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It looked a mediocre renewal to me. Of course everyone involved in the media and the connections always try to make it sound like the best thing since sliced smokescreen.
I don’t mind the odd person defending the race but when all the media cheerleaders are involved it really does become more than a little tedious. It is even worse when they try and adopt some sort of imaginary higher ground. If by the end of the season the race is confirmed as mediocre will we get said cheerleaders admitting as such? I doubt it very much. All will be conveniently forgotten until they start hyping up 2017.
I have read on another forum that Ryan Moore apparently made a balls up and should have won.
I have watched the race several times and at the rate he was closing, he had ample time to get by. He closes onto the hind quarters of Idaho and Harzand but at that point his rate of closing slows dramatically. He gets to within three parts of a length of Harzand, then, arguably as close as a half length. However, at that point his rate of progress stops. Harzand gets back in front by three parts, then by a length and then hits the line travelling more strongly than US Army Ranger. I am pretty sure the winner would have won further had there been another half furlong to travel.
That’s my take on it anyway, had the runner up flown through and gone down a neck, finishing the stronger of the two, then that might well have been an error, but it looked like the stronger stayer on the day won.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Harzand deserved to win. Watching from the top of the grandstand I saw the last furlong perfectly. Much too my annoyance he was too good. Lost loads 😥
Fact of the matter is, Moore should of been where Harzand was and he would of won the race by over 4 lengths, he was 15 lengths stone last at tattenham and got beat 1 length.
Where do people think Minding would have finished if she’d run today instead of in the Oaks?
So Mi Dar beat Humphrey Bogart at Epsom in only her second race and went on to improve and win easy at York next time out. Gosden seemed to me to have more of a shine to her than Wings of Desire. Until they meet you have to have Minding ahead of So Mi Dar so she’d have at least come top 3 or 4 for me.
Blackbeard to conquer the World
USAR went from last to almost first, passing 14 horses, running on the cut up ground (inside where the rail was yesterday), it’s not surprising that he couldn’t sustain his run to get past the winner. The C4 team said before the race that nobody would want to be coming down that strip today. USAR also showed his inexperience, rolling in behind the winner, though he was also unbalanced by the camber as he moved over to join the two leaders. And yes, in that Lester Piggot feature currently running on ATR, he did say that you need to be handy coming around Tattenham Corner.
Minding’s race was 2 secs slower. The ground was slightly slower for the Oaks and the fillies covered extra distance. Also, Minding got held up at least twice in her run and then had to angle around horses. You have to think that given a clear run, she would have at least gone very close. And that’s not even with the fillies’ weight allowance.
Sometimes a horse is beaten because the jockey leaves it too late and they never get there – a la Dancing Brave. Today was different – RM delivers his horse at the furlong marker at which point he starts to hang and can’t go past. For me this is no hard luck story. Harland made his move earlier in the straight but had the extra stamina to maintain his run. A furlong out you would have bet USAR would win.
As for the quality of the race – time will tell but I suspect it wasn’t great. I agree with Steve that WOD did not improve on his Dante run and the comparison with Deauville doesn’t work as that one hasn’t run his race. The front 4 are a long way clear so they could be decent but I couldn’t see any of them beating a Postponed or Minding.
"this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"
Paddy Power have opened a book on the Irish Derby
Harzand 11/8
USAR 13/8
Wings of Desire 6/1
Idaho 7/1A very different track to Epsom and the going will play quite a big part in it as well.
Blackbeard to conquer the World
Not sure I’d back USAR at any price until I see him go past a leader with some degree of relish. He didn’t exactly pull clear at Chester despite the generous after-you offered by Heff
First impressions could be wrong of course but visually I thought it looked like a good derby
Think US ranger looked a seriously good horse today- surprised at all the negativity for him on here.
Good point Steeplechasing about pulling clear etc.
Have not made my mind up about the race today yet.
Any views on the camber factor? We keep on hearing in commentary that horses can’t handle the camber. I’m wondering why they built one into the home straight. It seems to ruin finishes with horses unable to run straight. If they have the inside rail they do OK, but outside of that it becomes a lottery.
My take on the Derby finish was that US Army Ranger was hanging badly towards Harzand when trying to overtake him (probably unsettled by the camber). They just avoided touching and this seemed to take the wind out of USAR’s sails.
Is it that difficult to build a course which has level ground in the final couple of furlongs? Can’t see the advantage of having a camber. What’s the point?
PS. I thought Ryan Moore gave USAR way too much to do and then had to weave his way through traffic. I understand about having to reserve a horse’s energy and keeping him calm until the moment is right to strike, but a jockey also has to ensure he is in the right position to strike.
Luck plays a part – and I suppose the O’Brien tactics were probably to keep him out the back. But it was hard to see how he could win from there unless he was a world-beater.
The trends are maintained…
All of the previous 17 winners had an SP of 7/1 or shorter – 13/2 (tick)
21 of the previous 22 winners had won one or both of their last 2 races – win win (tick)
All of the previous 22 winners had finished in the first 3 places in their last race – win (tick)Only 3 followed those trends – 1st 2nd + 4th.
Keep smiling, there’s always next time.
I thought Harzand looked magnificent both in the paddock, going to post he was on his toes and looked raring to go, if I’d have been at Epsom round the paddock yesterday he would have been my choice. The scare around his losing a shoe and the doubts about him running made it even more interesting and just the look on Pat Smullen’s face when he won was worth it, Ryan Moore although a great jockey always spoils the party with his ‘closed shop’ interviews. I wouldn’t say the Queen looked too happy either as CH.4 panned too the Royal Box, she was propping herself up on the balcony as if she’d put the Royal Mint on the loser. 😥
Coolmore can’t win all the big classics and it was nice to see Dermot Weld take his place on the winners podium, a real gentleman, well done to them all. Harzand goes down in history as the winner of the 2016 Derby, US Army Ranger was 2nd and Deauville 3rd and nothing is going to change that. It’s no use criticising the jockeys and especially the horses…it’s all over for another year. I have to agree with thejudge1 about over analysing the big races, the trainers have done most of the hard work before they enter the horses and I thought John Gosden, in particular, gave genuine explanations after the race as to why Wings of Desire didn’t run his race.
Humphrey Bogart ran a blinder to be 5th regaining around £41,500 of the £75,000 laid out to supplement him for the race and I bet the owners thought it was worth every penny of the £33,500 they lost to see their horse run in the Derby. All my horses finished behind him but that’s racing and now lets look forward to Royal Ascot..my bookie certainly is..
JacThings turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out...
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