- This topic has 87 replies, 22 voices, and was last updated 17 years, 1 month ago by
.
- Posts
I mentioned this thread to my daughter last night; she, like me, has always been politically left of centre…the first thing she said was that none of us actually knew what Obama was like or what he would achieve, and that no one becomes president of America without a ruthless streak. We all want him to be the real deal, a beacon of light at a time of uncertainty, but as someone who shed tears of joy when New Labour were elected I’m not holding my breath. Also, at a slight tangent, when we were all protesting about the war with Iraq, thinking that the Armed Forces would be in agreement with us, a friend of mine who lives near an army base pointed out that the squaddies and their families felt insulted by our attitude, and felt it undermined what they were doing. We all have opinions in life, but we tend to arrive at those opinions coming from different angles. And none of us know how our opinions might change if something traumatic happened to us. A touch of The Emperors New Clothes perhaps.
And none of us know how our opinions might change if something traumatic happened to us. A touch of The Emperors New Clothes perhaps.
Yes, like having your family cluster bombed ’cause theres oil under your house.
And none of us know how our opinions might change if something traumatic happened to us.
I think with most people opinions change with age and I don’t mean that in a patronising way.
In youth you think you can change the world but as you age pragmatism takes over. As you experience life you soon realise life is not black and white – very much a murky grey.
I know my views have certainly "mellowed" over the years and although I still hold many strong views on many topics I, hope at least, I can now see others perspective as well.
Craig why are you apologising? You are as entitled to your opinion an anyone else thats what freedom is all about.
Craig, people who tend to be offended are those that are trying to defend indefensible or illogical views.
Absolutely agree 100 percent with that, bang on.
Craig why are you apologising? You are as entitled to your opinion an anyone else thats what freedom is all about.
It scares me a little that people (especially in the UK) jump to conclusions that if you do not like a figure who is non-white, you are labeled a racist or told you are bigoted (something someone in the other thread has still not explained or retracted)
Craig.
.. what other thread ??
I don’t read through every thread on the forum, but I would be interested in that one.
There’s a lot to be said about keep your own council.
.. what other thread ??
I don’t read through every thread on the forum, but I would be interested in that one.
There’s a lot to be said about keep your own council.
Dave,
I think Craig is probably referring to the Liam Treadwell / Clare Balding thread in the Racing area.
Marble,
Admit it dear boy, you loved every minute and relished the telling
I’ll leave it to those with a PhD in PPE to determine a link between your tale and the "neo-con, fascist, right wing and hate mongering" as I freely admit a connection evades a dimwit like me.
The only "moral" I would draw is quite simple: if forced out at weekends then don’t approach groups of young men in city centres after dark particularly if both parties are pissed-up, but preferably remain at home with an improving book/lady/chap/vid until something resembling urban civilty resumes with the dawning of the working week.
‘Twas ever the case – neo/archaeo con, fascist/communist, right/left, love and hate
You’re young; you’ll learn
Spend a week as I have just done "alone in the bee-loud glade" with Wainwright.: contentment and peace-of-mind abounds. Why the need for SSRIs?
TGI Monday
Anyone wanting to continue the raging ‘debate’ that attached itself to the Clare Balding thread, can do so here…….
OMG I cannot believe it.
Are we getting the words Clare Balding and Mass Debate together, well their is a first time for everything.
Here is an insightful article on the right-wing extremists of both right and left, and the actual underlying reality, Craig. The first few paragraphs and the concluding paragraphs are the key ones.
Unfortunately the Link doesn’t work, Grimes.
To all the people who think Obama is a shining beacon of liberty, justice and virtue and how could I possibly be so "hateful" towards him. The following is why: This is part of a memo from his "friend" Janet Napolitano, a document from the Department of Homeland Security about who should be observed by law-enforcement and why in the United States of America.
"Right wing extremism in the USA can be broadly divided into those groups, movements and adherents that are primarily hate-oriented and those that are mainly antigovernment, rejecting federal authority in favor of state or local authority, or rejecting government authority entirely. it may include groups and individuals that are dedicated to a single issue such as opposition to abortion or immigration."
1. So, from this you are now a right wing extremist in the eyes of Obama’s government if you fail to recognize the authority of his Government and do not share his Governments stance on abortion or immigration. Those three beliefs do not equal a right wing extremist and it is not fair to people of those beliefs to be tarred in a government document as one. But under the Obama government, as you can see, dissension in not well tolerated in the Obama Government.
"Proposed imposition of firearms restrictions and weapons bans likely would attract new members into the ranks of rightwing extremist groups, as well as potentially spur some of them to begin planning and training for violence against the government. The high volume of purchases and stockpiling of weapons and ammunition by right wing extremists in anticipation of restrictions and bans in some parts of the country continue to be a primary concern for law enforcement"
2. The second amendment assures ous of a right to carry a firearm and most states allow one to defend their selves, their family and property with one. Fact…more violent gun crime is committed by black people in the USA than any other race. Nothing is mentioned in this security memo about stopping their illegal gun use. Even with one of their own in charge, the violent crime rate among blacks continues to grow and I predict will do so throughout Obama’s term as he doesnt want to do anything that will in any way criticize his "brothers and sisters" who see him as one of their own. On the other hand, the good catholic family who are opposed to abortion but are law abiding citizens are to be suspected as right wing extremists and observed by the government!"
I could go on about how this memo also attacks returning veterans saying they are susceptible and willing to join right wing extremist groups.
