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Gambling addiction is far less publicised than over-eating, drinking to excess and the misuse of drugs and I was wondering how people think gamblers in general are viewed by the non-betting public?
I first thought about starting a business a couple of years ago and in May of this year finally set about doing something to get things moving. I put together a business plan, went to see my local business account manager with the intention of securing finance and was pleased with the response I received from them. They thought my ideas were great, that the plan was fully thought through and appropriately detailed, and that the confirmation of advanced orders was superb. I left the meeting quite happy and had no concerns in leaving the organisation of a loan to said business account manager.
In with the business plan I had had to include specific (personal) documentation, which included bank statements for any and all current accounts held. On some of the statements there were deposits to online betting accounts, certainly nothing out of the ordinary. I then received a telephone call from a colleague of the business account manager stating that ‘whilst your money is yours to spend as you please, I can’t put forward a request for a loan with the existence of such payments’.
I was absolutely stunned. Who is anyone to cast judgement on how anyone spends their money, and is this wholly indicative of how people who bet are viewed in the modern day?
Take it up with the head office of the bank concerned …. what you spend your money on should not have any bearing on whether the loan is granted or not (provided it is legal), the primary consideration shoud be how your account is managed in general – mainly does your income cover your outgoings?
If still no joy try another bank.
I state this as someone who used to work for a bank in the days when I had a "real" job.
Incidentally the number of senior managers who were seriously into betting and owning racehorses was surprisingly high – most bankers I know would find it difficult to justify a "holier than thou" attitude when it came to betting.
I was absolutely stunned. Who is anyone to cast judgement on how anyone spends their money, and is this wholly indicative of how people who bet are viewed in the modern day?
er, I think anyone who you asked to lend money from is entitled to cast judgement on how you spend yours. Otherwise, it’s nobody’s business.
I then received a telephone call from a colleague of the business account manager stating that ‘whilst your money is yours to spend as you please, I can’t put forward a request for a loan with the existence of such payments’.
Outrageous behaviour by your bank, though it may go someway to emphasising the wisdom of keeping a separate bank account solely to be used for betting, preferably at another one of the High Street Usurers away from prying eyes.
I’d also proffer the idea that banks may be happier if betting activities are restricted to current account Debit Cards rather than Credit, especially in these post ‘sub prime’ fingers-burnt days: unfortunately betting is and probably will always be associated with debt and, superficially at least, debt can be easily controlled on a current account viz "no sir you cannot have an overdraft"
That said my banks are quite aware of my betting activities, I’ve never had the transactions questioned nor had any problem getting a loan some years ago.
They should be grateful for the turnover
LetsGetRacing wrote
I was absolutely stunned. Who is anyone to cast judgement on how anyone spends their money, and is this wholly indicative of how people who bet are viewed in the modern day?
Nothing to do with modern day. Gambling was a secretive activity before legalisation and then a hidden one behind opaque shop windows.
The problem with gambling is possible addiction and then probable debt.
This is why those who do not gamble perhaps view those who do with suspicion, scorn, or sadness.
Why this addiction is not more publicised is strange, considering others are.Hello,
Unfortunately, it is the type of gambler one is seen as…for some strange reason a person who gambles on horses are seen as some sort of pariah, however anyone who has a go on the National Lottery is simply having Fun…
,Also bear in mind Northern Rock were GAMBLING when adopting their disastrous business plan…but when they looked like losing the ‘effin lot, the tax payers stepped in!!
I will have to make contact with HM Treasury prior to next year’s Cheltenham to ensure a similar facility is available to me if my investments over the 4 days are not quite successful…
regards,
doyley
The reality is that any lender would immediately bristle at the sight of regular outgoings to betting accounts. The difference between that type of spending and others is that people who bet regularly are generally more at risk of running into financial difficulties. Clearly banks/lenders can’t be expected to identify who are the responsible gamblers and who are not.
LGR, were there ever any credits coming from the bookie, into your bank account?
It might have made all the difference.
