- This topic has 199 replies, 49 voices, and was last updated 14 years, 10 months ago by
.
- Posts
Rules of Racing
PART 5 – GENERAL DUTIES OF RIDERS – (D)30 to (D)57
45. Riding to achieve the best possible placing45.1 A Rider must
45.1.1 ride his horse throughout the race in such a way that he
can be seen
to have made a genuine attempt to obtain from his horse timely, real and substantial efforts to achieve the best possible placing, and
45.1.2 take andbe seen
to take all other reasonable and permissible measures throughout the race, however it develops, to ensure the horse is given a full opportunity to achieve the best possible placing.
[My emphasis in bold]
In other words, the role of the spectator is important here, not just the role of the person on horseback. McCoy is cocking a snook at the Rules of Racing if he is suggesting otherwise.
This issue has been clouded by the Harringay affair hasn’t it though where the appeals committee found in favour of Knight and Murphy when they suggested that because the mare had a wind problem, the way he rode her gave her more of a chance of seeing her race out than if he’d been ridden more vigorously. There is no way that Murphy could have been ‘seen’ to take all other reasonable and permissible measures throughout the race, that’s not just my view, but those of the raceday stewards.
What the raceday stewards or for that matter the appeals committee made of the ride that helped her win the very valuable mares novice final at Newbury a few months later, I don’t know.
At the risk of repetition I still do not know :
A) What ms Hislop has allegedly said
B)What AP has said (if anything) about this farce (to anyone at all)
C) If the owner or trainer has defended AP by explaining the problems/quirks of the horse in training him or placing him to give of his best
I just feel that McCoy has decided that this is too ridiculous to get involved in….everyone must have experienced situations in their lives when they feel that a defence merely adds credence to the original problem. Anyway if any of Ms Hislop’s comments were suggesting a poor ride or worse,isn’t this a matter for the stewards or the Jockey Club ? If nobody but journalists are the source of this silly row, then I suggest that Ms Hislop has a personal agenda. Is anyone in possession of the facts here ?It’s common knowledge that jockeys boycotted Lydia when she was doing the Ian Bartlett job of reviewing races on the BBC. Hence she ended up resigning possibly with a blindfold on and tip toeing the plank at the time!
She ran into AP on the Morning Line and lo and behold she aint on that anymore either! Now AP is reported to be boycotting RUK when Lydia is working. So if history is any guide Lydia won’t be on RUK for much longer if the channel producers want AP’s co-operation.
Basically AP dosen’t like Lydia questioning the validity of his rides. Get Me Out Of Here at Ascot was the lastest occasion.
…
In other words, the role of the spectator is important here, not just the role of the person on horseback. McCoy is cocking a snook at the Rules of Racing if he is suggesting otherwise.
This issue has been clouded by the Harringay affair hasn’t it though where the appeals committee found in favour of Knight and Murphy when they suggested that because the mare had a wind problem, the way he rode her gave her more of a chance of seeing her race out than if he’d been ridden more vigorously. There is no way that Murphy could have been ‘seen’ to take all other reasonable and permissible measures throughout the race, that’s not just my view, but those of the raceday stewards.
What the raceday stewards or for that matter the appeals committee made of the ride that helped her win the very valuable mares novice final at Newbury a few months later, I don’t know.
From what you say (and I did not follow the Harringay affair) the stewards failed to apply their own rules. That does not change the rules, which in this instance point clearly to the need to be seen to be making sufficient effort.
And the point about that is that it recognises the importance of how a ride looks – such as to you or to Lydia Hislop – and not just how it feels, such as to Tony McCoy.
For a number of reasons I think the rules are correct to take this line.
Maybe Racing For Change will have a word with AP and ask him to support RUK, that’s if they are not to busy trying to make him Sports personality.
AP obviously dosen’t want to discuss the ride. Fair play to Lydia for going where the majority of the pressroom cowards would never go. In the longterm the sport will whither away if rides like that of AP are not questioned. But then he owns half of Lamborn so maybe he sees nothing wrong with the game!
- Total Posts 17716
Jockies and trainers are their own society, they dont need well educated people trying to tell them their job.
Would you go to Tulse Hill, Streatham and find a bunch of lads on street corner and try to join in, start a convosation and try teach them how to roll a joint and what wieght a quarter of weed is, no you wouldn’t?
So why should we start trying to become friends with jockies, try and get on their good sides, just let them be and get on with their lives.
Point is, does it really matter if McCoy speaks to RUK or not? No NOT REALLY
Point is, does it really matter if McCoy speaks to RUK or not? No NOT REALLY
It does matter that he’s acting like a spoilt little brat though because he thinks he’s above any criticism.
I’ve always had great admiration for what AP has achieved over the years and last years National win was right up there with some of the great sporting moments for me with all the emotion involved..
Episodes like this leave a sour taste in the mouth though, I cannot stand people who bask in all the glory and take all the high-fives and back slaps when things are going well, but react like this when someone dare question something they have done.
