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Was I the only one to find the first race commentary almost impossible to hear because of the background noise. Drove me nuts. Thought McGrath was desperate and did they have to show the opening sequence twice. It was bad enough the first time.
Quite liked the feature from Kimble, though they could have shown more of the action. Hope those who have never been pointing will want to join us pointers before the season ends. Kingston Blount on Saturday anyone?
Craig – I’d time warp them all together, and I think Richard did call a charity race a few years back. Peter was as knowledgable as you’d ever find, and Mr O’Hehir’s accent was wonderful. RP always comes across as someone who’s been both sides of the sport, I wonder if he ever rode……
Pringles anyone
( Sorry, apparently Pringles aren’t Crisps, I’ve just been told )
I’m just relieved they never asked Coleman to do racing…..
My favourite horses - Red Rum, Spanish Steps, Proud Tarquin, Esban, Go-Pontinental, Barona, Charles Dickens, The Dikler, Astbury, Black Secret, Vulgan Town, Huperade, Well To Do, Crisp, Quintus, Argent, Colebridge, Pearl Of Montreal, Nereo, Sonny Somers, Tubs VI, Tartan Ace, Red Candle, L'Escargot, Bula, Beau Bob, Rouge Autumn, Rough Silk, Frodo, Deblin's Green, Prince Tino, Eyecatcher, The Pilgarlic, Captain Christy, Mr Midland, Interview II, Credit Call, My Virginian, Flush Of Diamonds, Scout, Money Ma
Quite liked the feature from Kimble, though they could have shown more of the action.
Didn’t see the feature from Kimble to be able to comment further, but I presume it centered around State Of Play’s owners William and Angela Rucker, who were there to race Honest Endeavour (ridden by Angela) in the Ladies Open?
If so, there’s a very good reason why you didn’t see more coverage of the Kimble racing than you did – the Ladies was the second race on the card and I watched the BBC crew, John Parrott et al all bugger off straight after the presentation for that race.
Hope those who have never been pointing will want to join us pointers before the season ends. Kingston Blount on Saturday anyone?
Not for me – engaged elsewhere. Catsfield on Sunday is looking a strong possibility, though, and probably Penshurst the following Saturday.
gc
Adoptive father of two. The patron saint of lower-grade fare. A gently critical friend of point-to-pointing. Kindness is a political act.
Craig – I’d time warp them all together, and I think Richard did call a charity race a few years back. Peter was as knowledgable as you’d ever find, and Mr O’Hehir’s accent was wonderful. RP always comes across as someone who’s been both sides of the sport, I wonder if he ever rode……
Pringles anyone
( Sorry, apparently Pringles aren’t Crisps, I’ve just been told )
I’m just relieved they never asked Coleman to do racing…..
I think everyone agrees David Coleman would not have made a great horse racing commentator!!! Great broadcaster in his day, though. Apparently he did not get on with many people…
As to Richard Pitman being a rider…presumably you are not being ironic but I think I can say without being unfair no jockey of his era rode better horses compared to the amount of talent he had as a jockey. Bula, Pendil, Crisp and Lanzarote come to mind.
Craig
Re:
Didn’t see the feature from Kimble to be able to comment further, but I presume it centered around State Of Play’s owners William and Angela Rucker, who were there to race Honest Endeavour (ridden by Angela) in the Ladies Open?
No it "featured" Waley-Cohens with a winner – Buckby Lane. Maybe because the BBC had interviewed them (angle "last week Cheltenham, this week Kimble" sort of thing) and their horse had conveniently won the first race they felt no need to stay any longer?! Maybe saving some money – if the BBC pay hourly rates!!! It was more of a generalisation of pointing – John Parrot having to get suitable clothes, children having fun on inflatable slide, bits of the actual race and the W-Cs enjoying their day.
I quite like McGrath – his voice is comforting and although he makes some mistakes he is an institutional commentator in the sport.
No it "featured" Waley-Cohens with a winner – Buckby Lane. Maybe because the BBC had interviewed them (angle "last week Cheltenham, this week Kimble" sort of thing) and their horse had conveniently won the first race they felt no need to stay any longer?! Maybe saving some money – if the BBC pay hourly rates!!! It was more of a generalisation of pointing – John Parrot having to get suitable clothes, children having fun on inflatable slide, bits of the actual race and the W-Cs enjoying their day.
Noted with thanks! That must have been arranged at short notice, then, as my understanding was the Waley-Cohens would have been at Dingley on Easter Saturday to run Roulez Cool and Tay Jay Vay. At least that meeting being rained off two days earlier due to waterlogging gave all parties the chance to take in Kimble instead.
gc
Adoptive father of two. The patron saint of lower-grade fare. A gently critical friend of point-to-pointing. Kindness is a political act.
Craig – don’t I just envy someone who rode the likes of the ones you mentioned! Lanzarote and Bula, wow! An old timer like me daydreams back to the golden era, Pendil v Captain Christy v The Dikler. I used to really dislike High Ken for what happened to Pendil at Cheltenham.
