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Jack Kennedy says he sees him as a stayer in his interview, but said he will leave that decision to connections.
Hmm I don’t think we can be sure yet that Grand Jury and Hollow Games are better than Elixir d’Ainay and Longhouse Poet.
I agree Ginto will likely stay at this trip as Gordon’s best one- Samcro, Envoi Allen- usually does.
“Who havent we seen?”
I don’t know all the horses in the WPM stable, like the horse yesterday winning at Tramore, had you heard of him before? We haven’t seen any of the CPS horses yet eitehr.
There are plenty that have won maidens that haven’t stepped up yet. Would you have been as hot on Ginto after his maiden hurdle debut?
“Envoi and bob are at a different level” to ginto is as bold a statement as me saying ginto wins this easily? What evidence do you have that ginto isnt going to be better than envoi? Hes won that as easily as envoi did, in a better field… whats your basis for saying ginto hasnt?”
As Jack Kennedy has just alluded to he’s basically a stayer, he’s even mentioned the AB in that interview. Envoi and Bob wouldn’t have been mentioned for the AB in a month of Sundays. They were simply put, classier, sharper horses. Not necessarily better in the long term.
“who beats him? And why?”
I mentioned we’ve not seen plenty actually race beyond maiden company yet hints i don’t have a strong conviction yet, but i wouldn’t be jumping on a horse winning the race “easily” yet.
Not taking offence here at all, as i say everyone likes a bold view, but to say a horse wins this easy with such little evidence to go on seems OTT to me..
I’d say where he goes might depend on the ground, but heavily in favour of him rocking up here.
Twitter: Jackh1092
Hindsight is 20/20 so make the most of it!A shame he swerved the Naas G1, maybe he’s not that good. I still think Sir Gerhard would be his best chance in this.
A shame he swerved this, maybe he’s not that good. I still think Sir Gerhard would be his best chance in this.
You’ll have to go back some way to find Willie’s runner in a Lawlor’s that won at the festival that year.
Wouldn’t be too bothered bar the fact he might have a setback as he was entered.
Had Grand Jury 10 or so lengths back in a bumper…
Twitter: Jackh1092
Hindsight is 20/20 so make the most of it!Gordon Elliott said before today his target was the Albert Bartlett. He will watch the race again talk to Jack Kennedy and owners then decide. He goes straight to Cheltenham.
Albert Bartlett still a definite possibility then.
The Ballymore is more often a test of speed than stamina, ham. Does Ginto look that type to you? Lovely big horse but i will also he against him if he runs in this race.
In Ginto’s defence, Denman who was a quite similar type, was quick enough for this race.
This myth that the ballymore is a speed test always makes me laugh, virtually every horse that runs/wins it nowadays ends up a stayer or was touted as staying chaser prior to this, its 2m5f round a testing track, that takes getting and theres no chance of a crawl as ginto will just do what he did today…
If elliott has ginto/hollow games/gerri colombe as his top 3 and hes just had a decisive winner in the best recent grade 1 prep race for this, why would he leave himself short in the race he typically sends his best novices to samcro/envoi etc, its nailed on he comes here, hollow games will probably be good enough to come close in the AB anyway as the betting suggests, but he absooutely wouldnt win this…
As for his speed, my opinion after rewatching is he was to quick from the last to the line for them, i dont see him wanting another 4f personally yet, and running him in the graveyard AB seems unlikely to me. The ballymore is an extra furlong on todays race, its not shorter… seem to be forgetting that
And id say me saying ginto winning this easily is more likely at this stage jack than assuming theres a lurking maiden winner from mullins yard, theres plenty of evidence through the form IMO hollow games/eric bloodaxe/nells well, etc, thats decisive grade 2/3 form there to firmly put ginto as a proper novice grade 1 horse regardless of todays result, that just adds to it, i dont mind you underplaying it saying its premature, but the evidence currently is plentiful for me to come to the conclusion, and hopefully, we get to see it unfold without injuries!
I mean of course you cant be sure they are both better than those two grass, but youd like to assume that running to 140-145 in a novice grade 1 would be pretty standard and thats what they are and have been, id have ginto running to 152-154 today and lto, 2nd and 3rd most certainly ran 140-144 and that should be confirmed next week, i dont think he improved from his grade 2 win because he didnt need to, id have him about 4-6lbs off close to a certainty in this, which looks more than capable to me for more pressure, may not need that unless one of jacks superstar lurkers appear…
Good luck guys
“In Ginto’s defence, Denman who was a quite similar type, was quick enough for this race.”
He wasn’t though, he finished second
Like most of the stayers that run in this race
Most of the recent winners (Bob ollinger, envoi, samcro, Willoughby Court, York Hill,faugheen) were genuine 2 and a half mile horse that generally had a good bit of speed
The future staying chasers like ginto generally run well but get beat
Pulled the trigger on Dysart Dynamo at 9/1. Could run in the Supreme but his first appearance on track was a bumper over 2 and a half which possibly suggests Ballymore more likely.
Obviously you can’t take distances beaten as gospel but DD beat Grand Jury by a lot further than Ginto did, albeit in a bumper.
I thought this years renewal of the Lawlors was worse than last season but Ginto is obviously decent. If he runs here then he’ll probably have a lead and would be staying on at the end
Journey With Me could improve 20 pounds after that last run but you look at a lot of Mahler’s and they’ve performed well on the New Course but hated the Old Course
I still hope they send Three Stripe Life here
Could mean very little but PPBF have cut Dysart to 7s fav and pushed Sir G out. Also pushed Dysart out in the supreme. Seems like the yard close to Ruby and co have taken a view or had a nudge nudge..
Twitter: Jackh1092
Hindsight is 20/20 so make the most of it!Ff, what evidence is there currently that ginto is a staying chaser? Because jack/gordon said they think 2m4 is his minimum? But also in the same interview he said he stacked them up round the bend, so which one is it, he stacked them up and used his speed to burn them off? Or he put them to the sword over 2m4…. Watching the race back 20/30x i dont see the the staying chaser in him as what won the race, i see stacking them up and just far too much toe for them
A sire typically known for his 2m-2m4 progeny… douvan/min/jonbon/friend or foe etc
I think its premature to assume that 2m5f isnt far enough for him…
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