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Horses have well-developed social instincts. They have an acute sensitivity to social hierachy and are incredibly alert to subtle cues of dominance and submission.
We are also a member of their social hierachy.
As I understand, the horse headbutted two people (one of whom required medical attention). The other person in question was the stall handler, who was also bitten twice. He responded by slapping the horse.
Abuse or discipline? It’s very hard to consider what he did to be abusive. The question is ‘Did he have authority to strike the horse?’ If not, then perhaps he should be reprimanded. Lose his job? Never.
You can’t blame the horse for his actions.
Caprio has had three trainers already this year. It’s impossible to say for certain that it’s due to the horses behaviour, but any form of punishment and discipline (or lack of) seems to have little influence over his actions.
I have little doubt that Caprio doesn’t consider humans his equal. He’s the boss. By not punishing the horse directly after the one (or two) incidents at Brighton, it only reinforces these beliefs. Some of you may not like it, but we are the boss in this sport.
Why should we bow down to the Animal Aid brigade? These people may have their heart in the right place, but do they see horses as an individual species with seperate behavioural patterns, or just another animal?
They may understand political correctness, but do they understand the horse?
The romantic bond between horse and man is based on respect. When that respect is challenged, especially given the circumstances that we are the trainer, then we must show them that we are dominant.
Just because “Animal Aid” types as you call them may wish to capitalise on this incident, it does not make it right to condone it.
Steady on – I think you’ll find I’m a little way off condoning the actions. I was musing over what other courses of action presented themselves in the given situation. You have suggested withdrawing the animal as one, and I think that would have been pretty high on my list as well, as it happens. That sounds a lot like a consensus being reached. Lovely jubbly.
gc
Adoptive father of two. The patron saint of lower-grade fare. A gently critical friend of point-to-pointing. Kindness is a political act.
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Any video’s of this please?
I had a bet in the 3.00 Brighton but missed the incident
Hypothetical scenario.
Handler leading up New Approach to the stalls at Epsom on Derby Day. The horse has been a bit unruly and given him a butt with his head and now tries to take a bite.
What should the stalls handler do?
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Hypothetical scenario.
Handler leading up New Approach to the stalls at Epsom on Derby Day. The horse has been a bit unruly and given him a butt with his head and now tries to take a bite.
What should the stalls handler do?
Its part and parsel of the job, he should just take the horse aside and calm him/her down in its own time then give it a pat on the head make it feel loved and comfortable then put it in the stalls
just read an article reporting that caprio dropped kingscote on the way to the start as well, as his other antics,and that has behaved badly on 2 previous outings.
seems to me the horse has a problem no-one has picked up yet , for instance back problem or teeth, horses are defensive not aggressive.he should just take the horse aside and calm him/her down in its own time then give it a pat on the head make it feel loved and comfortable then put it in the stalls
No disrespect to Mr Wilson, but it’s this kind of fluffy thinking which is the problem ~ the concept of making horses feel loved is, as such, a misguided notion based on anthromorphism. Horses are not our babies.
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Horses may not be our babies but there put on a bridle and rode round a track and whiped for our pleasure and profits. I think they are wonderful animals and people can become easily attached and I would like you to post that statement again Mr Rory after you’ve trained a horse for years that sadley loses its life over jumps and you have to come home with an empty box and im sure you wouldnt be saying what you did. You clearly have no feelings towards horses and im sure your one of the bunch who cheer when a horses falls correct me if im wrong but you’ve given your self a bad look here.
Horses may not be our babies but there put on a bridle and rode round a track and whiped for our pleasure and profits. I think they are wonderful animals and people can become easily attached and I would like you to post that statement again Mr Rory after you’ve trained a horse for years that sadley loses its life over jumps and you have to come home with an empty box and im sure you wouldnt be saying what you did. You clearly have no feelings towards horses and im sure your one of the bunch who cheer when a horses falls correct me if im wrong but you’ve given your self a bad look here.
I don’t know where to start with this ignorant drivel, so I won’t bother.
Its part and parsel of the job, he should just take the horse aside and calm him/her down in its own time then give it a pat on the head make it feel loved and comfortable then put it in the stalls
With respect, Mr Wilson, that is one of the most ill informed posts I have read on any forum in a long, long time. I’m sorry that you don’t understand how to deal with horses, if you did you’d soon learn that letting a horse get away with being violent like that is the quickest way to turn it into a very dangerous animal indeed – one that is capable of inflicting serious damage on humans and animals alike.
Your comments to Rory are also ill-informed – trust me, he knows more about having horses he loves very seriously injured than I’m sure you ever will.
When I commented on this incident last night I had read no more than the posts on this thread. Having read the report in full today – the horse had already bitten the stalls handler twice and headbutted him as well as putting a girl in hospital – I feel that the stalls handler should certainly be let off unconditionally. No stalls handler should have to put up with being bitten and headbutted – any more than any schoolteacher should! It certainly is not "part and parsel [sic]" of the job.
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By punching an angry horse is only going to wind it up more
Please show me where I advocated "punching" an angry horse.
Don’t worry, I’m sure the stalls handler involved will be delighted to learn that you’ve offered to deal with all the vicious ones for him – he’ll be glad of your undoubted expertise on the subject.
Its part and parsel of the job, he should just take the horse aside and calm him/her down in its own time then give it a pat on the head make it feel loved and comfortable then put it in the stalls
With respect, Mr Wilson, that is one of the most ill informed posts I have read on any forum in a long, long time. I’m sorry that you don’t understand how to deal with horses, if you did you’d soon learn that letting a horse get away with being violent like that is the quickest way to turn it into a very dangerous animal indeed – one that is capable of inflicting serious damage on humans and animals alike.
Your comments to Rory are also ill-informed – trust me, he knows more about having horses he loves very seriously injured than I’m sure you ever will.
When I commented on this incident last night I had read no more than the posts on this thread. Having read the report in full today – the horse had already bitten the stalls handler twice and headbutted him as well as putting a girl in hospital – I feel that the stalls handler should certainly be let off unconditionally. No stalls handler should have to put up with being bitten and headbutted – any more than any schoolteacher should! It certainly is not "part and parsel [sic]" of the job.
So is it just a case of the stool handler getting revenge?! or is this ‘pat’ on the nose going to solve its problem and teach the horse a lesson it’ll never ever forget?
…and of course a "pat on the nose" won’t teach a horse a lesson it’ll "never, ever forget" – hopefully it’ll start getting those types of lessons at home, or be put to sleep since it appears to be clearly dangerous.
However, a sharp slap should be enough to make it think again in a hurry.
excuse me ‘stall’…and well spotted.- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.