My favourite horses - Red Rum, Spanish Steps, Proud Tarquin, Esban, Go-Pontinental, Barona, Charles Dickens, The Dikler, Astbury, Black Secret, Vulgan Town, Huperade, Well To Do, Crisp, Quintus, Argent, Colebridge, Pearl Of Montreal, Nereo, Sonny Somers, Tubs VI, Tartan Ace, Red Candle, L'Escargot, Bula, Beau Bob, Rouge Autumn, Rough Silk, Frodo, Deblin's Green, Prince Tino, Eyecatcher, The Pilgarlic, Captain Christy, Mr Midland, Interview II, Credit Call, My Virginian, Flush Of Diamonds, Scout, Money Ma
The trio of Peter O’Sullivan, Julian Wilson and John Hanmer remain the classic commentating line-up for the National, despite their respective flaws, due to their longevity in the roles. I doubt we’ll ever see an unchanged line-up for that length of time again.
John Hanmer was always my favourite. As a viewer you could usually clearly see who was at the head of the field. What I wanted to know was information about the midfield and backmarkers, which John invariably endeavoured to provide. I was always willing Julian Wilson to shut-up and hand over as soon as possible after Valentine’s.
If I had the choice to assemble my own team for the race (from the current roster) it would be:
Simon Holt (Grandstand)
Richard Hoiles (Fences 5-9 / 21-25)
Martin Harris (John Hanmer’s Sectors)....and you've got to look a long way back for anything else.
I have been watching a few of the old Nationals on YouTube this week and I completely agree about Julian Wilson. Hanmer was left with only two fences after Valentines at times.
I also saw a clip of Tommo standing next to Rummy’s grave. He was part of the radio 2 commentary team in 1973 with Michael Seth-Smith and Peter Bromley and says that Peters commentary that day was one of the best he has ever heard. I don’t suppose anyone has a copy of it.
As for now I was a big Simon Holt fan and thought he should have been given the job by ITV but to be fair to Hoiles he has been an admirable replacement. To add to those two I’d go for Stewart Machin, possibly my favourite commentator at present.
Completely agree with VtC, the camera positions should never have been messed with.
I particularly liked the head-on shot as the field approached the Anchor Bridge crossing, as you could see right back to Valentine’s. Towards the back of the field there were often refusals and unseated riders at the final ditch which you would never see with the current angles.
....and you've got to look a long way back for anything else.
Simon Holt and Darren Owen would be part of my Grand National team without question.
I’d love to see Gareth Topham one day get the nod. He’s a smashing commentator and a great guy to boot. I am slightly biased as he helped me out a lot during my ill fated attempt to get into point to point commentary 14 years ago, but he’d still smash it given the chance.
The 83 GN appeared on my Twitter timeline recently, so I watched the race back on YT.
The standard of commentary was, frankly, well below current standards. All that seemed to happen was mentioning the first three at any time, totally missing nearly all of the fallers, unseats and pulled ups, never mind any mistakes or bad jumps, not even mentioning half the field and also stating horses that were out of the race as still in it! Shambolically bad.
Yes, I did like John Hamner’s voice, and the cliche ‘they’re going a ferocious pace as they cross the Melling Road and it’s over to John Hamner’ is a much cherished meme amongst a few of my friends, but they failed to grasp the purpose of the first circuit is to identify which horses were out of the race and they missed most.
I know all you nostalgia lovers in here can’t have a bad word said about your dear beloved commentators of your youth, but they were all pretty poor when it came to spotting anything but the horse in front.
Well, ok they weren’t perfect, but just don’t throw away generalisations and think your’re going to get away with it. I have checked the commentary in detail.
“All that seemed to happen was mentioning the first three at any time” – That is plainly wrong and a big exaggeration. To mention more than half the field in a set of four fences would take too long, there has to be a compromise.
“not even mentioning half the field” – 32 of the 41 runners were called at some point during the race.
“totally missing nearly all of the fallers, unseats and pulled ups” – Of the 31 non-completions, 20 were correctly identified, so wrong again.
To break that down –
Fences 1 – 3. John Hanmer identifies all 4 casualties correctly.
Fences 4 – 8. Julian Wilson identifies 4 out of 6 correctly (although does call Duncreggan Kilcreggan).
Fences 10 – 12. John Hanmer identifies the only horse to exit the race here correctly.
Fences 13 – 16. Peter O’Sullivan only identifies 2 of the 7 casualties at The Chair and misses the 2 pulled up at the Water, including the remounted Canford Ginger.
Fences 17 – 20. John Hanmer identifies 5 out of 7 of the backmarkers exiting the race.
Fences 21 – 25. Julian Wilson correctly calls the 2 casualties.
Fences 26 – 28. John Hanmer correctly identifies the final 2 horses to exit in his sector.
Fences 29 – 30. Peter O’Sullivan fails to mention Hot Tomato’s fall at the last when tailed off, but to be fair the leaders were halfway up the run-in by then.John Hanmer – 86%
Julian Wilson – 75%
Peter O’Sullivan – 22%“stating horses that were out of the race as still in it” – One horse – That’s It identified by PO’S having already fallen at the third.
“they failed to grasp the purpose of the first circuit is to identify which horses were out of the race and they missed most.” – The statistics above prove you are wrong.
I would suggest you get your facts right before throwing around wildly inaccurate statements.
....and you've got to look a long way back for anything else.
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