But it comes down to this, under Obama, if you do not share the view of his Government and if you publicly stand against it, his Government is threatening to observe you and consider you as a right wing hate monger, just for disagreeing with the "chosen Messiah" who as we have sen on here, for no good reason, whatsoever, is highly regarded in the UK!Absolutely sickening. If this is Obama’s idea of justice and freedom, what a joke of a President.
Craig
"Right wing extremism in the USA can be broadly divided into those groups, movements and adherents that are primarily hate-oriented and those that are mainly antigovernment, rejecting federal authority in favor of state or local authority, or rejecting government authority entirely. it may include groups and
individuals that are dedicated to a single issue
such as opposition to abortion or immigration."
1. So, from this you are now a right wing extremist in the eyes of Obama’s government if you fail to recognize the authority of his Government and do not share his Governments stance on abortion or immigration. Those three beliefs do not equal a right wing extremist and it is not fair to people of those beliefs to be tarred in a government document as one. But under the Obama government, as you can see, dissension in not well tolerated in the Obama Government.
Craig, you appear to have obamaphobia and are reading things into it that arent actually said. If someone is
dedicated
to throwing their anti abortion etc views down other peoples throats then they are extreme right wing. I would believe that there are such groups where are plenty of hatemongering evangelical halfwits running about the states that really need to be controlled.
"Proposed imposition of firearms restrictions and weapons bans likely would attract new members into the ranks of rightwing extremist groups, as well as potentially spur some of them to begin planning and training for violence against the government. The high volume of purchases and stockpiling of weapons and ammunition by right wing extremists in anticipation of restrictions and bans in some parts of the country continue to be a primary concern for law enforcement"
2. The second amendment assures ous of a right to carry a firearm and most states allow one to defend their selves, their family and property with one.
Fact…more violent gun crime is committed by black people in the USA than any other race
. Nothing is mentioned in this security memo about stopping their illegal gun use. Even with
one of their own
in charge, the violent crime rate among blacks continues to grow and I predict will do so throughout Obama’s term as he doesnt want to do anything that will in any way criticize his "brothers and sisters" who see him as one of their own. On the other hand, the good catholic family who are opposed to abortion but are law abiding citizens are to be suspected as right wing extremists and observed by the government!"
I would suggest that the majority of gun crime is perpetrated by people in impoverished inner city areas, most of whom, happen to be black, rather than gun crime being endemic of the coloured populus. I notice that you use the term "one of their own", and perhaps you dont realise but you appear to be a somewhat paranoid racist Craig. You dont see Obama to be an "american like yourself", but a "black like them that are black".
Also the 2nd amendment which suggests the right the bear arms is clearly outdated and and needs to be gotten rid of. No reponsible person would have a gun anywhere near them, and especially if they had a family. A high proportion of the nations retarded will say "But we need them to protect ourselves"…From what? More Guns? If guns are prohibited then controlling firearms and firearm related crime becomes so much easier for police. There will still be gun crime, much as there is here, but nowhere near what there is in America.
There seems to be no shortage of people in america who shouldnt even be left alone with a box of crayons, but they all have the right to have a gun, that IMO is absolutely ridiculous, and any government which allows that is irresponsible.
I could go on about how this memo also attacks returning veterans saying they are susceptible and willing to join right wing extremist groups.
But it comes down to this, under Obama, if you do not share the view of his Government and if you publicly stand against it, his Government is threatening to observe you and consider you as a right wing hate monger, just for disagreeing with the "chosen Messiah" who as we have sen on here, for no good reason, whatsoever, is highly regarded in the UK!
Absolutely sickening. If this is Obama’s idea of justice and freedom, what a joke of a President.
I dont think we see him as any messiah, it’s just that we in the UK are largely not right wing hatemongers, and think that trying to control such people rather than letting them run amock, is a responsible move, but I can see how you might feel threatened by him though.
They run a lot of documentaries here going over to america and speaking to the nations retarded hate groups (louis theroux speaks to some right weirdos and I believe the Borat movie didnt do america much advertising either). Only the other week I saw an episode of Top Gear where Clarkson and Co almost got linched by a load of rednecks in Alabama because they, as a Good TV making prank, wrote pro Hilary Clinton, pro homosexual, and anti nascar slogans on their cars, as part of their challenge.
Its worth a watch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2syY12OP … DF042A9514
The sooner these people have their guns removed the better for themselves and others IMO.
Fact: He can barely speak a sentence without hestitation unless he has a handy teleprompter and his "public speaking voice" falls apart under pressure and turns into his natural accent. Yet the media tell us he is "The great communicator, the anointed one who will make us understand the error of our ways, etc."
I must admit I didn’t follow the original thread but this is spot on.
It is almost as if he is always desperately searching for the ‘right’ thing to say – perhaps he needs to after his Para-Olympics gaffe when perhaps a little of the real Obama came through. Whatever their overall merits if Obama and Clinton were making speeches it would be like comparing a selling plater with a Group 1 winner.
What some people see as hesitation when speaking, is in actual fact a person who thinks before he speaks, unlike some people I can think of.
I would rather someone chose their words wisely and moderately than someone who just talks the talk but has no substance about them.
Being a great orator does not maketh the man. Clinton might be an accomplished public performer but in private I think he lacked certain moral fibre befitting of a truly great leader. That’s not to say I dislike the guy. Give me a Mandela type of person any day.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.