My admiration for Lydia Hislop has grown considerably through this for coming out and giving an honest opinion that many people shared with her but were too afraid to speak their mind over.
Well done Lydia and shame on you AP!
- Total Posts 17716
Would you go to Tulse Hill, Streatham and find a bunch of lads on street corner and try to join in, start a convosation and try teach them how to roll a joint and what wieght a quarter of weed is, no you wouldn’t?
Without doubt the most ridiculous thing you’ve ever contributed.
And there are plenty of people in possession of the facts, oldjohn, you’re just not one of them. Just out of interest, why do you feel compelled to comment (going so far as to label the situation a ‘farce’) at all? Is it your belief that the suspect actions of trainers and jockeys should only be questioned by the appropriate authorities? Does the racing media – at least that part that still possesses a spine – not have a right to debate the suspicious activities of those involved in the sport?
Lydia Hislop was well within her rights to highlight McCoy’s tame effort aboard Get Me Out Of Here – a ride I know for a fact angered ‘better placed’ individuals than most here – and I’m only sorry that she hasn’t jumped on Jonjo O’Neill’s avoidance of Alistair Down’s questions prior to the Greatwood.
Tony McCoy clearly believes he is bigger than the sport and that, as a result, he is above criticism. He has had the opportunity to state his version of events but has refused to do so, choosing instead to throw his toys well and truly out of the pram and sulk in the weighing room.
Our would-be SPOTY needs to grow up a little bit.
Football managers started the "I won’t talk to you if you criticise me" hissyfit routine and it’s no surprise other sports people follow suit.
It’s down to the authorities to decide if they want to force ‘players’ to talk to the media for the punters without who these precious ‘geniuses’ wouldn’t be superstars and instead might well just be working in an anonymous McJob.
One has to feel sorry for Ruby missing out on all those good rides and it’s not surprising they force themselves back so quickly from serious injury as people might one day notice that the horses still win with Mr Fehily or Mr McLernon on them.
Seems one is acting like a spoilt child either because they think they’re too perfect to be criticised or perhaps they don’t like being rumbled.
He has is house for sale [Times housing] whatever he has done for racing I’m not interested in his chance of Sport Personality, I have things in my garden with more personality.
Bye Tony!- Total Posts 17716
I can’t be the only person who doesn’t care about this at all. As for Tony McCoy being Sports Personality, it’s out of the question, most people don’t know who he is, I’m the only one in my family who does, add to that he has pretty much no personality.
Interesting discussion and some good points made from all quarters.
Personally, I am probably in the minority in agreeing with Fist (way back on page 4).
I dont know if Timeform/Raceform have commented as such, but I thought GMOOH’s run was in the ‘not knocked about once his chance was gone’ category.
Training of racehorses can be complex at times, none more so than when a horse does not show the level of form expected, from one season to the next. Lydia generally does a fine job on RUK, but I feel she can too quick on occasion to castigate a jockey for not riding a horse in a vigorous enough manner.
I mean, there can be many reasons that give rise to a jockey receiving his particular riding instructions. An obvious one being that based on his home work, trainer has issued a strict warning not to ‘bottom’ a horse when his chance has gone on his seasonal reappearance.Rather than plunge head long into open criticism, I would have liked Lydia to credit the jockey and trainer with some intelligence, knowledge and skill in the art of horsemanship. And who knows, maybe connections would have been more open to the media about the horse’s well-being.
- Total Posts 17716
I dont know if Timeform/Raceform have commented as such, but I thought GMOOH’s run was in the ‘not knocked about
once his chance was gone
‘ category.
And why was his chance gone?
Has anybody wondered if McCoy is in a bit of a cleft stick here?
In an interview he DID give about Get Me Out of Here, he said he was surprised the horse ran so poorly "in a race I thought he’d win on the bridle."
So: Can we assume he’d been given information that the horse was much fitter than he was? And if so, where would that info have come from? The trainer, presumably.
If that is the case, McCoy can hardly go on TV and elaborate on the above statement, can he?
It looks as if he genuinely felt let down by the performance of Get Me Out of Here and the high hopes he had been given.
Perhaps we are witnessing the final stages of the McCoy-O’Neill relationship?
And maybe old AP is regretting passing up the chances of the Nicholls and Henderson jobs, decisions which looked inexplicable at the time and now appear absolutely bizarre.
This has been blown out of all proportion. AP rides very, very few ill-judged races. Those that think he does are idiots, he would not be Champion so many times if that were the case.
I"m an idiot then Ginge! Wichita Lineman was a brilliant ride but AP wouldn"t rate it as one of his top 10 because he always felt the horse would do what he did,thats what you call knowing your horses! On the other end of the scale was AP"s embarrasment at being made to look a fool by Denman,thats what you call not knowing your horses! Brilliant jockey who will never be a brilliant horseman,unlike Francome and Dunwoody who were both! As for winning Sports "Personality" of the year,i suggest he does a very quick course in PR,as the director of the show has apparently allocated him a 10 second slot! Hows he going to fill the remaining 7 secs?
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.