year the Rothschild can enter their horses at the initial entry stage and save a lot of money.They can even do it by monthly installments if their are short.
They estimate that Ballydoyle gave up three lengths by using an apprentice and three more by not being able to claim!A total of six lengths.Beaten by three and 1/2 lengths.Was this a learning moment for them? The rest of the year will tell.
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Shocking race as a spectacle, and what could have been one of the races of the new century was turned into a farce by the tactics, then a tragedy by the demise of Rewilding.
To my eyes, Godolphin knew that Rewilding would settle whatever the pace, and Debussy was held back as a deliberate and cynical ploy to unsettle rivals that mightn’t.
Why, oh why, did connections make the decision not to run Confront? Not one of SMS’s better days, whichever way you look at it.
Would have to agree with Ginger that it may have been the knock Workforce took that caused him to veer across the course; it’s certainly something he’s never done before, though the notion he has a problem going right-handed – in the light of his Arc win, and 2 blinding runs around Sandown since – is clearly absurd. Certainly looked the most likely winner, until he was struck into, turning in. .
Difficult to know what to make of the result; on a line through SNA the winner might just be as good as he seemed, but ceding him 4l of a steady pace was never a good idea, and, imo, the Coolmore horse just isn’t the force he was as a 2yo, a point recognised by connections, both by his programme leading up to the race and the jockey booking. Not a result I would bet on being endorsed, should the first 2 meet again in the Arc.A tragic race, strangely run from the word go, and a terrible end for a great young horse.
I believe that it may have been Rewilding who struck into Workforce and caused the injury which so affected his running. Just before the horrible crash I thought I saw a small incident in the bunching at the back which caused Dettori to have to snatch him back suddenly for a stride or two. Could it be that the sudden unbalancing caused a tiny stress fracture which then snapped completely?
I have to praise John Gosden for putting his own success to one side and going straight to attend the injured horse while they waited for the vet. His sensible comments on TV afterwards, regarding the freak nature of a break like that, and the horse’s apparent lack of distress, even to the point of nibbling some grass, brought a little comfort and may have helped with anti-racing backlash.
I can still hardly believe he could get up and run on after such a hard fall, even if he’d had 4 good legs. Such a brave young horse and a great loss. RIP Rewilding.
A sad end to an unsatisfactory race, although the best horse on the day won.
Joseph O’Brien rode a considerably better race than Ryan Moore on a horse which has probably run up to his Coronation Cup form 121-122. He kept his mount going in a straight line while his 2 rivals drifted, the horse under him just wasnt up to the task.
Workforce ran roughly to 123-124, slightly lower than his Eclipse run, which is probably as good as he is. Like most English winners of the Derby, he was over-rated by the assessor on that effort. I think his Eclipse run represents his best career performance thus far.
Nathaniel, an improving 3yo with sound course form. His jockey adapted best to the situation set before him but the horse was still giving plenty. He is still open to improvement.
If Pour Moi is as good as Andre Fabre stated (he compared him favourably with Peintre Celebre) he would appear to be a good thing for the Arc.
People are being seriously harsh here on Workforce. He was the only one able to quicken off horribly dead ground at Sandown and pick up the winner conceding a fair bit of weight. He sustained his run for over 3f in the Derby, and he’s basically not won today because he didn’t run in a straight line. Ascot is an incredible wide track and he’s gone right from one side to the other. God knows how many lengths he’s given away doing that.
I think Pythagoras may be of more practical help than the Good Lord!
If he drifted 50 yards off a true line in 2 furlongs the distance lost is less than 3 yards, considerably less distance than he was beaten.
They estimate that Ballydoyle gave up three lengths by using an apprentice and three more by not being able to claim!A total of six lengths.Beaten by three and 1/2 lengths.Was this a learning moment for them? The rest of the year will tell.
Who are these unquoted people referred to as "they"?
As far as I can see, you are the only one spouting this nonsense.
Also three lengths by using an apprentice, another three by not claiming? They are the same thing man!! Why are you adding 3lbs+3lbs?
Once again, read your case for SNA before the race. It was the oddest reason I’ve ever come across for backing a horse. Is it any wonder that when you’re whole case for backing SNA revolved around the jockey, that you blame the jockey when he dosen’t win???
Do you genuinely – genuinely – believe that Joseph O’Brien cost St. Nicholas Abbey a win yesterday?
People are being seriously harsh here on Workforce. He was the only one able to quicken off horribly dead ground at Sandown and pick up the winner conceding a fair bit of weight. He sustained his run for over 3f in the Derby, and he’s basically not won today because he didn’t run in a straight line. Ascot is an incredible wide track and he’s gone right from one side to the other. God knows how many lengths he’s given away doing that.
I think Pythagoras may be of more practical help than the Good Lord!
If he drifted 50 yards off a true line in 2 furlongs the distance lost is less than 3 yards, considerably less distance than he was beaten.
You’re assuming he was going as fast as he could? You try running diagonially and see what speed you go at compared to going in a straight line.
Yesterday was a ‘bad day at black rock’ for many reasons…
I turned off, having seen enough in what was all a bad blur and things didn’t get any cheerier when I switched on the radio – only for the news flash about Amy Winehouse.
Some might say that the writing was on the wall for her – though I don’t think that any of us believed before that there was a need for another pacemaker in ‘Confront’?
Didn’t we take it on trust that this would be a proper race?
Instead it turned into a diabolical debacle that maybe the Sheikh should hold his hands up and say that for their part Godolphin made a right royal bowl locks of the whole thing?
And in doing so went against everything that had been released to the press for us to munch on like the suckers that we are!
I don’t know how many times I’ve heard it said on the Beeb that the Sheikh is in the game for the love of the sport – the competition – the taking part – global racing the best against the best.
Isn’t that what his vision about the Dubai Carnival about in part?
With the tactics used yesterday I feel that winning was the ultimate aim, whether it was done dirty, the sport of kings was brought down to a basic low level winner takes all situation that I believed the Sheikh to be bigger than.
Here are the quotes that I couldn’t find/missed before I posted about pace yesterday:
Frankie Dettori
rides Rewilding for the seventh consecutive time and has been successful on the Godolphin performer four times.
He added:"I think that the ground will be on the slow side of good, which will be good racing ground
"Debussy will make sure that the race does not turn into a
"It is not a big field and I foresee a very straightforward race a
Connections believe a strongly run race is the key to Rewilding’s success, as Mahmood Al Zarooni’s star prepares for Saturday’s King George VI And Queen Elizabeth Diamond Stakes at Ascot.
Godolphin’s racing manager Simon Crisford feels that if the Prince Of Wales’s Stakes winner can get into a nice rhythm early on in the piece, then he can use his serious turn of foot to great advantage.
With that in mind, fellow Mahmood Al Zarooni inmate and Arlington Million winner Debussy is likely to be declared as a pacemaker.
"He loves quickening up off a
"We were not surprised at all that he had the pace to win the Prince Of Wales’s over 10 furlongs. What really helped him that day was that it was a
As with ‘Rewilding’ & Amy – we’re left with a case of what might have been?All credit to Nathaniel; Debussy and the Godolphin team did everything possible to stop him running his race and all credit to young Buick for overcoming it. I’m sorry but I do wonder how much their tactics contibuted to what turned out to be one of the saddest races I’ve ever witnessed. It was meant to be a true run race.
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