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I’ve lost count of the times he’s said one of his runners isn’t fully fit and then said horse has subsequently hacked up. It looks like he’s at it again with Nathaniel. I’d certainly take anything he say with a large pinch of salt.
… what this also tells me is that, despite what we repeatedly hear these days about 10f Gr. 1’s having usurped the top 12f prestigious events, [only until the Big F disappears from the scene I should think], here we have Mr Gosden, former American based, apparently using Ireland’s one and only Gr. 1 that’s worth winning, as a trial for the 12f Arc
…those of us who maintain that the Arc is the very best race to win, anywhere – can take much comfort from this…
Why on earth would John Gosden lie about Nathaniel’s fitness?
If he wanted to back the horse at big odds all he’d have to do is suggest he wasn’t going for the race a month before…..Cloud Cuckoo Land thinking if you are reading anything untoward about the man saying in his opinion he’d improve for the race…..he’s not God and like us all he can get things wrong now and then……It’s allowed you know.
You need to get over yourself UM. You are becoming obsessed with the Frankel situation.
When Gosden made his pre-Eclipse assessment So You Think was very much a runner. He probably assessed that his horse was not fit enough to beat a race-fit So You Think over 10f, as the race worked out Nathaniel achieved a figure below that which SYT produced with admirable consistency. His reservations at the time he made them were understandable. Nathaniel has yet to produce as good form over 10f as he has at Ascot over 12f, whether his best at 10f is good enough to win today is something which his trainer clearly doubts.
Why on earth would John Gosden lie about Nathaniel’s fitness?
If he wanted to back the horse at big odds all he’d have to do is suggest he wasn’t going for the race a month before…..Cloud Cuckoo Land thinking if you are reading anything untoward about the man saying in his opinion he’d improve for the race…..he’s not God and like us all he can get things wrong now and then……It’s allowed you know.
We really must stop agreeing with each other Fist.
Excellent post.Value Is EverythingYou need to get over yourself UM. You are becoming obsessed with the Frankel situation.
I wouldn’t mind but none of us are saying the Arc isn’t the best race. Just saying the Champion isn’t a bad one either.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
When Gosden made his pre-Eclipse assessment So You Think was very much a runner. He probably assessed that his horse was not fit enough to beat a race-fit So You Think over 10f, as the race worked out Nathaniel achieved a figure below that which SYT produced with admirable consistency. His reservations at the time he made them were understandable. Nathaniel has yet to produce as good form over 10f as he has at Ascot over 12f, whether his best at 10f is good enough to win today is something which his trainer clearly doubts.
Agreed. I have always been surprised at Gosden’s insistence on running him over 10f and thought once the Eclipse was won that would be the end of it. Box ticked as far as stud purposes are concerned. Interesting that he persists still.
As far as his fitness today is concerned, my guess is that the truth lies somewhere in between. I am sure he will be better for today but would be surprised if he was not fit enough to do himself justice.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
I believe that Mr G. is just being cagey.If he wins fine, if he loses well it was just a get fit race.That the Irish Group one race is good enough to prepare a horse for the main chance in Europe is an excellent endorsement of the race.How many Group One races in England did Frankel race in just for the publicity with absolutely no opposition? Reduced them to show case races he did .
IF Gosden’s horse is not fit to run for his life he will not win,the final furlong at Leopardstown will find him out and may ruin his Arc chances to boot,psychologically as well as physically.Both Snow Fairy and SNA are waiting to ambush him .
I’d take his comments as a tip today for what I think is a very good horse. He wouldn’t be running if he didn’t think he could win. If Camelot wasn’t around, I’d back him with confidence for The Arc and I think he will win today – superb battler, who gives his all and therefore looks like he takes some time to recover from races. That makes his King George ‘on the nod’ loss all the more meritorious given it came just 14 days after a seasonal debut win which had come on the back of a nightmare prep due to a respiratory infection.
You need to get over yourself UM. You are becoming obsessed with the Frankel situation.
…merely an observer. Look to others who seem to have the time to write pages and pages,
ad infinitum
….
How many Group One races in England did Frankel race in just for the publicity with absolutely no opposition?
None. Stupid comment from a stupid poster.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
I think Andy gets bored and wants a ding dong with someone to pass the time. I’ve long since stopped taking his Frankel posts seriously.
Such a shame as this is a brilliant forum with some wonderful posters and trolls like him don’t normally hang around too long. I should bite my tongue like you Hammy but it goes on and on and can be on any thread whether it has anything to do with Frankel or not!
He once told us he was 79! You’d think he was between 7 and 9.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
He once told us he was 79
Is that his age or Handicap mark?
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Actually while Andy’s (And a couple of other’s…) bash Frankel at all costs posts just make me smile a bit nowadays I find his derogatory remarks towards the gentile Sir Henry Cecil to verge on the offensive. Constantly labelling arguably one of the greatest flat trainers of all time basically a coward and insinuating that he has shown incompetence where Frankel is concerned.
I know in this increasingly cynical society there’ll be plenty of hard nosed individuals who will leap forward to point out that it should have no bearing on what is written about him, however I’ll freely admit that Sir Henry’s frighteningly frail condition makes those kind of remarks even more jarring to me as a reader.
Are we really to believe that a trainer with Sir Henry’s incredible CV has less idea about which trips his most prestigious horse is suited by than old Andy? (Or any other contributor.)
…not for my money.
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