LGR, I have had a few businesses and set up a few more. It is really easy to get yourself up and running with finance and no security. You do need to turn a coin though, unless you are just after bagging some grant money.
The banks are a law unto themselves and there’s no point kicking up a stink about it, you’ll only make things worse for yourself. You should leave well alone for about six months. Open another bank account (with the same bank, specifically for gambling). Re-apply for finance with another bank and put in your current account statements with no gambling activities recorded on them.
If they happen to ask you why you did get financed last time (they’ll see this from your credit checks) tell them that you decided you needed more time and that you withdrew your application. Also tell them that you dont want to do it with your own bank because you aren’t happy with the way they are dealing with your account at the moment.
There are a couple of things you have to bear in mind when dealing with banks;
1. They want to make money with no risk and no effort.
2. You need a business plan and a suit.
3. You need to be able to confidently lie and not get too upset if you get caught out.
4. Banks are predatory, don’t settle for the first deal you are offered. Let them make an offer and then go to another bank with it and let them better it.So, dry your eyes and learn from your mistakes ..
I started a thread about this which recieved some brilliant contributions:
Would the plans be viewed differently if there were net profits from the betting accounts?
tell people you spend 50 quid on a couple of rounds of golf each week and people will think you have a respectable hobby, tell people you spend 200 pound per month on racing and betting and you are a waster and a fool
tell people you spend a couple of hundred pounds each week on trips to the theatre in london you’ll be looked at much more highly than if you explain your bar bill for 7 day a week social drinking and smoking is about 800 per month
the first thing any of us will do if we see a statement of expenditure for anyone else will be to make a judgement on that person whether we know them or not and lenders will rightly be more critical than most on this
there are plenty of ways to spend online without any signs of the expenditure or reason for it
I find this hard to swallow that a bank has an attitude like this. If you payments going to wine companies maybe theywould refuse you help incase you were an alcoholic.
I will say that I took the advice of my Bank Manager many years ago and opened a separate racing account. Ok It was a pretty healthy account but I had a huge overdraft facilty on my business account due to large stock holdings.
Bank manager used to ask me for tips
Maybe things have changed and it is now policy not to lend to anyone who is using over a certain percentage of his account for betting.
Who knows nowadays how they think.
I accumulated a large sum of cash on my Barclaycard last year and went into my local Barclays branch to try and withdraw it (I didn’t have an account there). However, max withdraw per day was only a few hundred quid and they wanted to charge 2% for the privilege. Chat with a personal banker later they dumped the balance into a premier current account for no fee and basically rolled out the red carpet (winning the Scoop6 bonus fund a couple of weeks later probably helped too). They know I’m a punter and have no problems with me withdrawing large sums over the counter and my bank statements are 90% betting transactions. I even included antepost bets on Ryan Moore for last year’s jockeys’ championship in my list of savings/investments. Guess their attitude might change if I knocked it all out and asked for a loan but as far as their attitude to my punting goes, they don’t have a problem with it.
Cross reference this to the thread about tipsters – a stockbroker is a pillar of society, a tipster is a lying, cheating, corrupt con artist.
I made the sorry mistake of placing some funds with a local stockbroker back in the 90’s. After 12 months, he’d extracted around £3000 in fees and commission and my £25k bank was still worth £25k.
I know which profession I reckon contains the bigger proportion of conmen.
AP
You should have gone to the Halifax sub branch at Gowerton near Swansea when Graham Price was running the joint.
He had a passion for horseracing with 65K resting in betfred and betfair accounts.
If he thought you were doing ok with selecting winners he could have spent the £750,000 he spent on tipsters with you.
He used to pay in cash by sending boxes of money to postal boxes and the tipsters paid someone to collect them and place them in another postal box and they eventually found the correct person although Hove tipster AshleyCarr who he had shares of horses with always denied he had received the one with £500k in it!
Problem was of course Graham price stole an estimated £10 million from the bank.
When arrested Mr Price explained to the plod he had always expected to be paying the whole lot back when the next winners came in.
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